COTM51 - Final Spoiler

[civ_steve]

COTM 51 Final Spoiler; Game Submitted

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How did your Russians do? Victorious I hope!

 

[Yilar]

Entry class: Predator
Game status: Spaceship Victory for Russia
Game date: 1610 AD
Firaxis score: 3959
Jason score: 6765
Time played: 07:51:50

Not having horse (or salt!) was a real let down, because it would have made killing extremely slow, so I opted to go for the rather boring space win. My early curragh ended up sinking near mongols to the barb island (6 galleys was just to much), so it took a while for me to get contact with the remaining civs. That probably cost me a few techs trades as I entered MA same turn as inca.

I killed off china and mongols in the early IA as I did not have iron for rails. After that the game basically went into ending turns and getting techs every 4 turns. I know I'm doubtfully gonna get a medal as I left the remaining civs way behind in techs and couldn't trade with them. When I launched my Spaceship the other civs were only in the beginning of IA.

 

[eldar]

Predator, Diplo in AD1420.

I honestly don't recall much about how the game went, except that the vast distance to anyone (and a complete lack of Horses and Iron AND Saltpeter) put me off pursuing a military-type win. I did wipe out the Mongols late on but was happy to build otherwise.

Game status: Diplomatic Victory for Russia
Game date: 1420 AD
Firaxis score: 3895
Jason score: 7211
Time played: 13:25:20

 

[djrules5454]

Entry class: Open
Game status: Cultural 100K Loss to Germany
Game date: 1975 AD
Firaxis score: 997
Jason score: 943
Time played: 08:41:11

This island filled up fast on me. I should have been more proactive at settling to my east. I couldn't see where the computer civs were getting their saltpeter, and I was well behind in every aspect because of it.

 

[Spoonwood]

Entry class: Open
Game status: Cultural 20K Victory for Russia
Game date: 1953 AD
Firaxis score: 2115
Jason score: 2735
Time played: 25:07:22

The Moscow list reads:

palace-3900 BC
temple-950 BC
library-470 BC
Cathedral-1285 AD
University-890 AD
Colosseum-450 AD
Research Lab-1804 AD
The Great Lighthouse-90 BC
The Oracle-1075 BC
Sun Tzu's-330 AD
Copernicus's Observatory-880 AD
Shakespeare's Theater-1140 AD
Newton's University-1280 AD
Universal Suffrage-1455 AD
Hovover Dam-1752 AD
Theory of Evolution-1585 AD
The United Nations-1800 AD
The Manhattan Project-1888 AD
Cure for Cancer-1912 AD
Longevity-1936 AD
SETI-1842 AD
Heroic Epic-1802 AD
Military Academy-1946 AD
WAll Strett-1816 AD
Battlefield Medicine-1810 AD
The Internet-1868 AD
The Mausoleum of Mausollos-510 BC
Knights Templar-650 AD

I think I fought two unsucessful wars with the Mongols... both of which I started, but failing to steal tech from the Mongols... to spawn a leader. I think the first one I tried to attack with coassacks, but that didn't work out so well. I don't think I lost any cities there. The second one I think I tried to mostly defend with infantries, but that ended up worse and I ended up losing a good-sized city in the east before I made peace. The third war involved tanks on my part, where I re-captured my city, spawned a leader, and basically owned the Mongols. We had plenty of oil and rubber. This allowed me to finally build The Heroic Epic.

I didn't have iron until the modern age. I couldn't trade for it, and didn't acquire it by force. I think I could have founded on a spot down near China and I had planned on doing this later... but I soon got iron once I finally realized this. Not having iron meant that even after Shakespeare's Theater Moscow had something like only 22 shields. Consequently, after finishing Newton's it basically took me the *entire* industrial age to build Universal Suffrage, TOE, and Hoover's Dam. Of course once I got iron Moscow had some 80 shields after rails, since it took me a turn or two to rail all the tiles around Moscow/mine some previously irrigated tiles to do this. I had lots and lots of workers waiting by to rail Moscow immediately once I got iron... really for centuries.

As I said before I think I could have traded for iron in the middle ages at one point, but I didn't thinking I'd still have that option later. So when you miss The Colossus, The Great Library, have slow growth in your 20k city and only a moderate amount of shields, you don't have rails until the modern age, nor do you have a factory until the modern age, you don't have The Heroic Epic until the modern age, the 1953 finish date makes a lot of sense. C'est la vie.

