Conquering Erebus I: The begining of a FfH series

[Ichabod]

Introduction
Round 1 (Turns 0-55)
Round 2 (Turns 55-152)
Round 3 (turns 152-236)

Hello fellow FfH players,

I decided to start a series of games to showcase this amazing mod that added a whole new dimension to my Civ IV experience.

My objectives with these series are many:

First, to have fun, because that's what games are for.

Second, I'll love the advice of the more experienced forumers, not only with gameplay advices, but also with some (or even better, a lot of) help with the lore and history of FfH. I intend to play these games with some roleplay flavor, seeking different objectives according to the leader and trying to demonstrate what's unique about them. I don't know much about the lore, so I expect comments to help directing the things we'll be doing in each games (what religions to go for, what techs...).

Third: I understand that the last patch brought a lot of changes to the AI, so I'll help giving feedback with the things I'll find in these games.


So, without further ado, let's get to the game:

I started a game in emperor difficulty, standard size Erebus map with 9 leaders. No tribal villages is checked and the leader was randomed.

We got Os-Gabella of the Sheaim (forgot to take a screenshot)!

So, I'll post the starting position here. I'd like to give some of my insights about the leader, the civ and the objectives we'll be trying to accomplish in the game, but I'm running short of time, so I'll do it in another post. Guess we'll be looking forward to raising the Armageddon Count, founding Ashen Veil, bringing the Infernals to the game, killing the Good Civs and, last but not the least, ending the world .

Here's the start:

Guess I'll be settling in the desert hill with the ancient tower (the top blue circle). Don't want a lot of food plains diseasing my first city and settling in the desert with the new Barb AI is asking for trouble (the hill will compensate in the place I suggested).

But what do you guys think?? About where to settle and about the things to head for with the game? Feedback is very welcome.

P.S.: I'll probably play the first turns tomorrow.

P.S.: Sorry for any english mistakes, I wrote this in a hurry and It's not my first language.

 

[Ignorant Teacher]

Settings? Start save?

 

[Onionsoilder]

Looks pretty good. A quick note: Make sure to get some adepts with Sanctify(Life I promotion) before you summon the Infernals. Shouldn't be too hard since KotE is a prerequisite for Corruption of Spirit, though you will have to go out of your way to obtain Life mana. The reason for this is simple; should Hyborem spawn near you, hell terrain will spread into your lands. Now, hell terrain is usually equal; Broken Lands offers the same yield as Grassland, however Floodplains do NOT turn into Obsidian plains, so those nice floodplains will disappear should your Desert convert to Burning Sands.

Also note that the Infernals are not your ally. You may have the same goals(at least, for a time) but they will not be on your team and can decide to attack you on a whim, just like any other civilization. In addition, once Hyborem researches Malevolent Designs he can take over one of your Ashen Veil cities, likely your Holy City unless you move your capitol there. You may want to kill him before that, if you get the chance.

Your best unit is the Pyre Zombie, at Bronze Working. 20 of these guys can take down almost any defense, including 50 archers, just from collateral.

 

[Emptiness]

Guess I'll be settling in the desert hill with the ancient tower (the top blue circle). Don't want a lot of food plains diseasing my first city and settling in the desert with the new Barb AI is asking for trouble (the hill will compensate in the place I suggested).

But what do you guys think?? About where to settle and about the things to head for with the game? Feedback is very welcome.

I agree with that site for your capital. Claiming chokepoints with cities or forts is important when playing on the Erebus mapscript. Wine is very good, and you've also got an oasis. Research crafting so you can put a vineyard on the Wine.

You'll want to scout out the area south. That gold is attractive for a second city, but before you pick a place you'll need to find out if you're in a closed section, or if there's a second pass (which you would want to seal off). It's also possible that there could be a gap in the mountains to the west, so check that out too. Scout north only after these unknowns are explored.

Farm the flood plains, mine the hills, and when you get access to Water I use Spring to convert the deserts to plains and then cottage them. Running Aristocracy + Agrarian is very natural for this sort of starting area. Starting path I suggest is: Crafting> Agriculture> Calendar> Mining> Education> Code of Laws> Mysticism> Knowledge of the Ether.

 

[Onionsoilder]

Starting path I suggest is: Crafting> Agriculture> Calendar> Mining> Education> Code of Laws> Mysticism> Knowledge of the Ether.

I would actually recommend getting Agriculture first. It's cheaper than Crafting, and if he builds a worker right away it should be finished fight as he finished teching Agriculture. That means he can start irrigating several of those floodplains ASAP, as opposed to building one single winery. Depending on were he puts his second city, I might also suggest getting Education before Mining(If he places it by the gold, then Mining first. Elsewise, Education) because he needs to get some commerce tiles up.

