Diplomacy is still broken?
- Thread starter mike3640
- Start date
In the 4x games I play, oponents act as leaders and dont just aim for a game victory.
Games that come to my mind right now... ascendancy, alpha centauri, civ4 (I admit I can't remember how leaders acted in civ1-3, although I played them a lot). But I remember each leader in alpha centari caring about his ideollogies, not winning a computer game. And in ascendancy too, each race followed goals based on their personality. A game I played recently, Stardrive, also has big personallity behaviour instead of game victory ones.
I don't know why calling a game 4x makes it a board game were only meeting victory conditions matters to the AI. For me 4x games means... well, the 4 layers the game has, it has nothing to do with AIs beeing gamy or having personallity
I played both Civ IV and Alpha Centauri extensively - I've played every faction in AC to victory, and even played Sid Meier's Alien Crossfire, which is the putative update to AC.
Leaders in AC cared about your "government settings," much as current Civ V leaders strongly care about which ideology you adopt and whether or not you share religions. In fact, I consider Civ V AI to be superior in that certain Civs will weigh peace and war differently, and wonder chasing and CS-chasing differently. If you chase CSs, you WILL butt heads with Alexander and Ramkhangheng, since both those AI seek the alliance of CSs across the globe. Genghis? He don't care about that.
Exterminated a Civ? Both Attila and Ghandhi may consider you a warmonger, but Hiawatha may be willing to overlook all that if the enemy you exterminated was his mortal enemy (meaning he was at war with the Civ at the time). In addition, Attila probably won't mind that a lot, but Ghandhi will. In addition, Attila may not mind much, but he'll still happily declare on you just because he likes war. Ghandhi may hate your guts all game long, but he may not resort to war to punish you (instead, he'll aim at embargo and luxury bans).
That's a whole heckuvalot better than AC! Lots, lots better. Orders of magnitude better.
Leaders in AC cared about your "government settings," much as current Civ V leaders strongly care about which ideology you adopt and whether or not you share religions. In fact, I consider Civ V AI to be superior in that certain Civs will weigh peace and war differently, and wonder chasing and CS-chasing differently. If you chase CSs, you WILL butt heads with Alexander and Ramkhangheng, since both those AI seek the alliance of CSs across the globe. Genghis? He don't care about that.
Exterminated a Civ? Both Attila and Ghandhi may consider you a warmonger, but Hiawatha may be willing to overlook all that if the enemy you exterminated was his mortal enemy (meaning he was at war with the Civ at the time). In addition, Attila probably won't mind that a lot, but Ghandhi will. In addition, Attila may not mind much, but he'll still happily declare on you just because he likes war. Ghandhi may hate your guts all game long, but he may not resort to war to punish you (instead, he'll aim at embargo and luxury bans).
That's a whole heckuvalot better than AC! Lots, lots better. Orders of magnitude better.
Yes, one minds this, the other minds that, thats not the problem (besides warmongering "minding" beeing not too well designed). The problem is if they see they can win the game (the computer game, which for me is gamy) they will ignore all those preferences. "You saved my civilization, thanks, but now I want to win a computer game so I declare war on you."
I don't mind if atila attacks on sight or caesar backstabs. But if I save a "good" civilization from extintion, I don't want them to think that taking my lads is still better for their goals.
I don't mind if atila attacks on sight or caesar backstabs. But if I save a "good" civilization from extintion, I don't want them to think that taking my lads is still better for their goals.
kaltorak:
That's an interesting observation. In the OMG! I got attacked! thread, Uncle_Joe is actually complaining about the exact opposite thing - the AI doesn't care how close you are to a win condition. It used to, but it doesn't, now. He's more correct than you are. The AI doesn't actually care how close you are to, say Cultural Victory.
I've told you this already in this thread. You CAN make a Civ your lifelong bestie by saving him from an enemy Civ invasion. That is totally possible. However, a peace-loving Civ like India is still going to hate your guts when you go out and take cities from a Civ that is not currently at war with it. That is absolutely like AC AI. Better, actually, since putative peaceful factions in SMAC don't register your wars. Civ V AI does.
That's an interesting observation. In the OMG! I got attacked! thread, Uncle_Joe is actually complaining about the exact opposite thing - the AI doesn't care how close you are to a win condition. It used to, but it doesn't, now. He's more correct than you are. The AI doesn't actually care how close you are to, say Cultural Victory.
I've told you this already in this thread. You CAN make a Civ your lifelong bestie by saving him from an enemy Civ invasion. That is totally possible. However, a peace-loving Civ like India is still going to hate your guts when you go out and take cities from a Civ that is not currently at war with it. That is absolutely like AC AI. Better, actually, since putative peaceful factions in SMAC don't register your wars. Civ V AI does.
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