Emperor Cookbook IV: Suryavarman II

[Gumbolt]

We've started, so let's finish.

RJM

I dont think isolated starts are a bad idea. I always find them more of a challenge. As you never seem to know how many troops to build and you sometimes forget to build a decent military.

I do need to work on my early game play. I always find by the time I reach 4 cities I am running low on science beakers due to city upkeep. Beyond spamming cottages or expanding slower not sure how to tackle this. fishing might help in terms of sea commerce.

I felt this was one of the downfalls of my save. Its one of the issues that has shown itself since the jump from Monarch. It could also reflect on fact my games no longer include huts!! That lost 100-300 gold from huts makes a difference.

I am trying to not rely on mids and GLH in some games.

 

[Sleepless]

- 1500BC

Spoiler :

A quick summary as I'm not submitting my game. I settled 1W on the plains hill, second city for rice/cows as most people and 3rd city just to the left of the capital (same positions as feralminded) to cottage up.

With the lack of happies I was going to try and build the Oracle for Monarchy but that was built about 300 years ago but to make up for it I popped gold in the cap as well.

If you are looking to avoid overpowered starts on this map the GLhouse would be huge so perhaps that would be the wonder to avoid building? On the other hand the idea is to win as well.

The other important thing to do on this map is explore. Playing the early immortal universities (learnt from Rusten) early work boats out exploring are a good idea. Admittedly mine haven't got very far yet though.

 

[MkLh]

- 1500BC

Spoiler :

If you are looking to avoid overpowered starts on this map the GLhouse would be huge so perhaps that would be the wonder to avoid building? On the other hand the idea is to win as well.

Spoiler :

Agreed. There has been one GLH - Emperor cookbook already. Do we need to repeat the same formula? The game is likely winnable also without it.

 

[Fleme]

First time poster, long time lurker here, (And I swear to god I'll pop an artery if I get one of those atrocious spam-welcome posts from Supr49er, thank you very much) and I figured I'd start here.

Spoiler :

Started by moving 1w to settle on the plains hill and gain pigs. Techpath went AH-BW-Masonry-Agri-Pottery-Wheel leading up to currently working on Fishing, which will be followed by Sailing. This, to get the GLH in Hariharalaya.

Settled 1 city, built the Great Wall since there was a lot of fog to bust and no strategic resources in sight and settled another city and started on Mids. At the time of the save Mids are 22 turns away and there are 3 forests on the chopping block so I'll get them soon, switch to Representation, research Writing after Sailing and get libraries up. All three cities plus the one planned to the west will be able to run specialists.

I plan to settle on the coasts and build search cities in attempt to gain access to new lands and make use of the GLH-to-be.

 

[plattfuss]

I like JFleme's save. It is maybe not that developed in terms of cottages but it will be quite interesting to see how Pyramids can make up for that. Together with GW that will also give a GP opportunity quite soon.

I wonder a bit tho why you dont use ur workers to do something that brings immediate benefit (like irrigating or cottaging). You can chopp the forests later IMHO.

 

[Fleme]

The chop is just to get the Mids out of the way so I can get Yasodharapura cranking out a settler or two asap. Furthermore, even with those 3 forests chopped the workers will still have time to set up cottages for the capital before the mids finish. Currently it's using the mines.

 

[IPEX-731BA5DD06]

Emperor's cookbook Round 1 1500BC​

To start off, I had a go at round 1 of the Khan, game, I was drunk, and just thought it was such a joke, normal speed, I couldn't play it and wouldn't play it. Sorry but that's my Opinion.

Spoiler :

I start by moving the scout, through the cow's to the forest below exposing the rice, 11 water tiles, 2 fresh water, a great Moai statues site. As such, I move the settler 1 west to the plains hill, to reduce move lap, and settle there, gaining the pigs, forgoing the cow, but keeping 2 floodplains, as I like to go SE or FE or even HE, (Food and Hammer) Economies.

Research initially has been Agriculture, Animal Husbandry, Bronze working. Exploring all the north, nothing to write home about, 2 out lets to the south, or are we Isolated??

