Deity early rush. 6-7 CBs can take a capital at t80-85

[glory7]

After playing several games (deity level, pangea) , I noticed that there are very small number of wars (even zero) around the world till t100 and AIs build lots of wonders.

i tried tradition 3-4 cities and it seemed that AIs get stronger (in terms of units) after t100 and they had lots of trade routes up. I could manage to win, but I felt like I was missing something.

So I used my favorite GK tactic, liberty fast expo CB rush. Without lux selling, it's hard to get upgrade money, so instead of 6-7 CB upgrades like in GK, I did 3 CB upgrades (CS meeting gold, ruins, lux and embassy gpt selling). Other than that, I hard built CBs. And the best part of the change is now you are 99% sure that you can get pyramid, as it requires liberty and not that many AIs take that path.

Basic tactic is

SP: liberty open - left side - citizenship.

tech: ignore writing. pottery - mining/archery/animal - masonry/lux techs - bronze - beeline CB - get sailing when you get first caravan (so that you can get one more) - horseback - up to you

Cap BO: scout - monument - granary - archer/worker/shrine - archers till you can build pyramids, caravan when you can set a route to other civ - settlers (depends on how many unique lux around and how many good spots are available. usually 3-5 cities are good) - CBs and horseman and go.

expos: monument - granary - shrine if needed - units

I tried this strategy 3 times and for all time I could get the first cap before t85 and next one around t100-110. AIs just don't have enough units! I don't know why, but I DoWed the first victim and killed his 5-6 units with 2-3 CBs and well-placed front city. After that, there was no units for him... I just took the cap.

I am not sure about this, but I guess the reason this works is

1. with caravan, you get like 4 spt so your tech is not slow - actually faster than GnK early rush. Since deity AIs have lots of techs that you don't know, you will get big spt bonus (1 spt per 2 techs that he knows but you don't know - for early games, it's like 7-8 techs). Even in pangea map, make sure you finish sailing when you can make trade routes to other civs.

1-2. In many cases, they are far from you so you need to make expo so that you can reach them in 10 tiles - another advantage of early expos. Moreover, this will make AIs to set up trade route with you more likely. See the 1st screenshot - I am getting 20 spt out of trade routes. I have 1 lib only (cap...). 3 of them are mine and 2 of them are from AIs - each route gives 4 spt. Yes, I am behind the tech, but I got weapon to kill you anyway.

2. Without river/ocean gold, AIs do not have gold to buy units - they have "usual GnK" army size only when lots of trade routes are up. So when you attack them with CBs around t70, they do not have army.

3. Especially for mid-game and after, if you bribe AIs to DoW it seriously cripples AI, as they rely on trade routes for gold.

Attached 2 screenshots from the previous game as Zulu (their UA and UU are awesome...). I ReXed after getting pyramids and killed Moroco around t90 and Assyria (this guy had honor 5, but made too many UU that cannot attack units so it was easy) at t114.

 

[OmniPotent42]

Interesting...did it work in rough terrain/jungle cities, though?

 

[glory7]

Interesting...did it work in rough terrain/jungle cities, though?

I haven't checked this thread for a while - yes it works, but it takes more practice. My recent Zulu guide provides more details.

 

[vanzlmalc]

My experience with deity in BNW is almost opposite. While there are some games where CB rush works, in MOST of my games AIs have CBs by turn 55, pikes by turn 75 and knights by turn 90 so i always end up waiting for XBows or even arty before DOWing.

It's a good guide for when the CB rush is viable.

The big question for me is how to recognize situations where CB rush will work.

 

[gberetfr]

The big question for me is how to recognize situations where CB rush will work.

I used this strat effectively in some of my games. And I assumed it will work because the target civ was shown as the worst civ in term of soldiers in the demographic screen or very low when you get the "civ with pointiest sticks" pop up. And most of the time it pairs with the fact that this weak civ has built early wonders (all the more reasons to go teach him that your civ is the righteous one...!)

 

[tommynt]

obviously is killing 1 civ not that hard - just by harrasing it ( like stealing early workers/settlers) and killing units with a forward city and some archers it will be very easy to leave it with like nothing to defend.

BUT

After this your position isnt that much better as when just going tall with 4 cities ...

Winning militaristic is possible, winning scientific is easy.
Thats the major difference.

 

[vanzlmalc]

obviously is killing 1 civ not that hard - just by harrasing it ( like stealing early workers/settlers) and killing units with a forward city and some archers it will be very easy to leave it with like nothing to defend.

BUT

After this your position isnt that much better as when just going tall with 4 cities ...

Winning militaristic is possible, winning scientific is easy.
Thats the major difference.

Well sometimes killing one civ can be very hard. Sometimes they just bend over when you steal their workers but sometimes they will settle in your face, build a huge army and kill you early. I recently stole a worker from Incas. I could not make peace and they planted 2 cities towards me. At around turn 100 they had 16 Xbows, a pikeman and a musket in my borders.

 

[FrostK]

Well, there is nothing very new here. So it is not a problem to get 1 AI - but there is no garanty that he will build any good wonders. He can get GL i.e... Also you are unlikely to get AI like Haiwata, Aztec due to terrain. Rome and Greece can be nor easy too.

Also I see u have religion - I guess you got desert forklore. In general it is impossible to found religion on deity if u go for war. And without religion... u know.

Anyway it is nice start, but I think noone loves u and u'll get no RA. How are you going to finish this game? (You probably can get 1 more AI with crossbowmens, but then?)

P.S. last time I tried deity-pangea as Assiria, took 2 AI and gave up around 140 turn cause I had low science, happiness and gpt.

 

[Moriarte]

The only problem with this strategy is: you have to be really creative to stay in positive happiness after killing two civs early. I won few games with very similar strat. and build order, but also quit a couple after i realized that whole world hates me and all they do is spam units and send them my way. I find "slow" domination much more manageable on deity, lately.

It is fairly easy to tech. fast with deity AIs concentrating on faith and tourism in BNW, even if you neglect writing/education, but happiness is very hard to come by on some maps and the world hate isn't helping there. Maybe i am missing something.

 

[Maxym]

I have not gone for deity Dom yet, saving for Assyria and Shaka, but I have given up early rushes completely. I might still DoW some annoying forward settling AI if I see an unescorted settler, but find it easier to just trade and build up my four cities and small defense force. Then either an XB or arty "rush" but without hurry as the new deity is more leisurely if not next to Shaka.

 

[kcbb]

what is expo?

 

[Browd]

Short-hand for expansion city -- any city you found after founding your capital.