DocT01: Reconquista! (discussion)

[Doc Tsiolkovski]

Middle Ages Conquest, Castile.


To add additional challenge to my favorite Conquest, this game features the normally not-playable Castilian Civ, trying to replay the Reconquista of the Iberian peninsula.


Historical background:

http://en2.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reconquista

(...and a gazillion of other links you'll get when searching for 'Castile' + 'Reconquista' )


As a AI-only Civ, Castile starts with several disadvantages; I will however remove some of them, otherwise it'll be a pain to play.

Tweaks:
- Castile gets traits (REL/ MIL obviously)
- The Castilian capital gets the usual improvements (Temple, Barracks, Marketplace).

Note we still have no Relic, only 2 Kings, and - most important - no free flavor Tech. FYI, we do have Knights (GA trigger!) by default, though I never saw AI Castile making it so far.

This will be rather tough; we'll have to get rid of the Cordovans ASAP, and then we still have to find a way to win the Conquest - the VPs needed for that will most likely equal the Frankish or Fatimid Empire, who both will have their UU long before us.

Level: Emperor (Monarch or Demigod, if public demand)

Players should be either familiar with the Middle Ages, preferably victorious with any Civ except Vikings, Byzantium or Abbasids on Monarch+ , or able to beat the game on Emperor+ AW games and willing to read the rather short Civilopedia for that Conquest.

Usual SG rules; 'dastardly' against Muslim Civs is allowed (after asking the team, of course)



]Rooster:

1. Doc Tsiolkovski
2. Elvis1985
3. DeceasedHorse
4. Bede
5. Corrado


I will start a new threat for the actual game, as well as the Celtic mirror, but let's use this one for discussion.

Any objections against Emperor?
IMHO, Demigod cannot be won without any chance to reach the Holy Lands before Abbasids or Byzantium reaches 30 000VP, and Monarch - well. we want a challenge .

We should discuss our opening moves en detail, those will be extremly important.

 

[Gobi Bear]

Doc:

Did you ever get anyone else to play this?

If you do start it, this Middle Ages scenario designer is willing to give it a go too!

 

[Doc Tsiolkovski]

Unfortunately not, but I'm still willing to play - and what could be a better advertisment than a Scenario designer himself taking part?

Anyone interested? Pleeease?

 

[Bede]

Doc,

I'll join

As an aside: Have you posted this in the SG registry thread? May help you get more players

 

[Doc Tsiolkovski]

Wellcome aboard!

(Of course I did, btw).

 

[Bede]

@Doc

Sorry, I missed it.

Looking forward to beginning

 

[Gobi Bear]

I can probably talk Warpstorm, BobT, and Merepatra into playing with us. Shall I try that? How many people are you hoping to get?

 

[Corrado]

Oooh. Interesting.

Yeah, I'm only in 2 other games and running one. Count me in, if there's room.

For reference- I've won in the Middle Ages on Emperor as the Germans, and am currently kicking ass as the English in my current game.

 

[Chieftess]

El Mencey has an Iberian Peninsula map, and I have a couple of maps showing the Spanish Reconquista kingdom borders (castille, lyon, etc.) if you want those.

Civ3 Maps -- It's the 3rd from the bottom. The map is in Spanish, so you'll have to export just the map data.

Spanish Atlas - 1210AD (this is one I'm using for my 31 civ Mongolia Scenario - the Reconquista is a little side scenario. )

EDIT: I quickly imported the map, and made an English version of the map.

Spain

 

[DeceasedHorse]

Also intrested, if there is any space left.

 

[warpstorm]

Yes, you can count me in. Sounds interesting (if a little tough).

 

[Merepatra]

Again I'm interested if there is space still. I've never played a succession game, but I've certainly played Middle Ages a lot.

 

[Chieftess]

I suppose I can fit 3 SGs in. I'll join in too.

 

[Gobi Bear]

Is there any usual limit to the size of a succession game team? Or is it a "the more the merrier" kind of situation? If there is a limit, I might have just blown it ... seems like we have a good-sized crowd now!

 

[Chieftess]

Usually 5-6, but I've seen SGs with more. In most cases, it's split into 2 teams.

So, Team 1 could be Castille, and Team 2 could be Lyon for example.

 

[Gobi Bear]

There are a few other "not playable by the human" civs in Middle Ages. Poland, Magyars, Celts, Bulgars. The other teams could take these civs with similar adjustments. Probably makes most sense to add them in the order listed.

 

[Lord_Sidious]

I'm making a scenario about the Reconquista, so far civs:
-Portugal
-Leon
-Castille
-Aragon
-Navarra
-Cordova

 

[Doc Tsiolkovski]

Where are you all coming from suddenly???

Given the limited number of turns in this conquest, 5 (or 6 if rigourosly skipping) participants would be enough.
But I really like the idea of pseudo-mirrors with the other AI-only Civs.

* Poland should be rather easy - they build the HRE wonder in most of my games anyway, and seizing the German relic seems no big deal. Not really interesting IMHO.

* Magyars are very weak and in the middle of everything - but what about granting them a Horse UU to start with, like in history? Keshik would be too strong, I could see Horse Archers, 2(2)/1/3 ?

* Bulgars, dunno; nothing really special about them.

* Celts: Now this would be my favorite choice aside from Castille. I already tried them (though I lost rather soon ) with the following modifications:
Traits: REL/SEA (Curraghs!)
UU: Welsh Longbow; 6/1/1

Of course, you have to clear the home soil from the Germanic hordes ASAP, and with Alfred around, that's pretty tough .

I for one prefer the Castille game, but I can provide the modded version for any other Civ too, to be sure to make the same adjustments.



Castille:

Rooster: (in no particular order, just the 5 who applied first - if you want to play in a mirror instead, post it)

1. Doc Tsiolkovski
2. Elvis1985 - please confirm if you're still interested
3. Gobi Bear
4. bede
5. Corrado

 

[Gobi Bear]

I could give my slot in Castille to Deceased Horse and lead the charge on the Celt game.

That would give a Celt roster of:
1. Gobi Bear
2. Warpstorm
3. Merepatra
4. Chieftess
5. BobT (he needs to post here, but he ICQ'd me to say he's interested)

I like your proposals for the Celts, but let me look over the scenario one more time to see if anything else springs to mind.

How do mirrored games work? Do we both post to the same thread so we see how the others are doing? Or does it split into two discussions threads right at the start?

 

[Gobi Bear]

Here is my proposal on the Celts.

I'm thinking that this is William Wallace's time period, and the Gallic Swordsman is not used in this scenario. So my proposal for their UU is to add the Gallic Swordsman on the Medieval Combat tech and make him a 4/2/2 cost 40 that replaces the 4/2/1 cost 40 Medieval Infantry that is there for the Celts. He would be able to start a Golden Age for them. This puts the UU about 4 techs into the tree, and I believe that is the same spot as the Knight for Castile. So our two games would be similar in setup.

As to attributes, I'm not sure they were really Seafaring enough to get that designation. I'm thinking Militaristic, Religious is the most logical, though Agricultural would work too. There aren't any wonders marked for Agricultural though (though I can see adding that to Robin Hood and the Domesday Book).

I guess making them Militaristic, Religious is my proposal.