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Courthouse Tax Etc 420AD

Discussion in 'Civ2 - Game of Democracy II' started by GaryNemo, Nov 17, 2002.

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Tax? Courthouse? REGIA CIVITAS? Misc?

Poll closed Nov 20, 2002.
  1. A. Keep Tax 30%, Science 70%, Max Science? (R)

    9 vote(s)
    90.0%
  2. A. Bump Tax 50%, loosing Octavia's Point was tragic?

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. A. Bump Tax other%, see my post?

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  4. Spend whatever it takes to eradicate the Barbs (R!)

    9 vote(s)
    90.0%
  5. Spend the $38 or $50 on the BFL Caravan (R!)

    6 vote(s)
    60.0%
  6. Spend even $85 if we decide to disband Roskilde now?

    2 vote(s)
    20.0%
  7. Spend even more, beyond small productive IPRBs?

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  8. C. Elysium to definitely complete a Courthouse. (R)

    9 vote(s)
    90.0%
  9. C. Elysium to definitely complete a MarketPlace.

    1 vote(s)
    10.0%
  10. Elysium to then start a unit (otherwise improvement)

    1 vote(s)
    10.0%
  11. E. RC starts a Dip or Caravan after Mike's, then perhaps Marco (R)

    8 vote(s)
    80.0%
  12. E. RC starts a Settler after Mike's, then perhaps Marco

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  13. E. RC builds the Dip, then Mike's, then ... see my post

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  14. F. Explore the island South of Elysium! (R)

    10 vote(s)
    100.0%
  15. F. Explore what? Turn that Trireme back East!

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  16. G. Penguin Flats: Warrior to explore Pole, Westwards?

    9 vote(s)
    90.0%
  17. G. Penguin Flats: Warrior to explore Pole, Eastwards?

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  18. G. Penguin Flats: Not a Warrior, see my post?

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  19. H. Maybe prebuild a Crusader, I say where in my post

    2 vote(s)
    20.0%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. GaryNemo

    GaryNemo Settler from None

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2002
    Messages:
    1,237
    Location:
    Ohio, GMT-4
    We have a treasury of 400 gold, and gain 25 per turn.

    REGIA CIVITAS: Diplomat 0/30 in 4, then Mike's!
    Elysium: Courthouse or MarketPlace 58/80 in 4 turns.

    The Duke has pointed out in Turn 420AD that due to Elysium's Copernicus Observatory, a Courthouse will yield 6 Beakers and 1 Tax, where a Marketplace has a current yield of only 3 Tax. We have abandoned the idea of moving the Palace to Elysium. A Courthouse has twice the payback of a Marketplace at this time, and in other governments a Courthouse provides some benefit in all cases. Even if the detailed calculation is slightly flawed (see posts in earlier threads somewhere, by MonkE and Talar), it will eventually be so, so let's build the Courthouse first and the Market second.

    Investing $38 or $50 in the BFL Caravan is a profit item, not an expense. The Elysium Wine it releases will surely pay more than a paltry $50 when it is delivered into Viborg or Trondheim Demand. If anyone wants to download and decide if $38 will work, it can save us $12 and cost us no time. If you are the slightest bit unsure about this, then vote for it, trust me.

    Please vote Monday, or early Tuesday.
     
  2. Octavian X

    Octavian X is not a pipe.

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2002
    Messages:
    5,428
    Location:
    deceiving people with images
    I would suggest we keep up our current research rate, yet spend all monies neccesary to pay back those barbarians who destroyed Octavia's Point!
     
  3. Zwelgje

    Zwelgje Deity

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2001
    Messages:
    3,953
    I want the warrior from Penguin flats to go west to see if the Indian continent is connected to the pole!

    I'd like to see a crusader in Aonia and maybe also in Boreum. These provinces are well roaded and when the crusader stands in a good spot it can come to the rescue of any city in the province under barb attack. I agree that buying the barbs is also quite effective but it costs us so much money and we don't need that many legions...
     
