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[GS] Do you use (or have you ever used) t4 governments? (up to and including v. 1.0.0.317)

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by MrRadar, May 8, 2019.

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Do you use (or have you ever used) t4 governments? (up to and including v. 1.0.0.317)

  1. Yes, most often

    48 vote(s)
    57.8%
  2. Yes, I've used one at least once and I may use them again

    23 vote(s)
    27.7%
  3. No, although I might've tried it once out of interest

    8 vote(s)
    9.6%
  4. No, never

    4 vote(s)
    4.8%
  1. MrRadar

    MrRadar King

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    I just wanted to see, if those new toys are being played with, because I realised that my answer after a few games is still No. 4 - No, never. And an additional question, but not for the poll - have you ever used any Future era policy card to actually help you achieve your victory?
     
  2. Elhoim

    Elhoim Iron Tower Studio Dev

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    I try not to win fast, so yeah, most often.
     
  3. Eagle Pursuit

    Eagle Pursuit Scir-Gerefa

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    I've used the T4 governments in the few games that lasted long enough to reach that Civics level. I mostly did it for flavor rather than strategic value.

    I think the only Future Civic I have implemented was the one that grants 4 Favor per turn during a Diplo Victory attempt.
     
  4. MrRadar

    MrRadar King

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    My games often take me past t300, so they're not fast. It is just that I find myself unable to switch out of Democracy :) Every time I unlock them and reread their bonuses, again and again I see one and the same thing - if I switch to them now, I lose +4 prod on every trade route and discount on purchasing things for not that attractive new bonuses at that point in the game.

    By the way, the Wisselbanken card no longer goes obsolete, now that Arsenal of Democracy isn't a card any more? I swear I saw it available running Democracy, but somehow forgot to put it in.
     
    kryat likes this.
  5. Archon_Wing

    Archon_Wing Vote for me or die

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    I've used Digital Democracy for the +2 happiness everywhere a few times.

    I don't see the point to the other two, but on paper Synthetic Technocracy could be good for Science Victories. Corporate Libertarianism seems worthless.
     
  6. Icicle

    Icicle Prince

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    Synthetic Technocracy while a science victory drags on. Otherwise I think I usually win before they're unlocked.
     
  7. Chocolate Pi

    Chocolate Pi Chieftain

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    I'm assuming we're only talking about the subset of games that go that long. In that case, still no.

    T3 governments all offer 2 big perk each, and some pretty attractive unique policies. When you jump to a T4 government, you now get an extra slot, but have to use that slot if you want to slot the legacy policy of the perk you left behind! The other perk and the unique poilcy options are just lost entirely. Instead, you get some less useful perks and a weakness that would be big but probably is irrelevant to your victory condition if you picked it.


    +2 amenities in all cities and lots of extra culture is nice, but not actually relevant to CV. A war-wager might want it to fight weariness + prevent CV, but the penalty makes that a no-go even if Fascism didn't already do it better.

    +3 power in all cities is sort of a joke because T3 buildings are a joke, and going green doesn't matter. +30% production towards city projects is great, except Communism and Democracy already have comparably amazing production boosts. Stacking ten +8 prod international trade routes on your spaceport town is usually going to be way more than 30%... At least -10% tourism doesn't matter in the slightest.

    +10% production for Commerical Hubs and Encampments is completely a joke--even worse than ST for SV, and far worse than Facism for units. Bonus resources--but only for resources you are already getting--is a total snooze. And -10% science? Gee, where do I sign.


    Soapbox: The T4 experimental governments should be experiemental--radical untested solutions for the problems mankind faces in our future, with tempting and dramatic advantages at the cost of drawbacks humanity has never had to face before. Players need to be able to both build infrastructure agaisnt these drawbacks, and exploit them in opponents that dare use these bold governments.

    (I'll reuse the names, because I think their 3 picks were actually spot-on.)

    Digital Democracy: Govenors only take 1 turn to establish. Cities gain a bonus +10% Science, Culture, and Tourism per Happiness. Cities only have a maximum of 80 loyalty. Doubles diplomatic CO2 penalities.
    Synthetic Technocracy: Nuclear Reactors do not age. Cities gain a bonus +4% Production and Tourism per power consumed. -5 Amenities in cities without full power. Doubles diplomatic CO2 penalities.
    Corporate Libertarianism: Doubles trade route yields and speed. Doubles luxury and strategic resources collected. Cannot Counterspy. Doubles diplomatic CO2 penalities.