2920 BC I heal the scout after a lion attack, and another lion lines up, as I'm in tree's I decide to hold off on Woodsman 1, mistake maybe, but faster healing after 2nd battle, and I have fortify bonus as well. 1st lion moves to flank, and is joined by a 2nd, I move away. I move a out to hill look about move back to forest and find I'm flanked by 2 lions, my scout goes to Woodsman 1, and BEATS BOTH LIONS.

Spoiler :

2225 BC I'm really torn over my 3rd city site, I just can't decide. In the end, I decide 1 east of the sheep to the NE of the Capital, as its coastal, gains another plains hill, 2 grass land tiles, and my 3 workers are already in the area mining a forested hill. I whip the 3rd settler, overflow into a worker, and continue to spam workers while working off the whipping anger. I also need a defender for the city, and Archery, but sailing first. Moai statues makes a work boat for further exploration, using the cow's tile I've improved.

Hmm Angkor Thom, I think should have gone 1 SE, to pick up a flood plain, to enable more food, its a mistake. I pasture sheep, mine post biology.

1600 BC Writings in, I don't whip the Libraries, because that's like whipping away the Scientists, and I'll need them for Sailing/Masonary. Chop the Libraries, work 2 scientist, and get 4th settler ready for next city.

Oh I've found 1 Opponent

Spoiler :

Suleiman, the toolie man, founder of Judaism, and on the far West of the next Continent to our west.

Economies crashed to 40%, Need Libraries to come online to recover.

1500 BC Economies crashed to 10%, 9 beakers, 1 library on line, 2nd due next turn. 3 cities, 5 workers, 2 work boats exploring, 2 barb warriors Lemening in on Angkor Thom.

Discovered 1 opponent. Research; Agriculture, Animal Husbandry, Bronze working, Writing, started on Sailing.

Settled 1 city badly, Angkor Thom, explored all on starting Island, and started on coasting 2nd land mass. Crashed economy, badly placed Angkor Thom, Settler in Production for No 4, Wonder aimed for is Great Lighthouse.

Resources

Spoiler :

No bronze, no horses

Not the best, but I tried.

Spoiler :

Cities;

Capital

Spoiler :

Moai statues

Spoiler :

Angkor Thom

Spoiler :

View attachment 202517

 

[ChrisShaffer]

I thought I'd give this a whirl. I win about 30% of my single player emperor games. I also play SGOTM (Team Smurkz) where I've been learning a *lot* about strategy and tactics.

Spoiler :

Builder strategy with strong defences, no wonders.

Research Agriculture -> Bronze Working -> Animal Husbandry -> Writing -> Wheel -> Pottery

Scout dodged a lot of animals, met Suleiman

Four cities, 6 bpt, 1 cpt, 2 libraries near completion, production city has a barracks, all are ready to whip granaries.

3 archers, 3 warriors, 3 workers, 1 scout, most with promotions

Spoiler :

 

[Soirana]

Spoiler :

One think i do not understand why so much love for a hill sheep city?
It is not even serious food source - 3food on that tile?

Late filler at best in my opinion.

 

[ChrisShaffer]

Spoiler :

One think i do not understand why so much love for a hill sheep city?
It is not even serious food source - 3food on that tile?

Late filler at best in my opinion.

Spoiler :

For me, it was the best place to put the fourth city that wouldn't incur big distance costs. Arguably, I should have delayed the fourth city until I could afford to build it on the western pig/floodplain spot.

 

[plattfuss]

Spoiler :

For me, it was the best place to put the fourth city that wouldn't incur big distance costs. Arguably, I should have delayed the fourth city until I could afford to build it on the western pig/floodplain spot.

The latter would be my preference, too. Still, very competitive save IMO.

 

[Soirana]

My remark was not personal. I saw quite a few other players building in nearly same spot.

It is something that could be discussed and be beneficial to all participants.

My not so humble opinion:

Spoiler :

If i ever settle it - 2E of sheep. Sort of production center

on size four sheep+farmed floodplain+2 plain hills. +1food -few commerce and 11 hammers per turn.

