Dot Mapping

Frazzer

Chieftain
Joined
Dec 20, 2005
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6
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UK
After reading Sisiutil's excellent guide for beginners on this forum, I'd like to clear up a few questions I have about the dot mapping technique and city specialization.

I'll start by explaining what I understand from the guide, and you can tell me if I'm going wrong anywhere:

When you want to build a city, you take a screenshot of an area on the map that looks interesting (Print Screen). I tend to do this with the grid and "show resources" (I think that's what it's called: the button that shows how much food, commerce, and production a tile produces) on, because I'm not too good at remembering the statistics off by heart. They ARE listed in the manual, but I don't tend to play with it by my side.

Then, I open up Paint (I could use Photoshop/Paint Shop Pro but Paint is just as good, if not better 'coz it's faster) and do Edit > Paste (or Ctrl+V OR Option+V for a Mac user) to get the screenshot up on the screen. You could also open up the screenshot from the Civilization IV directory under Screenshots, or something like that.

Next, I decide on what I think could be a good place to build a city and draw a big red dot using the paintbrush on that tile (You may need some practice selecting an ideal tile, but you can always just select a random tile and start using that; if the rest of the dot map reveals it to be a poor placement, just try another tile).

Then, draw out what will be the outline of the city's "fat cross" (this is detailed in the manual). Inside this fat cross, cross out every tile that has an output of exactly two food (these tiles provide enough food for themselves). Next, write "-1" on every tile that produces just one food, and "-2" on every tile that produces no food at all (including peaks and deserts). These tiles can't provide for themselves. Then, if any tiles have a food resource on them (such as rice, corn, wheat, cow, sheep, pig etc.) work out how much food that tile will produce once the appropriate improvement has been built upon it. Add a "+X" to those tiles, where X is the amount of excess food above two the tile will produce. Now, look at all the tiles which produce more that two food. Add a "+X" to those tiles, where X is the amount of excess food above two the tile produces.

Finally, add up all the numbers you've written down on the tiles (negating the crossed out tiles as zeros), and you will get either a positive or, most probably, a negative answer. If the answer is positive, your city will produce excess food above supporting the maximum number of citizens the city can hold, and thus NO farms will need to be built in that city (except for the tiles that need a farm to improve them, such as corn, rice, and wheat). If the answer is negative, then you will need to build farms to raise your city's population to it's maximum level, and the number of farms is equal to the result you got multiplied by -1; for example, if your answer was -3:

-3 * -1 = 3 farms

From this, you need to work out whether you can build that many farms in that city's fat cross. Farms can ONLY be built on flatlands that have irrigation (i.e. are next to a river or fresh water, or next to another farm after Civil Service has been researched (and then it still doesn't always work...).

If you can build that many farms, DON'T build a city there. If you can build those farms, decide if building the specified number of farms will still allow for the city specialization that you were hoping for. There's no point in having a production city with only one mined hill and 19 farms, is there?

Now, what I'm having touble with is city specilization. I can't seem to either get enough variety of land to enable all the different specilizations that I want, or I can't get enough food in a city that would be ideal for say, a production city.

From what I understand, the different city specializations are:

Wealth (mix of farms and cottages, buildings + wonders that encourage commerce, preferably a holy city on the coast)

Science (mix of farms and cottages, buildings + wonders that encourage research and Scientist GP production, an academy, and lots of Scientist GP specialists)

Production (lots of hills and enough farms to support the city, buildings + wonders that encourage production and health)

Military (lots of hills and enough farms to support the city, buildings + wonders that encourage production, military production, and health)

GP Farm (lots of farms, buildings + wonders that encourage GP production and food, and lots of GP specialists)

Is there something I am getting wrong? Building enough farms seems to be the biggest problem, and I am also quite weak at military production, because I build top much. Plus, the AI always seems to beat me to the bulk of the land and I never place enough cities (five has been my maximum). In addition, could anyone suggest a suitable tech tree "strategy" in full length, because I can do the early game but after getting to Civil Service I tend to research practically every tech going...

I like to play with "No tech trading" ON, on a Continents map, and at Noble level because I like to play online.

I look forward to some replies!
 
One thing I need to update in my guide is that you don't need to factor in the deserts and peaks as "-2". Don't consider them in your farm calculations at all--you're figuring out how many farms you need in order to work all the tiles at the city's maximum size, and those unworkable tiles will never, by definition, be worked.

It sounds like you have the dot-mapping and city specialization basics down, it's other areas of the game you need to focus on.

I would recommend you turn tech trading back on and play with that setting until you feel comfortable with all areas of the game. I consider turning off tech trading to be a setting for advanced players; I'm playing on Monarch and I still don't use it.

Yep, the most cities you will typically be able to build at first will be around 5. Sometimes I only manange 3 or 4 before the AI hems me in. You mentioned you don't build enough military, and that's your problem, because you need to fight your way out of this situation. Bee-line to Bronze Working, settle next to copper, build a force of Axemen and start showing your land-grabbing neighbour the error of his ways. :hammer:

As for later research--it varies from game to game. In the mid-game I'll see certain needs and set research goals accordingly. A neighbour whose cities I want to conquer has Feudalism and Longbowmen; I'll need Civil Service and Machinery for Macemen to go after him. Or my economy is in the tank after a war--I need Currency, Guilds, and Banking for the buildings to prop it back up. I also like to get to Optics for an attempt at the Circumnavigation bonus, and to Liberalism, of course, for the free tech. But when I attempt those is based upon my other priorities in the game, Great People I'm generating, techs I'm able to trade for or extort, and so on.