    So DD becomes really great for tall-ish super happy civs, but you better have your internal loyalty pressure on lock and watch out for Russian spies spreading fake news amidst your populist masses so over patriotic loyalty.
    ST is the all-purpose production king for tall cities, but your tech utopia depends on its infrastructure and will fall apart in 5 nanoseconds if your grid lacks the redundancies to handle natural disasters or spies.
    CL is good for wider play with lots of routes and diversified Spy targets. Your enemies might loot half your stuff, but you're making so much money that who cares? You'll steal it back anyway, and call it Globalism.

    For extra fun, these bonuses synergizes really well (but in different ways!) with the T3 Legacy Policies. So, Democracy -> ST (insane ally trade routes) is very mechanically different from Communism -> ST (insane super-tall cities).
     
    Kjimmet, Eurritz, Banazir864 and 3 others like this.
  8. Basajaun

    Basajaun Chieftain

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    I do use them, although to be honest I just use the one that gives free power to my cities, just to finish off the science victory a bit faster. The others I have not tried. I usually finish my Culture Victories around turn 400 (King/Emperor, epic speed, standard size map, continents) and the SV around 500.
     
  9. King Rad

    King Rad Warlord

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    As someone else said, I play slowly and always make it to the tier 4 governments. I have used at least two of the tier 4 govs, based on what victory condition I've decided to pursue and/or specific needs in my cities. I like that there are certain drawbacks associated with taking advantage of whatever benefit the government adds.
     
  10. Socrates99

    Socrates99 Bottoms up!

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    The only VC I can imagine avoiding them is CV because of the tourism modifier. The rest of the VCs would only benefit from them. Diplo an Dom games do tend to hit T4 no matter how ha r you try to end the game so, yeah, every time I've gone diplo and com I've gotten a T4.
     
  11. WillowBrook

    WillowBrook Lurker

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    In my current game, I've avoided them because of the diplo penalty for different governments, and democracy is currently most popular.

    I expect I'll use one in maybe half my games that get far enough.

    Yep, you can now get +6 +6 with allies with that card in democracy. Not sure if it was intended, but it's pretty nice.
     
  12. Zenstrive

    Zenstrive Ocean King

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    Always.
    I am the player who plays Civilization to make a sprawling empire, not to play like worksheet maniac....
     
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  13. iammaxhailme

    iammaxhailme Emperor

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    I use them if the game hasn't ended by that point, which is rare.
     
    Victoria likes this.
  14. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    Tried them but they look bad and feel bad when I am wearing them.
    Tend not to reach them for RV, CV or Dom
    For SV they don’t really give a better boost as said.
    That leaves a DipV and I really do not want to play those.

    I have played a lot of immersive games but tend to give up on them before T4. Certainly the government is not encouraging me to continue.
     
  15. Slip de Garcon

    Slip de Garcon Warlord

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    I use the one with the -10% tourism until I've got all the science I need, then swap to the one with the -10% science.
     
  16. Pietato

    Pietato Emperor

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    Synthetic Technocracy is good. Free power to lower carbon penalties, and increased city project production for all your cities. Great for the horrendous Diplomatic Victory and when you have no allies to trade with.
     
  17. Midgardsormr

    Midgardsormr Warlord

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    I don't really care about the government bonuses themselves, but I love getting that huge spread of wildcard slots they offer.
     
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  18. MrRadar

    MrRadar King

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    Well, now this sounds much more interesting than the current perks. Not sure though what to think about double CO2 penalties for each of them.

    Oh yes, using that right now. I very much doubt though that it was intended, probably another overlook. The trade route yields are obscene. Makes it even harder to leave democracy for anything from current t4 selection.
     
    Banazir864 likes this.
  19. MrRadar

    MrRadar King

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    I thought I was stronger... or more likely to try out new things...
    But I'm weak... (and what's wrong with that? ;))

    How can you possibly find the willpower (or reason) to switch out of something like this?



    So my answer to my own survey remains 'No, never', and, barring some considerable changes to T4 governments, I don't see how it can change in the future.
     
  20. Jkchart

    Jkchart King

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    Of course. I play at a pace that generally allows me to get that far. I tend to go digital democracy or synthetic technocracy. Not sure I've ever used Corporate Libertarianism though.
     

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