Deserts and Oasis

[Anima Croatorum]

Am I the only one that sees no purpose in deserts being completely useless? Should at least some improvements be buildable in deserts and oasis? IE. A windmill. It could simulate use of wind(lots of wind in deserts) to pump up water and irrigate. Also, whats the logic of no improvements in an oasis?

 

[Ranos]

I changed deserts to give 1 production and allow cottages and workshops. Tried to make it allow only cottages and hamlets, no villages or towns, but the only eay I could think of gave the game errors that made me change before restarting.

 

[Anima Croatorum]

What about windmills? Just think of Australia.

 

[Ranos]

I didn't edit that into mine (partially because one of the requirements for windmills is hills or raised terrain or something like that and partially because I am fine with just the two I modded in.

 

[Willowmound]

What about windmills? Just think of Australia.

Yeah, we're practically swamped by them

 

[Anima Croatorum]

Yeah, we're practically swamped by them

Of course you are, every farm in the middle of nowhere in Australian TV shows has one. And theres always a fire that threathens the farm, or a flood in the middle of the desert that drowns the lost sheep....

 

[Willowmound]

Of course you are, every farm in the middle of nowhere in Australian TV shows has one. And theres always a fire that threathens the farm, or a flood in the middle of the desert that drowns the lost sheep....

Lol that's funny! They're only crap electricity generating ones though, not really big enough to do much other than charge a car battery or two. At least that's my understanding. I have lived in the country, but never in Australia. Most people here are city dwellers, like me...

 

[Anima Croatorum]

Well, most deserts are windy, and they could either produce electric energy or pump water for irrigatin. It would be neat is they could turn a useless desert into a plot that generates something, not much, but anything beats nothing. At least they'd look nicer on map.

 

[Willowmound]

Yeah you're right, you could put windmills in the desert. However, how many windmills do you find in the Sahara, the Gobi or indeed in the Red Centre of Australia? Deserts are harsh, desolate places, and I think the game should reflect that. Matter of taste though...

 

[Anima Croatorum]

Think from another perspective. Australia is relatively unpopulated, whats the population? 25 mil? There's more than enough land thats more interesting. Once the population of Australia crosses 100 million making those deserts green will be a priority.

Sahara, whats the general level of infrastructure in the entire region? Very low. There are some works to stop the spread of desert and those do revolve around wind power and irrigating, also planting forests. A lot of those aid organizations are into such projects. If there were more money there'd be more windmills. Gobi is similar, there is absolutely no economic interest in it.

And then, look at Phoenix, Arizona. A desert that had been beaten back through irrigation. Because there were enough resources and economic interest.

 

[Willowmound]

Yeah, good points. I have actually been to the Sahara, and some places you'd be hard pressed to find a stabe spot in which to put a windmill. Sand dunes aren't all that good for building stuff on. Most deserts aren't like that though, and neither is most of the Sahara. I guess it would make sense if some late industrial tech allowed you to improve desert tiles -- late being the operative word.

 

[Yellonet]

What about giving desert a good (as in high) chance of revealing oil when you get the required tech (combustion?).

 

[ZippyRiver]

I don't think a windmill would do very well in a desert, namely because of grit getting into the moving part. One good sand storm and your windmill would be toast. Yes, I know not all deserts are of a sandy dune type. I do agree they should be able to be improved in some area though.

Sand is used in making glass, and that would be worth commerce or production. Perhaps give desert one gold and allow a workshop to be built there.

Not improving an oasis make sence. Anything you would do to the tiny eco system would probably destroy it.

 

[The Last Conformist]

People have been building towns and farms in oases since the dawn of civilization, so unimprovable ingame Oases make limited sense.

I do agree with open desert being unimprovable. Certainly, there are things you can build in deserts - mines have been dug in desert areas since at least the Old Kingdom in Egypt -, but if you look at the big picture, desert areas have largely remained empty of human settlements, with very low population densities. The game should reflect this.

 

[ZippyRiver]

I certainly would not want a desert tile to be a powerhouse producer. But zero anything is a bit too far in the other direction imo. Even if you didn't give the terrain itself anything, there should be some improvements made to it. Like you said, even early Egypt had mines there. Besides, isn't the genre concept "what would history read like if you were the ruler"? Perhaps history lost in battle a great ruler that would have developed a method to make deserts really a "hot spot".

I do appreciate trying to keep some things inline with historical accuracy, but were not talking about developing jet engines in 2000BC. Just simple resource procurment. An improved tile that produces 1 hammer and 1 gold would be difficult to support and certainly a last choice to work.

Jungles are junk too, but at least you can improve it by clearing it.

could make a new tile improvement for deserts....... landfill. +1 gold, +1 barf face. (lol) j/k

 

[Meffy]

I keep wishing for a "near-future" tech, Terraforming. Except you'd use it here on Terra before heading off to try it on a planet of Alpha Centauri. Along with general land improvement it would help ameliorate or reverse the damage done by global warming.

 

[Stormfalcon1970]

And then, look at Phoenix, Arizona. A desert that had been beaten back through irrigation. Because there were enough resources and economic interest.

Thank You!
Because of the Salt, Gila AND Colorado Rivers, the valley of the sun is a very good place to live. (we are the 5th largest city in the nation after all! Which flys in the face of the rants of the enraged sage, Sam Kinnison I suppose Life can be brought to the desert. Without 'high tech'. The indigenous (sp?) peoples of this region are 'famous' for thier canal systems. This could have been reflected somehow in this game based on tech or traits. Maybe limited Farming should've been allowed....IF the desert tile borders on a source of irrigation such as a flood plain. Maybe give a bonus to AGR civs again? The TOTAL uselessness of desert tiles in cIV is NOT realistic.

At the very least allow workshops and mining. (copper, gold and silver anyone?)

http://www.srpnet.com/water/canals/origins.aspx

http://www.srpnet.com/about/history/facts.aspx

http://www.gemland.com/hohokam.htm

Sorry. Not meaning to but.... I live in the freaking desert!

 

[Greencardman]

Cities with deserts in thier tile radius should be able to build solar power stations, like hydro plants, no polution, etc. It might make up for something at least.

 

[cleverhandle]

Cities with deserts in thier tile radius should be able to build solar power stations, like hydro plants, no polution, etc. It might make up for something at least.

That's a really sharp idea. Gives you a bit of payoff late for having to deal with a wasted tile the whole game, but still stays faithful to the idea of deserts as truly inhospitable places. I'd love to see this implemented. The question, of course, would be which tech unlocks a solar plant? Ecology is rather late in the tree in cIV.

 

[Anima Croatorum]

A solar plant tile improvement? Gives hammers and gold. Can build with Ecology?