(Another reason to turn tech-trading back on: play the game a while and you'll notice that the AI tends to value and research certain techs before you--Feudalism, Theology, and Guilds, for example. You can, therefore, usually not research these and get them through trades, allowing you to focus on your more pressing technological needs.)

After the mid-game is done, it's time to start thinking about the victory you want to pursue. Cultural, Diplomatic, Space Race, and Conquest/Domination all entail different research priorities, so the victory you're pursuing will guide your research by then. Other threads here on the forum go into more detail about which techs you need to prioritize for these victories, but you can probably figure it out on your own if you think about it.
 
Thanks a lot for the reply Sisiutil!

The deserts and the peaks did have me stumped when you're stuck in the middle of two civs, when you have to build on land that is the equivalent of the sahara desert...

And, as for the tech trading - yeah, I'll turn it back on again, get better, and then conquer multiplayer :D.

I liked tech trading, but sometimes I get a bit carried away with giving techs away to get the AIs to like me - or I give away the wrong ones, such as rifling and gunpowder, foolishly thinking they were unimportant, instead after a few turns I'm flattened by that same civ...

I agree, I do need to be far more aggressive... I'll try the axeman army in my next game. The late game research is also quote helpful: I expect if I play a more aggressive game I'll know where to go with them.

Another thing I just thought of - since I don't play with any specific leader, sometimes I start with mysticism and sometimes I don't. Is it a good idea to shot for a religion straight away or just shoot for bronze working anyway?

I'm asking for all this help because I've only just realised how poor I am at the game. I've been playing Civilization IV since it was released (almost), but I keep getting pwned by my 12-year-old sister who has been playing for about three days... :blush:
 
I only go for an early religion if I start with Mysticism. I usually go after Polytheism/Hinduism, because it's a little more expensive. The AI usually prefers the lower-hanging fruit. It's also a prerequisite for Literature and the Great Library.

The big advantage of an early religion is that you have an immediate raise to your cities' happiness cap, and you can forgo building Stonehenge if you want (though it's still nice for the Great Prophet). The difficulty for me is holding off on Masonry -> Monotheism for the OR boost while I wait for a Great Prophet to pop Civil Service.

Without Mysticism, go for Bronze Working, build Axes, and go capture a holy city from the fool who prioritized religion over power. ;)

I don't play multiplayer (yet), but from what I've heard, don't bother with anything but military early in a MP game. Researching a religion off the bat in MP is the Civ version of pasting a "KICK ME" sign on your butt.
 
Cheers once again for all the advice - I get the waiting around for Monotheism thing too - afraid to found a second religion for fear of unhappiness...

And, funnily enough, researching a religion in any of the online games I played never lead to early destruction for those players - in fact, they tended to be the strongest ones... Interesting idea though...

But building military is extremely important - or you leave yourself open to another civs exploring warrior :eek:

The one time I left a city undefended, this happened, and I would have lost my only city; luckily I rushed a warrior just in time before the two axeman reached me. It killed off BOTH the enemy axemen... but I won't try it again. :lol:
 
Frazzer said:
The one time I left a city undefended, this happened, and I would have lost my only city; luckily I rushed a warrior just in time before the two axeman reached me. It killed off BOTH the enemy axemen... but I won't try it again. :lol:
:eek:
you killed 2 axemen with a warrior?
I can see you kill 2 warriors with 1 axe, but the other way round seems exceptionnal!!!

congrats to your sister ;)

Just one thing : if your goal really is to play multiplayer, don't bother with tech trading. And go for BW then the wheel, and whip, whip and whip.
 
Thanks lol

I'm not really sure what my goal is - apart from to win, of course...
 
The game actually has paint tools in-built so you don't need to take a screenshot to do strategy drawings.

Zoom all the way out to the globe view. The buttons above the minimap will chage. Select the left most button above the minimap (strategy layer). You will now be presented with some paint tools that allow you to draw on the map whilst in game. This saves you exiting to paint.

The strategy layer tools have been there since the beggining, about time more people started using them :)
 
Wow, that's awesome (about the strategy layer)!

My biggest remaining problem is GP generation. I do a lot of optimization for production and commerce, but rarely add specialists in my cities. I really need to start doing that.

Great thread.
 
not a good name:
notagoodname said:
The game actually has paint tools in-built so you don't need to take a screenshot to do strategy drawings.

Yeah, I found this out just after posting the first post - but I wasn't quite sure how to put it, so thanks for posting it here.

eric:

GP generation is quite simple IF you specialise your cities... and definately by having a GP farm, because that helps loads. Also, in the city screen, turn on the encourage GP button in the GP farm to tell it to optimise for faster production of GPs. Make sure that you completely cover that city's land with farms. Oh, and if you want a specific type of GP, it helps to build a few wonders that encourage that type of GP - even a library can help you to gain a GS if you can't build any wonders. There are also certain civics that help you to gain GPs quicker.

I'm pretty new to trying to gain lots of them myself, but since reading Sisiutil's guide and by implementing Dot Mapping and City Specialisation I've been producing GPs hand over fist!

"Try it yourself!"

And thanks for the comment about the thread :)
 
Yeah, I have a general grasp of how to set up a GP farm and specialize commerce, science, and production cities just fine. I just tend to never go in and add specialists to a would-be GPP farm ;). It's mostly a matter of forgetfulness and/or laziness.

Now dotmapping is not something I've ever done. I just kind of make general, on-the-fly decisions about where my cities should go based on needed resources, enemy expansion, and strategic territorial considerations.

But the macro planning view of dotmapping is interesting. I'll try it tonight and/or tomorrow.
 
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