Depose...aaghh! help!

[kanu254]

hi,

i love civ 3 up to this point its a great game..one problem i have is the cities i capture depose my government in matter of 2 turns after i captured..is there anything i can do? i mean 2 turns i don't have nuff time to do anything..and one more thing what does the culture in a captured city mean..it says something like 255/6000 does that mean its 255 my culture or their culture thanks!

 

[pravda]

WOW

I hope someone comes to reply this thread, because I also always get diposed, no matter what i do, my last attempt to keep the city i took over, was to place 10 immortals garrisoned there, thinking surely this kind of strength should work, no way, a few resisters gave up, but then I was diposed again.

It seems worthless to even try, might aswell burn all captured cities down, unless someone here can help.

arrgghhhhh

 

[element|Z]

They deposit(or something) to the other CIV after you have captured it becouse they have higher coulture than you. The only way you can prevent this is to build up your own colture...

 

[Zannhart]

aaaaa

 

[Crazy Eddie]

I thought that the relative culture level was important - then a German city I'd capured revolted, followed 1 turn later by a city that revolted away from the Germans to me. So go figure. :crazyeyes

 

[benn]

Does having your own people outnumber the conquered people stop the loss of the city?
What if you had the city long enough for the new citizens to grow or if you brought 2-3 settlers and added them to each city you conquered?
Has anyone loss a city where their own citizens were in the majority?

 

[FullofHoles]

In my experience, a city apparently will never revolt if you have one military unit FOR EVERY SINGLE POPULATION POINT. Naturally, if you are capturing a size-12 city and you leave 12 units to guard it, a lot of your potential assault force gets diverted to guard duty. Sometimes just simpler to burn the city to the ground.

Two caveats: 1. Burning city to the ground FREQUENTLY results in some third-party civ rushing settlers into the gap and setting up a new city before you can. 2. That is one military unit for every POPULATION point and NOT just one for every RESISTER. You can get tripped up if the newly captured city grows in population so as to outnumber the guards you have left behind.

 

[benn]

FullofHoles:

Wouldn't the new citizens be yours though? They shouldn't be revolting.

 

[Machi]

the ratio 1:1 is simply :crazyeyes

you're saying that you need one soldier for every one person to quell uprisings?!? that ludicrous

a city with 12 pop points should shut up and stay calm with only 4 military units.

ok, maybe 6 but that's it, tops!



when fighting a way have atleast a few settlers already made and waiting so that you can escort them to the site of the city before any other civ takes advantage and then rush build temple, etc. If you time it right you can have a 6 pop city with atleast a temple in one turn! (by adding workers/settlers to the city) And they are all your own people!!

can't understand why more people don't do this! you are simply taking some of your people and asking them to migrate to newly acquired <cough> lands.

 

[pravda]

Well the reason I don't do that is because you can't rush build anything while there is resistance, and also if you build the population too fast with settlers, straight after taking a city over, then it will go into disorder through over population, then you can't build anything, and they go into starvation. Well that is what was happening to me, until i decided to never try that technique again.

 

[Cyrai]

It's not really that hard. What you should do when you're in the beginning of the game, occasionally let your cities build things like temples or libraries. Maybe it was just my game, but when I built a couple, other people quickly became admirers of my culture. I've captured more than half of China, with one unit stationed as defense, and rebellions end in 2-3 turns tops. And after that they become content citizens. And if anyone else were to capture one of my cities, my citizens would probably depose them.

What you should do is start a diplomacy with the people, and look at the information in the top right. I'm guessing that they are unimpressed or disdainful with your culture. That would make them revolt pretty successfully. Imagine if some random third-world country attacked whatever city you lived in. I don't think that you'ld appreciate being under their rule. That's because America, if this were Civ III, would have a much higher culture rating than the other country.

 

[benn]

Originally posted by Cyrai

What you should do is start a diplomacy with the people, and look at the information in the top right. I'm guessing that they are unimpressed or disdainful with your culture. That would make them revolt pretty successfully. Imagine if some random third-world country attacked whatever city you lived in. I don't think that you'ld appreciate being under their rule. That's because America, if this were Civ III, would have a much higher culture rating than the other country.

The problem with being deposed occurs even when your culture greatly EXCEEDS their culture. Also, it seems many of the people who don't think this is a problems are those who just raze the captured cities.

 

[Beeblbrox]

OK heres my tale of woe - and it blows most of the theories about how this works out of the water.

I am English at war with the French. I have masive culture score (25,000 - and all but 2 of the wonders so far up to industrial).

I capture a load of the French cities - leaving them with 3 cities left. Add to this the French have no wonders and a very poor culture anyway (they are in total awe of mine apparently - so says my cultural advisor, added to the fact I have assimilated 3 cities purely through cultural dominance)

I stack 13 (yes thats 13) Cavalry in Marseilles - a size 8 city - to heal ready for the final onslaught.

Then... you've guessed it - the governor in that city gets deposed and i lose the lot.

My only possible theory is that if the city goes in to disorder AT ANY TIME while it has resistors, you lose it. This may have happened in that city due to population growth - or because of quelling some of the resisors who became unhappy people.

