Feature or Bug? Exhausted resource comes back in same place!

[Lt. 'Killer' M.]

ah, OK, will do!

 

[Lt. 'Killer' M.]

sumthinelse: I finally found time to play around with the iron thing you made. Will post on that once I have significant number of tries later today!

 

[sumthinelse]

OK Killer, I'll be watching.

I guess we could append the results of this to the "bugs and problems" thread after we find out a little more, although this may be working exactly as designed, so it's not clear to me whether I should call it a "bug." Sometimes the word "bug" is kind of subjective.

When I was a programmer, not so long ago, and probably will be again soon, there were several ways to close a problem report:

• programming error -- need to fix it
  
• permanent restriction -- it may be a bug but we will never fix it.
  
• suggestion -- that might be a good thing to change
  
• fix it in next release -- this was a very popular one, because you could procrastinate a bug for many releases.
  
• working as designed (WAD) -- you might think it's a bug, but that's the way we wanted it to work.
  
• etc. etc.
  

 

[Lt. 'Killer' M.]

it gets very confusing, the worse the oftener I try.....
the last time, the iron didn't even go exhausted!!!!!!!

 

[Lt. 'Killer' M.]

correction, the first time I set production to swordsman manually (!) it started to dissappear and move around! ??????? WTH?????


edit: nope, that's not it, it starts at the same time as the first cultur expansion of the capital!

 

[Lt. 'Killer' M.]

it is way strange... usually, everything works as advertised. Will now play a game until all other res are visible, maybe they are blocking some places.

 

[Lt. 'Killer' M.]

conclusions up to now: res outside anyones territory do not move. (obvious)

res inside ones territory not connected may or may not be exhausted. sometimes, they stick around for millenia, sometimes they are part of the normal cycles of coming and going. if they are, they seems to come back in the same place awfully often.

enemy res do not seem to move at all!!!!! at least, they stick to the same places for 25 turns now...... but I'll have to check if there's any place they could move.

 

[Lt. 'Killer' M.]

I have yet to see a saltpeter move....... ratio 800, but it stays

 

[sumthinelse]

Originally posted by Lt. 'Killer' M.
it gets very confusing, the worse the oftener I try.....
the last time, the iron didn't even go exhausted!!!!!!!

In that game I uploaded in iron.zip it always exhausts if the human player has iron connected in his territory because I set the "disappearance ratio" to 1 (that means 1 chance in 1 of depletion). That might make your testing easier. I can change it in a game in progress (with a hex editor) to be 1/1 (100% probability) if you need me to do that. And of course I can do that with other resources.

 

[Lt. 'Killer' M.]

sumthinelse, I started the game several times, and in one of these it didn't get exhausted, whatever the setting was, and in another, everything was as it should be, and in another, I now see only the hooked up ones get exhausted, and at the same time the AI ones never move (though that might be because ther's no room to move to - we'd need a different game that I will try tomorrow where there's fwerer res / territory). Since all these starts use the same game, I'd say there's something wrong for sure. I'll go on with the alst one into Modern Times to check the other res, then post the results and various saves for you to doublecheck here.

 

[Lt. 'Killer' M.]

to clarify: not hooked up but in territory should exhust to, Firaxis claimed, but it doesn't do so sometimes

 

[sumthinelse]

Originally posted by Lt. 'Killer' M.
sumthinelse, I started the game several times, and in one of these it didn't get exhausted, whatever the setting was, and in another, everything was as it should be, and in another, I now see only the hooked up ones get exhausted, and at the same time the AI ones never move (though that might be because ther's no room to move to - we'd need a different game that I will try tomorrow where there's fwerer res / territory). Since all these starts use the same game, I'd say there's something wrong for sure. I'll go on with the alst one into Modern Times to check the other res, then post the results and various saves for you to doublecheck here.

I just tried the saved game i.sav. 10 times out of 10 the iron near Berlin was exhausted on my machine. It always moved to the mountain to the right of Berlin I think.

I may need to remove the other iron resource to the left of Berlin because I think that may be keeping it from returning to the same place.

The "remember random seed" is turned off in this game, because if it always does the same thing that doesn't tell us anything.

Unless you set the "disappearance probability" to a lower value (AFAIK 1 means 1/1, 2 means 1/2, etc.) and turn the "remember random seed" off, you are going to have to wait a very long time for very few test results.

Gross gluck fur Deutschland und Ollie!

 

[Barenziahlover]

In poker the chance of you getting than royal flush is 1 out of 300,000 per hand dealth. You can have 300,000 desk of card than take 5 card from the top of each one than you have than petty good
change of not haveing than royal flush as the number of hand being dealth have no
meaning just the odd / hand being dealth.

 

[Barenziahlover]

Oh I forget than all the games of poker I
player I only saw the Royal Flush once or twice only.

 

[Evincar]

Originally posted by Lt. 'Killer' M.
I have yet to see a saltpeter move....... ratio 800, but it stays

Well, I guess my games compensate yours, because saltpeter seems to be quite unstable in my computer. I once had 2 salpeters tiles dissapear in 3 turns!!! Horrible, I could not make cavalry anymore, so I had to beeline to infantry and pray they didn't atack me. Well, God listened me so it was not that bad.

 

[Ezekyel]

In my last game, with 1,21 patch, standar map, all my resources exhausted came back in the same tile.
By the ways is there an option to turn off that feature?

 

[Raiden]

It's never happened to me.

 

[Lt. 'Killer' M.]

One quick update:

resources that are not hooked up to the trade network do not dissappear.

 

[Lt. 'Killer' M.]

another strange thing is that the routine responsible for the res jumping obviously isn't what we expected. I have several times seen a pop-up saying exhausted, found new, exhausted in the smae tile in 1 turn!

Also, you may see the new one found before the old one is depleted (made sure of that with a map with only two iron, easy to keep track of them).

 

[sumthinelse]

I'm not sure that the poll in this thread will give valid results. Since iron's default disappearance probability is 1/800 and there are only 500 or so moves in a game, and it may take 100 moves or so to discover iron working and build a road, (and sometimes we abandon a game and start a new one), our memories of how it worked may come from patches before 1.21f.

I voted "hardly ever" but would change my vote now that I studied the phenomenon. But really, I think it depends on the nearness of other resources, so another poll option is needed.