Domestic Poll: Cities 3 & 4 Locations

[Provolution]

Easy cyc, we are not going to plant that G City before we have discovered Iron Working so the vote stands. However, as soon as there are iron in turn 11, and the settler is within range, we will repoll City G to the Iron City, changing the course of the settler.
We make that decision after turn 11, which will be the defintive deadline of the chat.
Given the proximity of iron, that is an easy decision to make.
Yet, a nullification a few hours before turnchat is too soon, and anti-constitutional, yet we are fully legally capable to do so after this evenings 11 (Eleven) turn-chat.

 

[Epimethius]

A settler will be produced in ten turns. Iron Working will be discovered in, at the ealiest, eleven. Knowing our president, the chat won't stop for either. Now, the settler is produced before we know where the iron is. And the chat starts before we know where the iron is. So it seems to me only logical that we should figure out where to send the settler before we know where the iron is. If the chat stops before that, then a repoll will be had. Otherwise, I suggest you quit calling for some psychic settling.

 

[Cyc]

Our President will not be running the chat tonight. The Vice President will. This is the same Vice President who is pissed because her city name was bumped from 1st to 2nd. Your attempt to bump my name from 5th to 6th in hopes of reconciling Chieftess' hurt feeling are transparent, Epimethius. If they read your response in the city naming thread, your motives are obvious.

 

[Rik Meleet]

A ghost addition? Oh, that's how you do it....

Election problem solved.

Anyone can count the names with each option. I noticed 1 off, after I added Donovan Zoi's vote to G. And that is not "How I do it"; as you can see; I did not vote for location "G" to begin with.

I call for a nullification of the fourth city location. We need to wait until the discovery of Iron before we press on. If Iron is within our grasp, our fourth city should go there.

That is not neccesary. Iron Working will take some time to research and apparently there will be a trade for Alphabet. The science instructions include that when we have both Iron Working and the winner of the "Research after Iron Working" (currently Alphabet) that the chat be stopped. If a 4th city is already settled, no problem, if it isn't; you and all citizens have the power to re-assess the city-locations of future cities. That includes (in my PoV) the 4th city.

 

[Epimethius]

This is asinine. You're accusing me of some sort of city naming conspiracy. I have absolutely no reason to do that. I do have reason to set up a poll this way. You see, two settlers will be produced before iron working. As deputy domestic minister, I have to figure out where to send that settler. Before we thought of redoing the micromanagement, IW was even farther away. If I do not give instructions there is nowhere to send that settler. I am doing my job. In any case, the chat will be stopped when Iron Working is discovered, I think, so the point doesn't really matter.

As for the city name, that's just stupid that you would accuse me of that. I don't care, and neither should you. The name isn't yours, and niether is the city. As far as I can tell its just some gibberish. Moving it back one site doesn't change anything.

CT's city was bumped from 1st to 2nd because that is the way it always happens. I have seen any signs from her that she was pissed over that. I can understand if she is pissed over it being misspelled, but that isn't my fault, that fault lies with the President.

And I'll be on the chat today, so you won't get to do that thing you did with the first city.

Moderator Action: Expletives removed. Please watch your language. Eyrei.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[Cyc]

Anyone can count the names with each option. I noticed 1 off, after I added Donovan Zoi's vote to G. And that is not "How I do it"; as you can see; I did not vote for location "G" to begin with.

Trust me, RM. I wasn't talking about you. You are an honorable Moderator. I've witnessed ghost additions/deletions clear back to DG2, maybe even DG1.

That is not neccesary. Iron Working will take some time to research and apparently there will be a trade for Alphabet. The science instructions include that when we have both Iron Working and the winner of the "Research after Iron Working" (currently Alphabet) that the chat be stopped. If a 4th city is already settled, no problem, if it isn't; you and all citizens have the power to re-assess the city-locations of future cities. That includes (in my PoV) the 4th city.

That's fine. I bow to your decision.

 

[Provolution]

What is the hassle with a misspelled name, just edit in the namescreen next turnchat, I cannot see the real problem here. And about me giving a city a name to a city in Term 5? I will just donate it to the Red Cross or something. I see that the name has big symbolic and emotional impact on some people, but please moderate such a miniscule conflict.

 

[Noldodan]

Cyc, the following quote is from the beginning of the city placement poll thread. "What about the Iron? Well, that's simple. As soon as we spot the iron, we'll settle there, interrupting the established order." I guess I'll have to add that to the chat instructions.

 

[Provolution]

Honorable Minister Noldodan and Deputy Minister Epithemius

I realized that the turnchat was reduced to a few five turns, not unexpected in my absence, so I will forward the following idea. Most of us are not to keen on building up numerous 4-5 turn turnchats, and in order to compensate (we are at minus 9 turns now according to schedule for 100), I suggest that we look into adapting our city localization plan. With so many hills and mountains around, there simply has to be iron somewhere, however, what we only know, is that we may grab the 3 diamonds, in total worth (4+1+1+1)X3=21 commerce under monarchy and roads alone, Mitsubishi city I call it,as it is indeed 3 diamonds may generate as much as 30 gold a turn prior to
the market, which will make the value 45 gold per turn. In comparison, we now produce around 15 gold in total, and those 4 gold in Furuyama increased commerce by
20 %. With the polling backing of more than 20 people, the enormours research potential, the need to prop up the southern babylonian border immediately, the dual use of a future library for research and culture in the region and in general that this site is heavily in demand regardless, I cannot recommend to repoll site G.