 

[Emptiness]

You make a good point about Agriculture first; I often forget to factor idle worker turns into my teching.

I recommended putting off Education because I envisioned all the flood plains farmed, and so cottages wouldn't be needed until after getting Spring. Getting Education earlier and cottaging some of the flood plains would be fine, but if he goes with Aristograrian then he'll probably want to replace the FP cottages with farms later (to give food to support the plains cottage tiles).

 

[apenpaap]

Summoning the Infernals is gameplaywise not a very good idea. It's great fun, though, and you should really do it. And don't use sanctify. I find that a rather cheap trick.
You should really try to get the Prophecy of Ragnarok, as its a great boodst towards Armagedoon.
You should try to get as much Death mana as possible. With 5 mana sources, your Spectres and Wraiths will get reallyt scary. I'd also advice getting an Entropy source someweher, but if you're founding Ashen Veil you won't need it as Stigmata on the unborn gives it.

 

[Onionsoilder]

And don't use sanctify. I find that a rather cheap trick.

Cheaper than using Spring to convert Deserts? Cheaper than getting strength 10 Specters? Magic can be cheap, yes, but I feel it is warranted in this situation. If hell terrain spreads to those floodplains, they will be GONE. Completely gone... nothing but Burning Sands. I feel in this case, it's warranted.

 

[apenpaap]

I use Sanctify too, but not when I'm Sheaim.

 

[Ichabod]

Introduction:

Well, let's get this game going!

First, a brief introduction to our Leader and Civilization:

Our Leader, Os-Gabella

Spoiler :

She's an immortal woman who seeks to destroy the world to ease the suffering of her own existance...... Pretty Sweet, huh?

Her traits are Industrious, same as the normal Civ IV one, and summoner, an original FfH trait, that makes summoned units last longer. So, our mages powered by death mana will not only summon some nasty specters and wraiths, but we can actually summon them to attack the next turn, with doubled numbers... Nice!


Os-Gabella is one of the Sheaim leaders. The Sheaim are a civilization dedicated to end the world. So, one of our goals in this game is to raise the Armageddon Counter, even if this means some difficulties in our path to victory.

The Sheaim have two unique units:

The Eater of Dreams, which replaces the Archmages, with the special ability to consume population of a city to be able to cast another spell in one turn.

The Pyre Zombie replaces the axeman. They can be built without Training Yards and have the special ability of exploding when they die, causing collateral damage to the units around him. Very good units to capture cities without needing siege.

The Sheaim also have a special building, called the Planar gate, that gives a chance of units spawning each turn in the city. The chances of the units spawning raise based on the Armageddon Counter and the units that spawn depends on the other buildings in the city.

Our hero is Abashi, the Black Dragon:

Spoiler :

It's a very powerful hero, but it becomes avaiable very, very late, so it's going to be a long way before we can use him.


On to the game now:

It's seems that everybody agreed with settling in the desert hill, so I moved the settler there. Thanks to the Ancient Tower, we were able to reveal a lot of the map:

So, settling in the hill we gain some foodplains, wine and an oasis. But there are other options: 3N we could settle in the next turn and gain pigs and silk. I'll leave the situation open to discussion for the next few hours and I'll play it later based in your advices.

And, about Planar gates: when is the appropriate time to build them? Build it in every city or just the ones with better production? What do you guys think?

The starting save is attached. It's a standard Erebus map, 9 civilizations, Emperor with No tribal villages checked.

 

[Emptiness]

Three wines. Uh, yeah. Definitely settle on the tower. Scratch Agriculture first, get Crafting. You can build Warriors and then add in a Worker timed to come out the turn you finish Crafting. Growth will be very slightly slower than Agriculture first, but teching will be faster.

 

[apenpaap]

Here's how I (usually) start as the Sheaim:
1: Tech education. Agriculture is on the way there, so it gives both farms and cottages. If I start in a forested/hilled area I'll also go for early mining.
2: Beeline Corruption of Spirit. I usually play with a lot of civs on the map, so low amounts of Barbs, so you may want to do Archery or bronze working before this since you don't have so many civs.
3: Catch up on a few early economical techs
4: Infernal Pact for Sacrifice the Weak and Hyborem (Not wise gameplaywise, but a lot of fun).
5: Necromancy for Death Nodes, and Sorcery for Mages.
6: If I'm Tebryn, I'll usually concentrate on the magic line, if I'm Os I'll go for Malevolent Designs.

I haven't ever built or needed Abashi, though. Rosier, Mardero and Meshabber are much easier to get, and the three of them can rain doom on your enemies.

 

[apenpaap]

Then again, I play on Noble/Prince so you shouldn't follow my advice to much.

