Eligibility Discussion

[FortyJ]

Heh... I sometimes have that concern with only one office.

Of course, that would have to be a concern, but it seems to reason that having someone interested in the position (even if he or she ends up taking on too much work) is better than having nobody in the position to start with.

 

[Donovan Zoi]

I believe that our laws regarding these issues are fine as-is, although I tend to agree that some concessions would need to be made for management of our late-game conquests a.k.a. provinces. However, even then we are looking at management of a bunch of 1spt cities, so build queues shouldn't be much of an issue.

In reference to our lack of coverage, I still think that a post-election confirmed Presidential appointment is the way to go in our situation. For example, look at our current race for President: of the four candidates running, two of them would go home empty-handed while a third would technically be a deputy and would still be able to take on a vacant leadership position in any government branch. So we could immediately fill 3 vacancies with qualified citizens. Of course, I too would prefer that positions were filled by elections, but its nice to know that our laws already give us this handy back-up plan.

Cliff notes version: barring some possible solutions to late-game provincial management, I wouldn't change a thing.

 

[Octavian X]

I like these ideas. The only obstructions I can see is the Constitution's Article H, which solidifies the one person/one leader position rule. Some of us who have been here longer know what a headache it is to amend the constitution.

For now, I'd prefer the simpler fix of making larger provinces from smaller ones. If that doesn't work, it would serve to make a constitutional amendment passer faster, since not as many senate votes would be needed.

 

[FortyJ]

DZ - You are, of course, correct. Presidential appointments can fill the void left by the election process.

I have become intrigued by the prospect of allowing indivuduals to run for more than one office, and I see no harm in it. Lifting the restrictions on number of positions that can be held will reduce the number of vacant positions needed to be filled by appointment.

There are currently 16 provinces mapped out (fortunately, not all of them are currently in use), and potentially room in this world for several more. Add the six council positions and the three members of the Judiciary, and the President and we could have as many as 26 elected positions! And that's without adding any new provinces. Theoretically, we could end up with more provinces than our full census.

I'm all in favor of having as many people involved as possible, but it seems like we're reaching a critical mass here. Perhaps we need to consider consolidating some provinces, or some other approach to resolving this issue.

 

[Octavian X]

Another aspect we seem to be missing is deputies - Assume everyone had a deputy, and each councilmember had a chat rep (and each councilmember can even have multiple reps), we have 55 positions possible.

 

[Chieftess]

Originally posted by Octavian X
Another aspect we seem to be missing is deputies - Assume everyone had a deputy, and each councilmember had a chat rep (and each councilmember can even have multiple reps), we have 55 positions possible.

And not even Apolyton could fill that! That's 1/6th of their daily logons.

 

[GenMarshall]

IMO. I beleve that Something should be done to fill the Govenors seat and any other open seat. Though this would cause a few problems as Eyrei pointed out, it would be biting more than we can chew.

I suggest that who ever does not win the Presidential Elections should have first dibs on a office. I used to have a back up incase if a Big Name (This is a while back ) Accepted his Nomination, and I head to the office where I have the most chance of winning.

Today I dont have that problem no more, Thank Goodness I have grown out of Campaining and I have ben around the Demogame for a while .

 

[Chieftess]

That's an idea... and deputy, or runner ups (3rd, 4th, etc) should get 1st dibs at a vacant seat.

 

[Donovan Zoi]

Forty,

I still contend that none of the 10 elected Executive/ Judicial offices should be held by the same person. I also believe that running for an additional governorship should only be allowed after our number of elected offices reaches half the active census. Incidentally, that is exactly what happened when we added four more provinces to this election process.

Using the most extreme example, this would keep a popular player from being, say, President and sole governor in the nation at the outset of the game. Not that this would happen, but it could.

We should pursue the passage of any law of this nature for late-game provincial management only.

 

[FortyJ]

DZ
First, it wasn't my proposal...

Second, I think your suggestion makes a lot of sense, despite my personal opinion that there is nothing inherently wrong with a President being a governor (even the only governor) provided the people elect him or her to both positions.

 

[Donovan Zoi]

Oops....duly noted and changed. May I mark you down as a proponent of said plan?

I guess my main concern is that we don't forgo our current system of checks and balances via our branches of government due to these late-game events. We should only alter our laws to deal with this need when the time arises. Of course, that time is now.

Good work on this thread, FortyJ. You seem to have a knack for leading discussion on judiciary matters in an objective manner. Are you sure the bench isn't calling for you in Term 7?

 

[disorganizer]

hmmm.... what about increasing the size of provinces? (hinthint). this will reduce the number of governors and thus reduce the number of needed offices
we had that before, and it works

 

[Gingerbread Man]

Or how about you can go for and get elected into as many governor offices as you like, as long as the only offices you hold are governors.

So I could hold an executive office OR a Judicial office OR a few governor offices.

This would be the equivalent of combining provinces, but with the flexibility of being able to change what area a person controls if the number of candidates rises or falls.

 

[disorganizer]

just to get this thread to the top:
im against it... if one person can get a executive, legislative and jurisdical position at the same time, this is mixing powers. we could then throw our 3 houses system away...

maybe we could allow 1 leader position, but as many deputy positions as you like?

also you should not be allowed to hold positions in different houses of the government at once. so being the domestic leader and deputy governor at the same time, for example, should not be allowed, but being domestic leader, vice president and deputy foreign affairs leader should be.

 

[Shaitan]

We already allow a person to hold 1 leader and unlimited deputy positions.

 

[disorganizer]

so where is the problem? nowhere. we just need to allow running for unlimited positions and allowing to get a deputy position if i win an election and dont want to take the leader-position. i believe at the moment if i am elected for 2 positons and win both elections, then i have to decide which one to take and completely give up the other position?

 

[Chieftess]

Originally posted by disorganizer
hmmm.... what about increasing the size of provinces? (hinthint). this will reduce the number of governors and thus reduce the number of needed offices
we had that before, and it works

I recall you bashing that idea when I first suggested it.

Oh well, live and learn... This is why I made Bohemia large in the first place.

 

[disorganizer]

ct: where? do not point to things which never happened. please if so provide evidence. the plan is that provinces grow and that we sometimes will redesign our provinces like in rl.
which nation had province borders lasting for 1000's of years?

 

[Octavian X]

There is a point in not combinding provcines: You won't see Missouri annexing Kansas any time soon.

I still think we should go for the simpler solution. We should combine provinces to reduce governor's mansions. Remember, next game, (hopefully) we won't have such a large map. That, or intentionally leave provinces empty and let domestic handle 'em

 

[Shaitan]

Another thought: Multiple governor spots are allowed but all restrictions on how many positions you can run for are in effect until the last day of nominations. On that day the restrictions of 1 or 2 offices allowed are removed for any provinces that have zero accepted nominees.