Feudilism,does anyone actually use it?

[Longasc]

BTW: CORRUPTION

The Designers did not implement corruption to reflection today's REAL corruption.

It is merely to stop ever-expanding civilizations to become all powerful by sheer production and wealth.

Corruption CUTS the benefits of growing more and more greatly, as we all know.

Communism is the only government that can have dozens of cities and have the far away cities still productive.

I see the drawback of communism that you can no longer rush with money, and thus the small newly captured cities cannot rush an airport e.g. immediately.

Okay, back to topic - I think Communism became rather powerful with Conquests / 1.15b.

 

[MiChello]

I agree with arretium, maybe we ought to bring back one of the things the democratic greeks did as well: Have a vote every year to put one of the inhabitants of the particulary town into exile for the next year

 

[Pook]

I had never used feudalism, because I couldn't find any real advantages to it. In fact, I kept looking for an opportunity to use it. I found one this past weekend when I needed to go to war in ancient times with five towns and one city. Feudalism supports 27 units, monarchy only 14, so my gpt was much better during the war.

I agree with the multitude of previous posts that say it should be improved or replaced. There must be SOME reason that much of Western Europe used feudalism as a form of government for several hundred years.

 

[kb2tvl]

I have never used feudalism but I think this can be a powerful gov if your country is fairly small and you want to use all land possible and have only a barracks and temple in your cities.

 

[Vietcong]

i whold like to see

1. abslut monahy, acent and midevill kind

2. fundamentalism

3.constatinol monarchy

4. orgliarchy, or a trible goverment thing for a earlyer goverment befor despotims

 

[widdowmaker]

Off-topic but about types of government.

The type of government model runs on at least two scales like on a X-Y plane. One axis is for degree of economic control and the other is for degree of political control.

I think there should be a better design of government model in the next CIV edition.

Right now I fail to see the difference between a republic and democracy, say. Lots of republics around the world ARE democratic, France for example. Plenty more monarchies are democractic as "constitutional monarchy".

Wipe those thoughts away. You need to be taught what a government is.


Republic: Exaomles, America, France.

In a republic there are many city/states (americas 50 states). Each state elects its own leader, and those leaders elect one supreme leader. Each State leader represents that state in the "Congress"betweent he supreme leader andthe state leaders.


Democracy: Example, None.

In a true democracy every citizen votes on every issue at all times. Every citizen of a nation would vote onhow much to put towards a military budget, all records of the government are public. Every citizen of a town votes on wether or not to build that new super-market. Everyone and i mean EVERYONE regarless of age, votes on EVERYTHING. Wether or not to ban a book, what to call a TV station, what i will read at night, ect ect. Acient greece did this. Every year they would go into a town square and vote on like, 150 issues for the coming year. All the towns did this and then sent the votes to the capital. Once in the capital it was counted and decided, in the publics eye. They counted the votes outloud and in the Town Square.

Once done counting runners were sent back to the towns to tell the results.


Monarchy: Example, none.

Supreme rule by a man or woman chosen by god to lead their people.

 

[Blasphemous]

widdowmaker, Democracy isn't necessarily Complete, All-out, Direct Democracy.
A country where every citizen above a certain age can vote for a certain party according to that party's policy is also a Democracy. Just not as direct.

 

[pelmeister]

Feudalism is quite good when you are expanding your territory a long way from your capital - eg on islands - as you can rush production. This is particularly true when the territory in question is food rich - eg flood plains with wheat. Your people hate you, but hey...

 

[Blasphemous]

Originally posted by Vietcong
i whold like to see

1. abslut monahy, acent and midevill kind

2. fundamentalism

3.constatinol monarchy

4. orgliarchy, or a trible goverment thing for a earlyer goverment befor despotims

You might wanna look out for my mod then (see sig).
Next alpha release (probably within a day or two) will include Absolute Monarchy (rename of current Monarchy), Constitutional Monarchy, Feudal Monarchy (rename of Feudalism), Republican Monarchy, and more.

</shameless plug>

 

[kvasir]

Originally posted by Blasphemous

You might wanna look out for my mod then (see sig).
Next alpha release (probably within a day or two) will include Absolute Monarchy (rename of current Monarchy), Constitutional Monarchy, Feudal Monarchy (rename of Feudalism), Republican Monarchy, and more.

</shameless plug>

What's republican monarchy? examples?

 

[wlievens]

Maybe an elected King? J/K

 

[arretium]

Originally posted by Blasphemous
widdowmaker, Democracy isn't necessarily Complete, All-out, Direct Democracy.
A country where every citizen above a certain age can vote for a certain party according to that party's policy is also a Democracy. Just not as direct.