 

[TheOverseer714]

Wow, for once I was going military when everyone else went peace. Actually, I had planned for a Diplo victory, but things went wrong. I built the UN, did the vote. I actually got 2 votes, but an abstention by a 4th party ruined my majority. By the next election, I had been sneak attacked by back-stabbing party #1(Polite) who had an MPP with back-stabbing party #2(Gracious) who then declared on me during the sneak attack. WTH! Anyway I then went for a Domination. Best-laid plans always seem to go wrong for me, and I limp home with an unintended VC. Admittedly, it does beat losing...

Entry class: Open
Game status: Domination Victory for Russia
Game date: 1872 AD
Firaxis score: 2908
Jason score: 4025
Time played: 44:27:21

P.S. I forgot to mention my Republic was at war repeatedly, including using Longbows guarded by Crusaders as my primary military units against Keshiks. Getting those Horses and Iron was a grind, since the Mongols pwned China, I had to defeat the most powerful nation to get basic resources.

 

[Più Freddo]

Predator class, Domination victory in 830 AD.

Not even 10'000 Jason score.

 

[Nata]

OK, we launched it, even so the date isn't spectacular:

Game status: Spaceship Victory for Russia
Game date: 1700 AD
Firaxis score: 3027
Jason score: 5617
Time played: 15:55:06

For the entire game we were struggling with the research rate, as we didn't grab enough territory initially and I wanted a peaceful game. Which was actually the easiest way to play it, with lack of resources.
So despite Copernicus and Newton and SETI in the star city, despite the Internet and all those universities, commercial docks and hospitals everywhere, we still slugged at 5-6 turns through Industrial and Modern Ages.

We got about a half of our home continent and a small Horse island far off, that's it. Some of it we got through culture flips, some after a suicide attack of Mongolians who, along with China, hardly got into IA by the end.

We were able to trade for Iron and Saltpeter from Germany and for Horses from China (until we got the Horse island) throughout the game, starting from mid-MA. We traded for all the lux in the world until sneak attack of Vikings in Modern Times captured our unprotected city, and when we retook the city next turn it triggered some Mutuals. But war happiness compensated for it.
So it was an uneventful game, with unsatisfactory research rate which we'll try to practice in the games to come.

 

[MarleysGh0st]

Game status: Diplomatic Victory for Russia
Game date: 1780 AD
Firaxis score: 3165
Jason score: 5199
Time played: 22:58:18

Putting my entire report in this thread:

All those missing resources were a nasty, nasty surprise!

I settled in place.

Research track was Alpha.->Writing->CoL->Philo., which I got in 975 BC, but didn't get the Republic slingshot, so I had to research that the hard way. Even after researching that in 30 AD, I delayed the revolt to complete a couple more settlers, finally entering Republic in 330 AD. I moved into the Middle Ages in 400 AD.

The barbs weren't a real problem. Some warriors posted on southern hilltops kept most of them away from that side of my territory, while those east of the chokepoint divided their attention between me and the Mongols and Chinese, who were pushing up through the jungles.

China started a war with the Mongols in 530 BC that lasted until 370 AD, then the Mongols started one against the Chinese from 640 to 790, which gave me lots of time for some peaceful expansion. I declared war on the Mongols in 880, driving them out of the jungle by 1130.

In 1285, I enter the Industrial Age and get Steam Power as my bonus tech. And I have coal! Great, I can build railroads now. Except that the game won't let me? What fiendish new twist is this? Oh, yeah--I still don't have iron.

I did trade for iron and saltpeter at various times, but those trades never lasted very long. I went to war with China in 1315, captured their iron in 1335 and then horses in 1385. With some traded saltpeter, I built Cossacks, whose victories started my GA in 1405, in the same turn that China was destroyed.

I attached the Mongols again in 1520, destroying their remaining cities by 1550.

All this time, the other nations had been completely peaceful, as far as I had seen. American changed this with an attack on the Vikings in 1550. This war slowly spread and the Inca and Germans allied with the Americans and the Iroquois allied with the Vikings.

Rather than trying to cross the ocean for a tedious domination victory, I decided to try diplomacy. I entered the Modern Age in 1745, got Fission as my free tech and started the UN. That completed in 1778, when I spread some resources around, plus a couple MPPs, to ensure all were polite with me. The UN vote in 1780 gave me the German, Inca and American votes for a diplomatic victory. Oddly enough, the Iroquois, who lagged far behind in technology, ended up the second largest faction and gained the vote of their Viking allies.