Noldodan, you created a very tricky situation this weekend by not informing your deputy, as we sought to harmonize procedures for settling the iron city. New maps farther east, new civs, the new knowledge that Zulus may be somewhere else than originally thought, the presence of the Iroquois, our limited scientific output and standing as well as a general slow pace of the game thanks to many interruptions, has
not set me, and I hope I speak on behalf of others as well, in the mood for yet another
short turnchat originated in the trade ministry. DZ did the right thing, as the trade was a close call, but I honestly think we can settle city G, and then end the turnchat when the next settler is complete in order to go for Iron City then.

This means we need a joint scientific/trade poll in this special case

Alphabet
Mysticism
Babylonian Worker

My knowledge telle me we are 4 turns away from iron working, and we can well work some tiles (Gems/roads) and develop production queues for

Fanatikku: Settler 3, queues, scalable for 10 more turns, military and settler
Furuyama: Spearman 8, plus plus
Immo: Warrior 8/ (expand to 2 in 3 t), settler, military

Prepare a dual poll for remaining sites, with a directive to make the iron city a domestic decision by decree, overruling the city with the least votes to go for the iron. This means two cities are doable next tc.

I would also recommend to listen to the voiced protests in the site selection fromt the people not voting G, but still follow the valid vote of the 20 people that voted G.
If we managed to get IW last time, I would not make this proposal.

To the formal crowd and the other ones, I write this to as a "Citizen"
to those of you that do not really care, "Provolution"

 

[eyrei]

Moderator Action: Cyc, this is absolutely the last warning you are going to get from me. It would be pretty sad if I had to ban the Chief Justice because he can't control his temper or let go of old grudges.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[Cyc]

Right now, I may agree with Provolution. Sending the next Settler to Site G may be a wise thing. I'm not sure. As the Science Dept. seems set on taking us on the Great Library route (Alphabet) instead of the Monarchy route (Mysticism), there would be no need to stop the chat at the discovery of IW. On the other hand, if we do have Iron within our grasp, that move would delay our Iron city that much more. Difficult dicision.

 

[invy]

It seems like some of the veterans of demogames have old problems between themselves and they discuss it here in the forums. Surely this is not the right place for such discussions so please try to finish those discussions in chat or somewhere else.
Its not my place to tell this but it ruins fun for newcomers like me who are playing first DG and i beleive i'm not the only one.

 

[invy]

Why cant we think about few possible situations and decide what to do:
for example to vote for the most wanted techs like we did with wonders and to go for it.

So, for example, many people want mysticism (to get monarchy) and that should be priority and not some bab worker. Trade is simple, get Misticism, worker is not that important. There would be no need to stop turnchat every 5 turns, simply go for pririties which we can discuss here.

If we are going for Iron that that is priority (if its decided), so settler goes to iron and place G is 2nd priority. All of this can be and should be decided here before turnchat.
When polling how to settle near iron when its discovered we don't need to stop chat immediately. Go few turns closer to iron and if we're not sure which tile exactly to place then we're going back to forums to discuss.

The point is to predict: if A happens we do _____, if B we____, if C then ____....

Some people are trying to do this but it isn't going that well.It should be matter of goverment to organize procedures and priorities, to present it to citizens and to go for their wishes for 10 turns without interrupting a chat.

 

[DaveShack]

Invy, well said!

To get some flexibility in city settlement, all we need to do is give flexibility in the instructions to alter the order of settlement to obtain newly discovered resources, and to move city sites if we have one in the right general place but a tile away from being able to get the resource.

 

[Cyc]

Why cant we think about few possible situations and decide what to do:
for example to vote for the most wanted techs like we did with wonders and to go for it.

So, for example, many people want mysticism (to get monarchy) and that should be priority and not some bab worker. Trade is simple, get Misticism, worker is not that important. There would be no need to stop turnchat every 5 turns, simply go for pririties which we can discuss here.

If we are going for Iron that that is priority (if its decided), so settler goes to iron and place G is 2nd priority. All of this can be and should be decided here before turnchat.
When polling how to settle near iron when its discovered we don't need to stop chat immediately. Go few turns closer to iron and if we're not sure which tile exactly to place then we're going back to forums to discuss.

The point is to predict: if A happens we do _____, if B we____, if C then ____....

Some people are trying to do this but it isn't going that well.It should be matter of goverment to organize procedures and priorities, to present it to citizens and to go for their wishes for 10 turns without interrupting a chat.

What the people don't realize is that all of this will come about naturally. It just happens. Of course, someone will claim they had the miracle cure, but believe me, it just comes about. This happens every game. People get real upset because of the way the game's going, some leave, some stay. But it always evens out to a playable game soon after. And it's not because some people left or because some people stayed. And it's definitely not because of someones miracle cure. It just happens when the map is revealed and most of the other civs are met. Relax people.

 

[blackheart]

In all the fervor to get iron and the early resources let us not forget that we need to secure those deserts and mountains in hopes that we find uranium, oil, coal, aluminum, and saltpeter. We can hoard all the early resources as much as we want but when the new ages roll around and we don't have these resources, we would pretty much be SOL.

 

[Chieftess]

Our President will not be running the chat tonight. The Vice President will. This is the same Vice President who is pissed because her city name was bumped from 1st to 2nd. Your attempt to bump my name from 5th to 6th in hopes of reconciling Chieftess' hurt feeling are transparent, Epimethius.

Who said I was upset about that?

 

[Epimethius]

I said that you weren't, and that it was an example of how its not a big deal if you're pushed back one, seeing as someone got the name wrong and didn't complain at all, so complain because it takes longer is stupid. Didn't work.

 

[Black_Hole]

actually epimethius it is right above :

CT's city was bumped from 1st to 2nd because that is the way it always happens. I have seen any signs from her that she was pissed over that. I can understand if she is pissed over it being misspelled, but that isn't my fault, that fault lies with the President.

edit: looking over it, mayb you forgot "n't"

 

[Cyc]

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz...I'm sleeping through the rest of this conversation. Don't want eyrei to get upset.