 

[Nikis-Knight]

I'd settle where you are and plan on a second city 1 north of that mountian up there to grab all the resources.

Then, when someone just beats me to it, I will hate them forever

 

[Onionsoilder]

Hmm... I would still settle on the tower. I would still go for Agriculture first, because you want to get a second settler out ASAP. I would try to get my second city 1 W of the peak in the middle there, to grab the incense, pigs and silk. Might be a little low on production, but it will be an excellent research city(when you found Ashen Veil, the holycity will also give you a science bonus, and it should be easy to get the holycity there)

I use Sanctify too, but not when I'm Sheaim.

Why? The Sheaim are not trying to turn the world into Hell. That's sort of a side-effect; the Infernal are NOT the Sheaim's allies.

 

[readercolin]

I would settle on the hill to get the wine and floodplains (lots of food, plenty of commerce, but little production). First tech, crafting, build a worker to come out about the same time as crafting finishes, and get those winery's asap (3 food, 3 commerce, four if on the river - great for boosting the early game). After that, I would tech agriculture/education, or Mysticism (your choice on which). If you Tech Mysticism though, build an Elder Council Asap, and start working a Great Sage, and then use him to bulb KotE.

Second City I would place one north, two west of the Pigs, to get 3 silk, Pigs, and Incense. This would also give plenty of trees for production, as well as a few hills. Third City to the south to get the gold and reagents - floodplains can feed that city, and the gold gives plenty of commerce. Get water mana later if you can to change those hills to plains.

-Colin

 

[Ichabod]

Round 1 (Turns 0-55):

After seeing the surroundings, we decided to settle in the desert hill where our settler were. Galveholm was founded:

Our techpath this round went: Crafting > Agriculture > Calendar > Education


I rushed the warrior to the ruins near the borders of Galveholm. If I could get him there in time before the first lizardman spawn, it would avoid a lot of trouble:

We did it!! MEssing with the new barbs, especially the lizardmen is tough, better to avoid it.



Soon, Alexis of the Calabim greeted us:

She is another evil leader, so diplomacy is a little easier. But we met here on turn 7, so she's probably very close. Knowing the erebus mapscript, her borders will probably block us from further expansion soon.


Meanwhile, the scout went south to investigate if there's a passage down there. A better look to that unrevealed area in the west of the desert showed that the mountains completely block it, so I ended up not exploring it with the scout (there was a hill giant walking near it).

The scout found a large tundra area down there. There are some resources, but the terrain is awful. I'll post sceenshots of the land in the end of the report.

There were some attacks against the scout: he killed one griffon and three wolves, earning the combat two promotion. Here he is after the griffon battle:

And I sent him to explore the north.



We timed our worker with the discovery of Crafting and started to improve the wines. Wines are one of the best early tiles in FfH, giving a nice commerce boost while being improved with a very early tech.

I left Galveholm undefended for quite some time while the worker was being built. But I had good sight of the surroundings and I could get the warrior guarding the ruins back to the city fast.



The scout, now exploring north, met his end with a giant spider:

He actually had good chances, due to having combat two, being in a forest and the attack crossing river bonus. Unfortunately, a highly promoted giant spider will be lurking that region now.



So, I was left without a unit to explore. Then, I realized that the ruins the warrior was guarding were gone. A calabim scout explored them.

Luckily, no nasty unit spawned and our warrior was able to go do some exploring himself.


He found:

Red borders... Alexis is indeed near.



Next turn, he moved to the ancient tower, giving us a better sight of Alexis land:

So, she founded her second city already... Guess that nice looking spot north of our capital with the pigs, silk and Incense will be ours



After researching education, I revolted to agrarianism (I farmed the floodplains to pump some fast settlers and the health will help us too) and Apprenticeship. So, I decided to end the round. Now, we have to decide what to tech next.

Our plan was to tech Code of Laws (Aristocracy) and beeline Corruption of Spirit to found Ashen Veil and start raising the Armageddon Counter. But, with Alexis being so close, maybe that's not the way to go. Maybe we can try taking her out with Pyre Zombies, since they're very powerful units.

So, we could go Mining > Warfare > Bronze Working. Mining first to reveal copper and build some mines. I suggest warfare so we could adopt conquest: our land is very low on hammers and I'm not sure we could build units fast enough... So, after teching warfare, I'd start building some warriors while we tech Bronze working and add some pyre zombies to the stack after it. 10 warriors + 10 Pyre Zombies should be enough to take 2 cities if we go fast enough (even better if we find some copper). What do you think?

Another option is to stick with the initial plan, tech KotE and Corruption of Spirit and attack Alexis with Rosier, Pyre Zombies and some adepts summoning skeletons.