 

[eldar]

Oddly enough, the Iroquois, who lagged far behind in technology, ended up the second largest faction and gained the vote of their Viking allies.

Ooh, now I recall some more details about my game. It was very tight on who was going to be my UN opponent - my initial guess was America. However Germany also had a lot of population. The Iroquois didn't have as much territory as either and were my "friends".

However when it came to adding up city sizes (which is how to initially determine UN opponents), the Iros came out just ahead!

 

[Paul#42]

Entry class: Predator
Game status: Cultural 100K Victory for Russia
Game date: 1470 AD
Firaxis score: 5869
Jason score: 9157

Phew. Finally got the most exhausting vc complete.

Don't remember much from the start but I played the whole game in republic and used engineers to build culture.
Stopped research after Railroads and Replacable Parts (Chose AT and Electronics by reflex upon ToE... ) and warfare after only Iroquois and Vikings were left.

IIRC I defeated Mongols with archers, China with horses and Incas(?) with knights before I finally got salt...

Ah, I also recall I got an early worker from a hut and my research had started Pottery - Alphabet - Writing - CoL - Philo - Republic (slingshot - around 1100 BC). Left the Ancient Times late at ~600 BC.
I had started building libs early to speed up research and went for Astro to trade for salt. So captured ToA had no effect for me...
Pyramides were on the other continent so I early knew I'd have to settle there, too for a decent 100k attempt.

I never switched to Feudalism because I wanted to avoid the long anarchy.
Building culture with engineers went quite well also and cash rushing in Republic was a nice feature, too.
At one time, the Vikings attacked me and caused some trouble because I had weak military all the time. But stupid AI made defense easy and I could sign peace after losing just five towns and two armies but killing a bunch of cavs and longbows...

I stayed comfortably 100 tiles under the domination limit resulting in a rather low Jason score...
I wonder how a switch to Feudalism would have changed the victory date...
Feudalistic pop-rushing culture anyone?

 

[PrinceMyshkin]

Entry class: Predator
Game status: Conquest Victory for Russia
Game date: 1110 AD
Firaxis score: 5105
Jason score: 8806
Time played: 24:13:37

This was a tough but very enjoyable game on a very challenging map. I moved my settler sw because I had calculated I could grow Moscow to size2 one turn earlier and still get my second scout out on the same turn as settling in place. I blew it, however, by promptly clicking road instead of irrigate first on the floodplain. I would have been better off settling in place. I went straight for the republic sling-shot after pottery and got it, but lost several turns just before my granary completed when disease struck reducing Moscow to size1. I also had a bit of trouble with a barb camp to the west that cost three warriors before it was tamed. I did pop three techs and some cash with the scouts and mapped out the continent, but only had 2 contacts by 1000BC. My QSC was a weak 6 towns, 14 citizens, 3 workers and 4 warriors, a granary and barracks, but I was a republic 3 turns from lit still lacking MM, poly, currency and construction.

Things started getting better and I built a second granary by the fish and a third by the game to the east. I finally made the MA in 430BC after building some cheap libraries drawing engineering as my free tech and then went straight for military tradition still with only 2 contacts. This delayed the barb stacks quite a bit and by the time they arrived I had already started settling towards China and had several archers and warriors that picked them off as the tried to reach my cities. I had started a war with the Mongols allied with the Chinese and this lasted a long time with China eventually getting the upper hand. A galley finally made its way across the west in the BC's and I made several contacts, but contact with Germany came very late. Tech pace was slow and I was still 4 turns from invention with only 16 towns at 10AD.

I finally connected a trade route and traded with China for horses and built several but didn't use them as I wanted to save them for upgrade to Cossacks. I got Military Tradition in 540AD, but still didn't have a source of saltpeter and the only sources I saw were in Germany who didn't even have a harbor. Phony wars did lead to a lot of dow's and I had 4-5 sources of war happiness most of the time. Since I still lacked strategic resources I built about 20 longbows and sent them in ship chains to the south to finally take out the Mongols and secure a source of horses of my own as the trade route with China proved to be unstable. This took a while, but the Mongols were finally defeated in 720AD, the same turn I completed navigation. I sent the longbows to the west, destroying a few small towns of the Iroquois and Americans securing another source of horses, a source of iron and finally a source of saltpeter. I turned research off and then upgraded all my horses to Cossacks and suddenly the game got a lot easier.