I have no other idea what could have caused this. I am unrivalled in culture, and I had nearly 2-1 ratio of military units to people in that city. There were no French cities left under their control near to Marsellies, so assimilation through culture borders is not the key....

This is the one thing I am really unhappy about in Civ3. Surely if this happens your troops could run to safety or something? Leaving aside the fact that the whole idea of a peasant army of a few thousand could destroy 13 divisions of Cavalry is wholy absurd.

 

[Cubanmoogle]

I lost a whole army in a city once, it was crazy. I took Berlin 3 times before I finally gave up and razed the darn thing. Then I brought a settler and built a city there, before England could. That problem is outta hand though, I agree. Maybe if Firaxis revealed the exact circumstances in which the citizens depose it would be much easier.

 

[STAM]

Hi everyone, i came up with this problem yesterday. I did the following, but didnt have the chance to try it yet:
I edited the game's rules and added a new culture level (one higher than in awe of). The culture ratio to get to that level is 5:1 and i set the percentage of deposing to 20% when capturing the city and 10% later. Since those same percentages for in awe of are 40% and 30% i think it will help a lot, and it doesn't hurt that much the balance of the game since a 5:1 culture ratio is a huge difference and anyone managing to get that and a good military force at the same time should be allowed to keep those hard earned cities

 

[ainwood]

1.) What does the "deposing percentage" quoted in STAM's post mean? Does this mean that there is a 20% chance when you take a city that it will revert back to the former civilization, regardless of what you do?

2.) Has anyone tried immediately selling off the cultural improvements in the city? Sure, this will make people unhappy, but it will reduce the influence of the previous civ's culture (although in my opinion, this type of action should make the citizens MORE likely to revolt).

 

[OIS]

I wonder if defensive units will hold a city better then offensive units. I too have lost a city with more knights then the population... but is that cause they "only" have 2 defense? If I had pikemen or musketeers which have more defense, would that have helped? Cause it says you should use "strong" forces to quell resisters (and maybe to stop ppl from defecting)?

 

[STAM]

I'm not sure but i think the percentage i was talking about (i called it deposing percentage, i dont have the game here so i dont know how it's called in the editor) is the chance that the city will depose no matter what you do, and it's only related to the relative cultural strenght of the two civs involved. I think getting military units in a captured city only helps quelling the resistors. In my experience, i've often captured cities, quelled all resistors and after some turns had the city deposed. I think military units succesfully fullfil their task which is ending the resistance, but they have nothing to do with the city deposing. I also dont know if those percentages (chances of deposing) are continously recalculated through the rest of the game or only important a few turns after the city is captured. Anyway, i think that lowering the percentages to 20%-10% will make deposing of cities less frequent and annoying

 

[Arrian]

I have lost a city or two here and there in my games, but it generally isn't more than a nuisance for me, so maybe I'm doing some things you guys aren't. First off, here are the things that effect city defection:

1) Proximity to capitol (both yours and theirs) - A huge factor, according to Soren.
2) Culture the enemy has accumulated in the city vs. culture you have accumulated
3) Overall Culture
4) Happiness (or lack thereof)
5) Military units to quell resistance (this is clearly the least important, as I have held cities that were resisting w/o any units in them).

1st off, understand that if you capture a large enemy city right next to their capitol, the odds are (even if your overall culture blows theirs out of the water) that you will lose the city. If there is no reason to keep such a city (such as a key wonder), BURN IT. If you absolutely must keep it, for whatever reason, starve the hell out of it while it's in resistance - make everyone entertainers - this will drop the population and make it easier to control. Once it begins to grow again, the citizens will be of your nationality. Use beat up or older units to garrison it (with the exception of ONE good defender to hold vs. counterattacks). Keep the bulk of your army out of there, cut the roads so the enemy can't counterattack as readily, and be ready to re-take it if it defects.

If you are planning on conquering - plan ahead. You may need more units than you think. This is because you may lose some. Use bombard units (cannon/artillery). Even if you don't really need to from a military standpoint, these units will knock population points off of the target city. Smaller cities are easier to control. Also, stacking offensive units in a newly captured city is a bad idea.

Rushbuilding temples/cathedrals/libaries/universities as soon as resistance ends is fairly obvious.

Go after the capitol. When you destroy an enemy capitol, it moves to their largest remaining city. If this is further away from a city you actually want to take and keep, you have aided your cause.

Generally, my rule of thumb is this: unless a given city is going to be relatively easy to keep (fairly close to my capitol, small in size, close to other cities of mine w/strong culture, etc.), I raze it. I almost always raze capitols - this does bad, bad things to the enemy's culture. This does make for quite a bit of razing late in the game. Early on, you are often conquering close to home, and thus the cities are easier to keep. I have taken to bringing settlers along for my wars in order to build new cities on or near the shattered ruins of the cities I raze.

-Arrian

 

[VoodooAce]

Keeping units in a newly taken city quells the resistance. The more units you have there relative to the number of resiters will quell the resistance faster. If there are 6 resisters, you should try and leave 5 or 6 units there to quell it asap. One unit with 6 resisters doesn't mean the city will depose your governor, it just means it will take longer to quell them.

My personal strat when taking a new city is to starve the people into submission

Let them starve until the population is smaller and more 'controllable'