Before CS workshops and everything else making countin ridiculous but with rased happy cap via monarchy.

Sheep+farmed floodplain+riverside grassland farm - +6food [center included]+2hammers - pop 3
two grassland hills - -2food+6hammers - pop2
two plain hills -4food+8 hammers pop2
Total 0 food 18 hammers at size7. If happines would not be an issue at that time you may add one more grassland farm and plains forest but that is two extra pop to gain only tow hammers.

7 pop - 18 hammers is not bad ratio. Still in this case MVP tile is FP which probably can be used by other place.

Another variant would be - 1NE,1N of sheep gaining two farmable grassland due to small lake.
center+sheep+2grassland farms - 5food-4hammers-2commerce
two plain hills+grassland hill uses five food to make 11 hammers
Size 6 15 hammers. Worse but frees up FP. Also leaves to riverside grassland in awful position

Any other opinions/suggestions?

 

[ChrisShaffer]

My remark was not personal. I saw quite a few other players building in nearly same spot.

It is something that could be discussed and be beneficial to all participants.

No worries, I didn't take it personally. I was just explaining why I chose that spot - in the spirit of discussion and beneficial learning. I'd be interested to learn why others chose it as well.

 

[RJM]

My remark was not personal. I saw quite a few other players building in nearly same spot.

It is something that could be discussed and be beneficial to all participants.

My not so humble opinion:

Spoiler :

If i ever settle it - 2E of sheep. Sort of production center

on size four sheep+farmed floodplain+2 plain hills. +1food -few commerce and 11 hammers per turn.

Before CS workshops and everything else making countin ridiculous but with rased happy cap via monarchy.

Sheep+farmed floodplain+riverside grassland farm - +6food [center included]+2hammers - pop 3
two grassland hills - -2food+6hammers - pop2
two plain hills -4food+8 hammers pop2
Total 0 food 18 hammers at size7. If happines would not be an issue at that time you may add one more grassland farm and plains forest but that is two extra pop to gain only tow hammers.

7 pop - 18 hammers is not bad ratio. Still in this case MVP tile is FP which probably can be used by other place.

Another variant would be - 1NE,1N of sheep gaining two farmable grassland due to small lake.
center+sheep+2grassland farms - 5food-4hammers-2commerce
two plain hills+grassland hill uses five food to make 11 hammers
Size 6 15 hammers. Worse but frees up FP. Also leaves to riverside grassland in awful position

Any other opinions/suggestions?

Spoiler :

Although not true for this start, my general attitude iis that during the land grab phase, I take any site that has a food special. I know that many of you will be prepared to capture a city rather than accept a poorer choice, but my style is distinctly pacific.

RJM

 

[Soirana]

Spoiler :

depends on what you define by food special
3F tile? I'd rather settle bunch off grassland with no resources.

I am trying to say that sheep is rather improved mine.

 

[ChrisShaffer]

Spoiler :

If i ever settle it - 2E of sheep. Sort of production center

on size four sheep+farmed floodplain+2 plain hills. +1food -few commerce and 11 hammers per turn.

Before CS workshops and everything else making countin ridiculous but with rased happy cap via monarchy.

Sheep+farmed floodplain+riverside grassland farm - +6food [center included]+2hammers - pop 3
two grassland hills - -2food+6hammers - pop2
two plain hills -4food+8 hammers pop2
Total 0 food 18 hammers at size7. If happines would not be an issue at that time you may add one more grassland farm and plains forest but that is two extra pop to gain only tow hammers.

7 pop - 18 hammers is not bad ratio. Still in this case MVP tile is FP which probably can be used by other place.

Another variant would be - 1NE,1N of sheep gaining two farmable grassland due to small lake.
center+sheep+2grassland farms - 5food-4hammers-2commerce
two plain hills+grassland hill uses five food to make 11 hammers
Size 6 15 hammers. Worse but frees up FP. Also leaves to riverside grassland in awful position

Any other opinions/suggestions?