I went for the strong Americans first even though they had muskets, while at the same time also starting on the Vikings. I got my first leader in 920AD and then things sped up even more. Cossacks acted like cavalry most of the time, but blitz insured a lot of promotions and at least 5-6 times a single Cossack was able to clear 3 defenders and take a town on its own. The Vikings were gone in 960AD, the Inca in 990AD, and the Americans in 1000AD. Just before that the Chinese finally got chivalry so before they could get riders I did a little RoP rape on them and they were the next civ to go in 1050AD. By now my Cossacks had generated 6 armies and I started on Germany and Iroquois at the same time. They both had a lot of units, but were no match for armies and cossacks and in 1080AD Germany was gone and the last Iroquois city was taken in 1090AD, but they escaped with a settler. My caravels killed their galley next turn and a conquest victory occured in 1110AD about 40 tiles from the dom limit.

A fun and challenging game. I was somewhat mesmerized by going after the Mongols first to get their horses and iron and I do believe a much faster conquest would have been possible by chaining to the west early to secure resources and going for navigation before going for Cossacks. I think I'll back off pursuing conquest-only victories and start looking for the best victory and improving my scoring some.

 

[ignas]

Domination limit reached in 590AD.

Settled in place and went for Republic slingshot ASAP (learned Republic in 1325BC).

Killed Mongols with few archers in late BC's and secured horses.

Learned Chivalry in 210 AD and stopped researching. Then just horse->knight upgrade, connecting/disconnecting iron.

MoM and Great Lighthouse was handbuilt in order to get a well timed Golden Age in 70BC.

 

[supersova_SU]

Open
Domination 990 AD
Firaxis 5851
Jason 9488

 

[Lanzelot]

A little late, but better late than never... As I already finished COTM53 and there's still a week to go before COTM54, I thought I catch up a bit on my writings and report an interesting parallel here between GOTM81 and COTM51:

As I said in the GOTM81 spoiler, right after the end of the game I had the idea, that it might have been much better to send units north via galleys instead of marching through the jungle. This idea was still fresh in my mind, when I started playing COTM51, and it didn't take long to realize, that this map also called for this kind of strategy: a long stretch of jungle separating Russia from Mongolia/China.

After seeing that we had neither horses nor iron, the following plan was conceived:

1. Build archers and galleys, make a RoP with Mongolia and ship over a good amount of archers
2. Take Karakorum with a SOD, use the remainders of the SOD to take 2-3 more cities including their horse-town (and hopefully 1-2 size one towns in the following peace deal)
3. Hopefully a leader will emerge, which can rush the FP in Karakorum
4. Set up a second core there and use it as a spring board to China (who had the iron)
5. Because of the ship chain my units would get to Mongolia/China three times faster than their units to my homeland.

The first step was completed perfectly: already around 200BC I had a stack of 9 veteran archers and 1 spearman positioned next to Karakorum. My secret service told me that Karakorum was guarded by only two regular spears. It was the only productive Mongolian town, all others were still size 1-2, so taking it would certainly break their backbone.

But phase two was a disaster: the first 7 archers died, leaving 2 red-lined elite spears in Karakorum! The next archer killed the first spear with ease and got promoted to elite itself. But the final archer again died!
There was one single hit-point standing between victory and complete failure of the entire strategy. I figured, next turn the Mongolian elite spear would be completely healed again, and then my single archer wouldn't stand a chance anyway, so I took the last straw and attacked with my spearman as well. Of course it died, too... And of course in the interturn a Mongolian horseman killed my last archer.

Here is the second parallel to GOTM81: in that game a single hitpoint prevented the Russians from taking Berlin (which saved the game for me...) and here a single hitpoint prevented the Russians from taking Karakorum (which kind of ruined my game).

So the result of that war was: a stack of ten units lost for nothing. The war with Mongolia turned into a long-drawn struggle (with quite a bit of WW). It took a couple of centuries, before I had another stack of sufficient size assembled at the coast and took one or two coastal towns (of course they wouldn't give me another RoP...), and it was not before I had Longbows that I finally managed to advance to Karakorum and the horse grazing lands.
The end result: domination in 1320AD

My question for you is: did I attack too early? (One more shipload of archers could have made all the difference.) Who of you would not have attacked in that situation? It was: 9 veteran archers against 2 regular spearmen in a size 4 town on a hill (no walls).

 

[civ_steve]

Hmm ... regular Spears, fortified (+25%), on a hill (+50%), so an effective defense of 3.5. I would expect to lose about twice as many hitpoints, so I would think 6-7 Vet Archers should be enough to capture, on average. Even with promotions to Elite.