DG4 Informational -- Should we allow political parties?

Allow political parties in DG4?

  • Yes, we should give it a shot

    Votes: 15 41.7%
  • No, not in this lifetime

    Votes: 20 55.6%
  • Abstain

    Votes: 1 2.8%

  • Total voters
    36
Originally posted by Octavian X
This is a PM exchange between myself and Duke of Marlbrough. Just a little food for thought...



The initial reason was based on the fact that political parties basically excluded particular people. Since the political 'party' would be based on nothing more than who is friends with whom. It wouldn't be based on anything like ideals or game concerns. Once that 'party' is able to get enough friends together, they can basically stuff the ballot box and elect whomever they want.

This would lead to people not even trying to run against them and thus stop playing the game.

In one of the Civ 3 DG, we had 'guilds'. These guilds basically satrted to act as political parties by recommending their favorite people to the rest of the guild.

The main concern is that political parties would effectively exclude people from the game and thus cause the game to lose players. The first is technically against ther forum rules and the other thing we did not want to happen for the game.

Hope that helps.


DoM
[/QUOTE]

I think the Duke (not Ellington :p ) has a good point.
Some posters here have grown "strong" enough to dominate certain elections. Examples are CT - president, trade leader....in her reign.
Others are CG - VP, ML....and Strider, Cyc, Donsig

Already when people see some running, they are less likely to run - even when nominated.
I guess that might be too much of a problem already
 
A good point indeed. One that I share, in fact. A dominant party could be trouble, but ironically a super-dominant party (say, one with >2/3 of the citizens as members) would become obsolete. Think about that for a bit and you'll see that I'm right. ;)

So let's take a look at these concerns and see if there's a way to alleviate some (or all) of them.

Political Parties exclude people.

On the contrary, political parties can act as a tool for inclusion. This block votiing that the esteemed Duke fears already takes place in many elections. Paalikles has made reference to it and just about everyone who has taken part in more than a few elections must have witnessed it to some degree. The favorites already exist. The discouragement already estists. Perhaps this is the true reason we are having such difficulty retaining members....

A political party may provide those discouraged individuals with a sense of inclusion. They can see that there are others out there that share their opinions on issues and that they are not nearly as alone as they may have thought. Belonging to the minority is still belonging.

The party system may actually provide those minority groups with an instrument to effect change which has been lacking in past games. Alliances could be made with other minority groups. Propoganda could be used to influence the next elections. Working as a group empowers those individuals in the minority to effect change.

The political parties would be based solely on who is friends with whom and not on game issues.

This is simply naive and implies the worst behavior from our citizenry. Not to mention the fact that some simple rules could prevent this from occuring.

No Political Party may operate without a charter granted by the Judiciary. Forcing the party to petition the high court for a charter would grant the judiciary sufficient authority to prevent the creation of parties that are not founded on "ideals or game concerns". To ensure they are founded for game issues and not just social groupings, we could require Mission Statements in these petitions.

FortyJ's Party for friends of FortyJ only would not only be one of the smallest parties in the game, it would not be based on game play issues and thus not a valid mission statement to receive a charter.

Green Party for individuals dedicated to the preservation of natural resources at the expense of industry, on the other hand, would probably qualify for a charter.

Political Parties are not immune to Public Investigation. This would be groundbreaking legislation because for the first time (as far as I recall), organizations as well as individuals can be the subject of PIs. Now, any Party that is found to be acting improperly or to be in violation of their charter could risk losing their charter.

Of course, other rules may be required, but those two should be at the core. In a sense, give the Judiciary the authority to regulate the political party system, and we can likely avoid the pitfalls that frighten the bejeezus out of some of us.
 
I doubt there would be a dominant party. Of course, there would still be independents.

I already have a political party in mind...
 
No jedi parties allowed ;) id prefer we stick to the real world when playing the game :)

On another note i just dont think parties are good because eventually the problems that may be caused by the party system some so richly want to try will explode like a volcana with no warning, causing massive damage and possible irrepair to the fun and enjoyment to the game.

Forty has a good point with his post tho, but i really dont think we need polit. parties to spice up our game. We dont want to go habanero spicy in the DG :) besides forum rules prevent this from ever taking place.
 
I wasn't thinking of a Jedi party. As a matter of fact, there will be no Jediism by me in DG4. I was thinking of another party...

Anyway, I do argue in OT with the 'Left leaning' members, but that doesn't make me hate them (or visa versa). I could argue in one thread, then wish the person I was argueing a happy birthday in the next. Really, people shouldn't take things so personally.
 
Originally posted by Zarn
Of course, there would still be independents.
Yes, but what if there's an Independent Party for people opposed to the idea of political parties?

:crazyeye:

@Fionn: I'm not sure if you mentioned any specific concerns with the concept of political parties or not, but consider this: my second rule should resolve just about any issue with the political party system. Any individual party or group of parties that has been determined to be detrimental to the well-being of the demogame could have its/their charter revoked. Thus, hypothetically speaking, if the party system proved to be as cataclysmic as some fear, then all the charters could simply be revoked, ending the threat to the enjoyment of the game.
 
Again, I fully concur, Forty. Parties could be banned in a heartbeat, if anything like that happens. However, you don't need to convince me, so good luck convincing everyone else. Sometimes people will never change their minds, but it's worth trying...
 
Will it be allowed to join more than one party at a time? And how do one join and quit parties?

My opinions on what to do in the game changes with the situation, so I think it might be hard for me to stay in one party...
 
i doubt parties would be allowed in the game anyways so it should be a dead issue by now
 
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