Spoiler :

My reluctance with 2E sheep is the overlap with the capital and the lack of access to ocean. That said, you make a strong case and the more I look at my screenshot, the more I think 2E would have been a better spot.

 

[pnaxighn]

My remark was not personal. I saw quite a few other players building in nearly same spot.

It is something that could be discussed and be beneficial to all participants.

My not so humble opinion:

Spoiler :

If i ever settle it - 2E of sheep. Sort of production center

on size four sheep+farmed floodplain+2 plain hills. +1food -few commerce and 11 hammers per turn.

Before CS workshops and everything else making countin ridiculous but with rased happy cap via monarchy.

Sheep+farmed floodplain+riverside grassland farm - +6food [center included]+2hammers - pop 3
two grassland hills - -2food+6hammers - pop2
two plain hills -4food+8 hammers pop2
Total 0 food 18 hammers at size7. If happines would not be an issue at that time you may add one more grassland farm and plains forest but that is two extra pop to gain only tow hammers.

7 pop - 18 hammers is not bad ratio. Still in this case MVP tile is FP which probably can be used by other place.

Another variant would be - 1NE,1N of sheep gaining two farmable grassland due to small lake.
center+sheep+2grassland farms - 5food-4hammers-2commerce
two plain hills+grassland hill uses five food to make 11 hammers
Size 6 15 hammers. Worse but frees up FP. Also leaves to riverside grassland in awful position

Any other opinions/suggestions?

Spoiler :

You're a better player than me, so I'm sure you're right. But if you notice in my save I settled 2E1N of the sheep, which loses one riverside grassland, but is otherwise very similar...except it's on a plains hill. So you get an initial production boost, and a slight max production boost. Maybe not good, but another alternative.

 

[ChromiumL]

Spoiler :

I moved my scout south and the rice tempted me to move down to the spot that hits all three food resources. But, I decided against it. Instead I settled 1E of start to reduce overlap with a city I planed to place to the south that would get pigs/rice (debated on 2E but wanted extra production from plains hill).

I decided to try something that I haven't done before research-wise. The obvious first choice (to me) was AH so that I could use those yummy cows (and pigs when I got to them). After that, I teched directly to writing and chopped out some libs asap. I 'think' this worked well--but I will let you be the judges . After writing I had to do BW because by this time I was beginning to realize barbs might be an issue. Of course, no copper in sight . Then I went straight for Pottery (Irrigation & the wheel). When I realized that there was nobody else on the landmass I went ahead and teched fishing so that I could make a boat to scout around (one is being built now). Next (I think) was masonry for (hopefully) the pyramids. Finally working on archery (6 turns).

As far as cities go, my first choice was obvious. I settled on the grasslands hill that would 'potentially' be able to get cows, rice, and pigs (for now though they just get rice/pigs). I debated going a little further out, but decided against it. My third city is a planned production city that is 2E of the sheep. I wanted to be able to get at least one FP, which is why I went for 2E rather than 1.

Other than that, I did some serious fog-busting which have made barbs pretty much a non-issue (the land to the west still has some space for spawning though...). This is part of why I waited so long for archery--I hadn't really needed it yet (but will soon when axes come along!).

I am getting 23 beakers per turn, breaking even at 50% tax rate. I get my first great scientist in 4 turns in Hari-whatever (geez, I need to pick a civ that has easy to spell/remember city names next time!). I have 3 workers (should probably have one more), and a ton of warriors.

Points of note--Working on pyramids (with pretty much no progress so far). I think it is still possible to get with some serious chopping. Haven't met any other civs yet, but I suspect some are on that landmass to the west of ours.

 

[Soirana]

Spoiler :

*planned production city* - worker is cottaging FP.

Goes to check his views about reality.

 

[ChrisShaffer]

Spoiler :

After that, I teched directly to literature and chopped out some libs asap. I 'think' this worked well--but I will let you be the judges .

Spoiler :

I think you got writing, not literature, eh? Literature is quite a bit farther along the tech path!