FfH2 0.16 Bug Thread

[SchpailsMan]

I agree. Technically speaking, agressive AI does increase the tendency of the AI to declare war, and not only to human players. But really the diplomatics part of the game could use a little tweaking.

About the embargo thing, relations tend to improve over time. I find that I usually manage to get open borders with most civs after a while provided religious differences don't kill diplo outright.

 

[felwar]

Something with my hidden nationality mercenaries seems buggy to me, but I'm probably just not understanding a mechanic.

1) Where can they move? I seem to be able to send them into an allies lands where I have open borders (only to have that ally kill them), but when I try to send them into enemy lands it prompts me to declare war first. This seems backwards to me, but maybe it's a bug?

2) Who is supposed to get the various metal weapon promotions? My mercenaries get it but no one else does. This also feels odd to me.

 

[Sureshot]

About the embargo thing, relations tend to improve over time.

ive never had relations improve over time.. people always get more and more upset as you refuse their demands or concede to them (usually making someone else more upset)

 

[SchpailsMan]

I did, no later than yesterday night Tsakune was mad at me just for existing (-1 religious differences) but something like 30 turns later we signed an OB agreement and started trading. In between, I sold him my world map and teched to Astronomy which allowed resource trading between us, it might have helped.

 

[Teg_Navanis]

Traceback (most recent call last):

File "CvScreensInterface", line 585, in handleInput

File "CvMainInterface", line 5257, in handleInput

File "CvMainInterface", line 507, in getPlotListButtonName

File "CvMainInterface", line 1760, in showUnitInfoPane

ZeroDivisionError: float division
ERR: Python function handleInput failed, module CvScreensInterface


happened when a hill giant was plagued, which led to an infinite healing time.

 

[Kael]

Something with my hidden nationality mercenaries seems buggy to me, but I'm probably just not understanding a mechanic.

1) Where can they move? I seem to be able to send them into an allies lands where I have open borders (only to have that ally kill them), but when I try to send them into enemy lands it prompts me to declare war first. This seems backwards to me, but maybe it's a bug?

One of the oddities of the way hidden nationality is implemented is that it doesnt apply when the units are in your cities. The reason I did that is I want your hidden nationality units to be "safe" when they are in your cities (so your allies dont wander along and kill them).

The side effect of this is that if you do pathing while the unit is still in one of your cities it paths just like a non-hidden nationality unit (the game doesnt realize that the unit will be hidden nationality as soon as it steps out fo the city). So I suspect that you are seeing what you are because the unit is still in a city. If you start walking towards your opponents border by the time he gets there he will be able to cross without declaring well.

2) Who is supposed to get the various metal weapon promotions? My mercenaries get it but no one else does. This also feels odd to me.

Just mercenaries and doviello melee units (so if your arent playing the doviello it just mercenaries).

 

[Kael]

Traceback (most recent call last):

File "CvScreensInterface", line 585, in handleInput

File "CvMainInterface", line 5257, in handleInput

File "CvMainInterface", line 507, in getPlotListButtonName

File "CvMainInterface", line 1760, in showUnitInfoPane

ZeroDivisionError: float division
ERR: Python function handleInput failed, module CvScreensInterface


happened when a hill giant was plagued, which led to an infinite healing time.

Could you send me a save of this Teg, Im unable to reproduce.

 

[felwar]

One of the oddities of the way hidden nationality is implemented is that it doesnt apply when the units are in your cities. The reason I did that is I want your hidden nationality units to be "safe" when they are in your cities (so your allies dont wander along and kill them).

The side effect of this is that if you do pathing while the unit is still in one of your cities it paths just like a non-hidden nationality unit (the game doesnt realize that the unit will be hidden nationality as soon as it steps out fo the city). So I suspect that you are seeing what you are because the unit is still in a city. If you start walking towards your opponents border by the time he gets there he will be able to cross without declaring well.

Ah thanks a lot Kael, that is likely exactly what happened.

 

[pa12ick]

I'm not sure if this is a bug or just a "balance issue" but I noticed for the first time that the Trojan Horse cannot attack at all. It was fine before when you could use it to explore opponent territory that don't have an open borders agreement with you. However, now that just about every opponent has Hidden Nationality units, they can (and do) just gang up on you and destroy the T.H. Since it only has a move of 1, and cannot attack to save itself or to take advantage of the terrain, it's a pretty useless unit now. Is this what you intended?

 

[Kael]

I'm not sure if this is a bug or just a "balance issue" but I noticed for the first time that the Trojan Horse cannot attack at all. It was fine before when you could use it to explore opponent territory that don't have an open borders agreement with you. However, now that just about every opponent has Hidden Nationality units, they can (and do) just gang up on you and destroy the T.H. Since it only has a move of 1, and cannot attack to save itself or to take advantage of the terrain, it's a pretty useless unit now. Is this what you intended?

Yeap, thats the advantage of hidden nationality units, that you can attack units you aren't at war with.

 

[Teg_Navanis]

Could you send me a save of this Teg, Im unable to reproduce.

Didn't have a save, used worldbuilder instead:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/81346/zero_division.Civ4SavedGame

And here the faulty line:

			iTurnsToHeal 		= int((fMaxStrength-fCurrStrength)/float(fMaxStrength*float(mt.getPlotHealFactor(pUnit))*0.01)+0.999) # force to round upwards

The problem is that mt.getPlotHealFactor(pUnit) equals 0 in this case, which leads to an unallowed (undefined) zero division.