  4. Leowind

    Leowind Emperor

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2000
    Messages:
    1,236
    Location:
    Eugene, OR, USA
    You didn't post info about what tax changes would do to our cash flow and science rate. I'd like to keep science maxed, but with many potential expenses on the table (briging barbs, bribing cities, IPRB) could understand an argument for increasing tax. Seeing none yet, and none explained in GN's first post, I'm going to go with science 70%. Yes to building a Crusader or two to help protect our homeland, just as Civ1 suggested. Hi reasoning for exploring the pole West makes good sense, too, so I'll go along with that as well :)
     
  5. MonkE

    MonkE Primate Philosopher

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2002
    Messages:
    343
    Location:
    Minnesota, USA
    Even if we wanted to raise the tax rate, it would be better to delay at least 4 turns until Monotheism is finished and Mike's can be built. After that, it may be beneficial to raise taxes temporarily to raise funds to buy Viking cities. :mischief:
     
  6. Jayne

    Jayne Emperor

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2002
    Messages:
    1,070
    Location:
    Worcs UK
    As changing your vote is becoming the fashion - I'll jump on the bandwagon (although I disapprove of it usually)

    I wish to change my vote from:A. Keep Tax 30%, Science 70%, Max Science? (R)

    to:A. Bump Tax other%, see my post?

    I know it makes no difference to the outcome of the vote.

    Changing tax from 30.70 (38 gold, 6 turns science) to 40.60 gives 47 gold (+9) but still 6 turns for science. Extra money, and still get Mono at the same time
     
  7. GaryNemo

    GaryNemo Settler from None

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2002
    Messages:
    1,237
    Location:
    Ohio, GMT-4
    Chat w Mr President re: Taxes and Timing.

    GaryNemo (8:09 AM) :
    I have 45 minutes, which may be better spent developing and posting the detailed micromanagement...
    MonkE (8:10 AM) : Ok.
    GaryNemo (8:10 AM) :
    Btw, the earlier you play tonight, the more feasible it is for me to come in and post the summary late tonight.
    Do you have the game loaded? there is one thing we can decide...
    MonkE (8:10 AM) :
    I've just started reviewing the latest posts. I'll load the game ... Loaded.
    GaryNemo (8:11 AM) :
    Since RC is Diplomat in 4, I think BFL Caravan in 3 will work perfectly. Saves $12. ?
    GaryNemo (8:12 AM) : RC Dip is IPRB=10 $6 of course, so Dip in 4 turns. Mono in 4 turns. Mike's on turn 5.
    MonkE (8:14 AM) : BFL Caravan in 3? How much $?
    GaryNemo (8:14 AM) : a $lot. $38?
    MonkE (8:15 AM) :
    Did you see Jayne's post on the tax rate? 40-60-00 still gives 6 turn tech.
    MonkE (8:16 AM) : Yes. $13 + $25 in BFL.
    GaryNemo (8:16 AM) :
    Maybe after a few turns. I don't trust all of the rounding. After 2-3 turns, then try tax increase. BE SURE Mono on 4th turn. (Or earlier, but not later)
    MonkE (8:17 AM) :
    There was a surplus of beakers left over last time.
    GaryNemo (8:18 AM) :
    Well, they apply to the next science, city by city. Only a Caravan Delivery on the last turn of a discovery results in wasted beakers.
    MonkE (8:20 AM) :
    Yes. The 6 turn number is unrelated to the current beaker total, IIRC. Just the number required divided by current production.
    GaryNemo (8:21 AM) :
    That makes sense, but I still would not change the tax rate before moving. Maybe after 1 or 2 moves. The BFL IPRB ...
    MonkE (8:22 AM) :
    In my OCC games, I always check beakers the turn before getting the tech and adjust tax rate as needed.
    MonkE (8:23 AM) : BFL IPRB seems Ok.
    MonkE (8:23 AM) :
    Especially if you say it works perfectly. :)
    GaryNemo (8:24 AM) :
    Yes, BFL: wait one turn, IPRB=30 $13, then 40 $25. So two more turns, on the third turn it completes. Thus cash requirement is deferred a turn.
     

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