I started building a settler in Galveholm (no hammers invested). Our army right now is composed of 4 warriors, a little low for a second city, IMO, but we can't waste time if we want that sweet spot north of the capital. Here's the city overview:

The worker is currently farming the third foodplain, so maybe we can reduce the settler building time in one or two turns. The unhealthyness is hurting us pretty bad.

If we keep building the settler, where should our second city go? I suggest the spot 1W of the mountain to the north of our capital. It's probably the best spot we can get, but things can change if we decide to go mining and find copper in a nice location. If we want to rush alexis, copper would be a great help, but founding a third city to claim it could slow us down too much.

So, here are some screenshots of the land:

North:

The desert:

South:

We can found at least two more cities in the desert to get all the floodplains, the gold and the reagents. Dotmaps are surely welcome.

So, we got some decisions to be made here: what to tech (code of laws would take 16 turns, mining 10), to rush or not to rush, where to settle our second city... I'll be looking forward for your advices.

EDIT: Dumb me! You need bronze working to be able to tech Warfare... So, my idea of techpath is impossible...

 

[Emptiness]

Research Mining next. Switching to Aristocracy will slow settler production. If Copper is available then attacking Alexis might be an option; if Mining reveals no Copper then I wouldn't attack for a while.

Building a city 1W of the mountain north of the capital would make for a nice city, but it would leave lots of worthless scraps of land around it. At least in my opinion, it's better to have two decent cities than one awesome one. Also, with war with Alexis likely, it would be better to place border cities on hills for the defense bonus. I suggest building the second city 3W of the Mountain. Additional cities can be placed 4N of the Mountain, and 3E of the Mountain. That will still cover all the plantation resources. Of course all these sites are subject to change if Copper is revealed, since you'll want to place your second city in range of it.

I'm not convinced that Conquest will be particularly helpful as a civic. Using it will require switching out of Agrarianism, and considering you plan to use Aristocracy too that will mean -2 / farm compared to the current amount produced. That's not going to be better than switching population to work mined hills. Of course, if Copper is available then you'll still want to research Warfare, for the City Raider promotions and to enable construction of Form of the Titan.

 

[Ichabod]

Research Mining next. Switching to Aristocracy will slow settler production. If Copper is available then attacking Alexis might be an option; if Mining reveals no Copper then I wouldn't attack for a while.

Building a city 1W of the mountain north of the capital would make for a nice city, but it would leave lots of worthless scraps of land around it. At least in my opinion, it's better to have two decent cities than one awesome one. Also, with war with Alexis likely, it would be better to place border cities on hills for the defense bonus. I suggest building the second city 3W of the Mountain. Additional cities can be placed 4N of the Mountain, and 3E of the Mountain. That will still cover all the plantation resources. Of course all these sites are subject to change if Copper is revealed, since you'll want to place your second city in range of it.

I'm not convinced that Conquest will be particularly helpful as a civic. Using it will require switching out of Agrarianism, and considering you plan to use Aristocracy too that will mean -2 / farm compared to the current amount produced. That's not going to be better than switching population to work mined hills. Of course, if Copper is available then you'll still want to research Warfare, for the City Raider promotions and to enable construction of Form of the Titan.

You got a good point about the city spots. FfH allows cities to be very nice even without many resources, so it's better to build more not so good ones then just a few with great land.

About conquest, I wouldn't adopt aristocracy if we decide to "rush" Alexis. Unfortunately, we'd have to switch of of Agrarianism, but I think that's the best way of making our capital have some production... But maybe i'm wrong (now that I actually tried to do some math I realized that there's a big chance of that being true)... The idea is to adopt conquest and military state, build some units and try to take Nubia and the capital quickly... Nubia is not build on a hill, so that's a start...

After that, I think alexis would be out of the game... we could tech to corruption of spirit and finish her of with Rosier....

 

[Onionsoilder]

Building a city 1W of the mountain north of the capital would make for a nice city, but it would leave lots of worthless scraps of land around it. At least in my opinion, it's better to have two decent cities than one awesome one.

That depends on the situation. Remember that his second city will likly be the holycity, and thus his science city. This means:

1) It will probably have an Academy and the Crown of Arkheim(+150% Research) so each commerce counts.
2) It will have Stigmata on the Unborn. Running Slavery and Sacrifice the Weak, you will be able to quickly whip hero units out of this city; giving your heroes a free Stigmata promotion is very useful. Alternatively, Sacrifice and Guilds in the late game will allow unlimited engineers.
3) Alexis will get some more settlers out soon, which may prevent you build building the second one of those mediocre cities.
4) Similarly, you would have to wait longer for the payoff with two lesser cities.