 

[Kael]

Didn't have a save, used worldbuilder instead:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/81346/zero_division.Civ4SavedGame

And here the faulty line:

			iTurnsToHeal 		= int((fMaxStrength-fCurrStrength)/float(fMaxStrength*float(mt.getPlotHealFactor(pUnit))*0.01)+0.999) # force to round upwards

The problem is that mt.getPlotHealFactor(pUnit) equals 0 in this case, which leads to an unallowed (undefined) zero division.

Thanks man, you are awesome as always.

Hey, I was considering your recommendation about PoN being to good. You think boosting it from 300 to 500 hammers will even things out? I would really hate to have to nerf the stooges.

 

[Teg_Navanis]

I'd favour moving them to a later tech. As some have pointed out, they aren't overpowered when strong enough counter-units are around when you get them, but only when you can get them early and bring them to combat V before hunters arrive. I dunno if you find this too big of a change. The problem with increasing production cost is that they may become less attractive if you don't get them early enough.

 

[Teg_Navanis]

Hidden nationality combat is still unreliable. Sometimes the unit moves on an occupied plot, sometimes it can attack several times a round.

Here's a savegame: attack Lammas Mead with Moe and you'll see that he can attack a second time.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/81346/multi-attack.Civ4SavedGame

BTW: I already wiped out two civs on deity level, just with the Stooges


Edit: Oh, and I lose too much movement points when attacking a unit on enemy land (considering that I have the commando promotion)

 

[Kael]

Hidden nationality combat is still unreliable. Sometimes the unit moves on an occupied plot, sometimes it can attack several times a round.

Here's a savegame: attack Lammas Mead with Moe and you'll see that he can attack a second time.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/81346/multi-attack.Civ4SavedGame

BTW: I already wiped out two civs on deity level, just with the Stooges


Edit: Oh, and I lose too much movement points when attacking a unit on enemy land (considering that I have the commando promotion)

I cant reproduce it, even with your save game. Are you running patch "a"?

 

[Teg_Navanis]

Yep, I am, and I can easily reproduce the bug every time I reload. Well, I'll check the savegame again when I download patch B - maybe the bug will magically disappear

 

[KingKeeper]

I love this mod, its far better then the orginal game this was allready great ^^

I mostly play with Ljosalfar and i have some Question about them:

1. Why they are a "neutral" Civ? Normaly they are a Good Civ with the Darkelves (Svartalfs) as the Counterpart. I know they had a hard Time in the Age of Ice but they are still on the Way of Life. So why they are "only" neutral?

2. Why they have access to Baron Duin Halfmon, Typhoid Mary, Trojan Horse and Meshabber of Dis?

Duin Halfmon is a Werwolf and i think Ljosalfar hate Werwolfs (Gilden Silveric?). Typhoid Mary is a plague Carrier, normaly destroys every life. Isnt this against the way of Nature of the Elves? Trojan Horse is a bit a Mechanical Unit so more for the Science using Civs and Meshabber of Dis is a far too evil Unit for Good/neutral Civs.

I know that they need Herounits for balancing but when i play them, i have the Feeling that they dont Match with the Rest of the Ljosalfar theme.

-narf... seems i have some wierd problems with my IE, i delete the post in the right Thread and replaced it here- sorry guys :/

 

[Kael]

Yep, I am, and I can easily reproduce the bug every time I reload. Well, I'll check the savegame again when I download patch B - maybe the bug will magically disappear

Werid, I do have some changes into my copy but I rolled back to flat 016a to see if one of those changes fixed it and it still worked fine for me.

 

[Kael]

I love this mod, its far better then the orginal game this was allready great ^^

I mostly play with Ljosalfar and i have some Question about them:

1. Why they are a "neutral" Civ? Normaly they are a Good Civ with the Darkelves (Svartalfs) as the Counterpart. I know they had a hard Time in the Age of Ice but they are still on the Way of Life. So why they are "only" neutral?

Arendel is actually good while Thessa and Amelachier are neutral. So its the only civ that gives you a choice of what alignment you want to start as.

2. Why they have access to Baron Duin Halfmon, Typhoid Mary, Trojan Horse and Meshabber of Dis?

Duin Halfmon is a Werwolf and i think Ljosalfar hate Werwolfs (Gilden Silveric?). Typhoid Mary is a plague Carrier, normaly destroys every life. Isnt this against the way of Nature of the Elves? Trojan Horse is a bit a Mechanical Unit so more for the Science using Civs and Meshabber of Dis is a far too evil Unit for Good/neutral Civs.

I know that they need Herounits for balancing but when i play them, i have the Feeling that they dont Match with the Rest of the Ljosalfar theme.

The heroes you mentioned are available to any civ. We tend not to force players into any particular mode. If you want to play the elves and have them start worshipping the Ashen Veil, summoning demons, create Meshabber, and be nasty than we aren't going to keep you from doing that. It is your game to play.

If you prefer to stay neutral (or good depending on your leader) and follow the Fellowship of Leaves, not build Duin or Typhoid Mary because you don't think it matches their flavor. Then that is your option as well.

We (the FfH team) create the world, but from that point on the story that happens is yours.

Some AI leaders do prefer certain activities, the Ljosalfar always rush to try to found the Fellowship of Leaves first when they are controlled by the AI. And they generally won't convert to other religions (it can happen, but they stringly prefer the Fellowship).

So the AI will tend to play out as you have described. But when you play them they become whatever you want. Follow the Order and they will become good, even with Amelachier and Thessa. Follow the Veil and they will become evil.

 

[Teg_Navanis]

Werid, I do have some changes into my copy but I rolled back to flat 016a to see if one of those changes fixed it and it still worked fine for me.

And I reinstalled patch a and Moe can still attack twice.