No, that's incorrect. I do disagree with Widowmaker's intrepretation of democracy only in the sense that the voting age must be unrestricted. Infants are physically incapable of voting. But Widowmaker is right. A democracy means that the people decide, and they decide directly. They don't vote for leaders who decide. When you vote for leaders who decide that's not a democracy, that's a republic. The U.S. is a fine example of a republic. Ancient Athens is a fine example of a democracy.

 

[kvasir]

One thing for certain though, is that the word "democracy", as it is used in CIV III does not refer to (or was it intended to anyway)the type that was exercised in Ancient Athens. That's why there is much confusion we've seen between a republic and a democracy.

On a side note, then you have the Democractic People's Republic of Korea, which in reality is really a dictatorship or fascist communist state... Try simulate THAT in CIV.

 

[kvasir]

Originally posted by wlievens
Maybe an elected King? J/K

Actually a number of ruling Scandinavian monarchies were elected when the crowns were reinstored. Somebody correct me if i'm wrong, the Bernadotte of Sweden was one of them, no?

They don't elect kings / queens regularly of course but in Malaysia they do. A constitutional monarchy, Malaysia elects its king from one of its 9 member states (or sultanate?) once every 5 years. Similarly with the United Arab Emirates.

But are they republics? probably not...

 

[arretium]

Originally posted by kvasir
One thing for certain though, is that the word "democracy", as it is used in CIV III does not refer to (or was it intended to anyway)the type that was exercised in Ancient Athens. That's why there is much confusion we've seen between a republic and a democracy.

On a side note, then you have the Democractic People's Republic of Korea, which in reality is really a dictatorship or fascist communist state... Try simulate THAT in CIV.

Perhaps the designers themselves confused the meaning of Democracy and Republic. I hope that in Civ4 they come out with an ancient democracy. That would be cool.

On a semantic note I would like to point out that a "fascist communist" is a contradiction in terms. Both terms mean a government that exercises absolute control, but the ideology used for that government comes from opposite ends of the political spectrum. Communism is the extreme form of socialism. Facism is an extreme form of neo-conservativism. Think Communism far left, Facism far right.

 

[kvasir]

Originally posted by arretium

On a semantic note I would like to point out that a "fascist communist" is a contradiction in terms. Both terms mean a government that exercises absolute control, but the ideology used for that government comes from opposite ends of the political spectrum. Communism is the extreme form of socialism. Facism is an extreme form of neo-conservativism. Think Communism far left, Facism far right.

hmm... some would argue that it would be ok for such a government to be labelled as a "fascist communist" state when the two descriptions can be located on a 2-D spectrum instead. Here of course "Communism" i had referred to as an economic term. One axis for economic control, the other political control as I've mentioned in couple posts above.

For ex.:

Fascism
|
Anarchy
---------- Communism <---> Capitalism

http://www.majbill.vt.edu/geog/geog1014/TOPICS/109ec_dev/lt_rt.html

In CIV, the designers have lumped the political and economic spectra together in the game model for the purpose of calculating unit production and corruption etc. This is understandable given all the possible combinations of governments we can have, it's much easier to go with the linear model.

 

[Blasphemous]

A Republic means a group of states/city-states/provinces each elects its own leaders that then govern the entire nation (or something similar).
A Democracy doesn't have to be divided like this, there are plenty of modern countries where all citizens elect a government.

About the "Republican Monarchy" in my mod, the idea is something like what went on in rome, where there was an Emperor, and a Senate. It is placed where Republic is in the unmodded game (in a tech called "The Senate"), and Republic is moved to where Democracy is in unmodded civ. Democracy is available after Sanitation. Constitutional monarchy is available with Printing Press.
Btw, I would love to be corrected about the way I represent the Republican Monarchy as a militarstic government that gives a trade bonus and high unit support but also high support costs. I really am not very knowledgable in this field. (If you do want to correct me, please do so in my mod's thread.)

 

[pelmeister]

Originally posted by kvasir
On a side note, then you have the Democractic People's Republic of Korea, which in reality is really a dictatorship or fascist communist state... Try simulate THAT in CIV.

Clearly this one is a famine one - you could have only one food production in city centre and food production suffers from corruption. It could have accelerated capabilities of developing good military tech - its espionage chances are higher than average and it gets a 50% bonus when selling techs to rogue nations

 

[wlievens]

kvasir: www.politicalcompass.org

 

[Frostyboy]

I still ufind Feudalism the best