First Game at Regent

[WeirdoJoker]

Tiny map, Iroquois, Continents-80%. Normal climate, 4BYO, temperate. I also set barbarians to none (probably a big mistake, in retrospect ... no goodie huts) and AI aggression level to "Least." Opponents are England, France & India.

Problem: the year is 280 AD, and I haven't met the other civs yet ... I have a continent and several smaller continents/islands, basically half the map to myself, resulting in having about 48% of the map under my control and 65% of the population.

Problems: I only have 3 resources so far - Horses, Iron and Ivory. That's it. And because I cannot sell off the extensive surpluses, I have no money and lose some even with no research just to keep the Lux slider in a safe position (or use clowns to control, where possible). Plus, I have no fresh water, so until I learn Electricity my AGRI trait is useless.

So I'm kind of stuck ... the only thing I can think of is to switch gears on research - if I can maintain any of it - and get to the point where I can cross the ocean to meet the other Civs, at which point I can probably (hopefully?) pick up some land area in order to achieve a Domination victory ... was originally hoping for a Spaceship, but I don't think I can maintain the necessary research level at this point.

So, any ideas on how to proceed? SAV is attached (at least, I think I did it right..).

 

[CKS]

After looking at the save, but not playing it:

First, find the AI using "suicide galleys." You have the Great Lighthouse, so your galleys can go 4 tiles per turn and they can start on sea tiles. Send them out into the unknown ocean, going in different directions. If they don't find land, hope some survive to keep going the next turn. I expect you'll find the AI in one or two turns. It looks like you haven't gone anywhere that you didn't know was safe. Even if you aren't ready to send the galleys out on long ocean journeys, you can test the waters by sending them out 2 tiles and then back to safety. On a tiny archepelago map this will probably let you find most of the islands.

Second, you are drowning in unit support, paying 192 gpt. You don't need any military right now, since you have no rivals. Disbanding your warriors will give you 34 gpt (plus 34 shields if you disband them in towns that are building something). Disband the chariots, archers, and spearmen, too, for another 36 gpt. I'd get rid of more units (like all slow movers and at least half of your mounted warriors), but you may not be comfortable with that. Stop building military units. Some of the towns building mounted warriors don't have libraries or courthouses; switch to them instead. You appear to be playing with Accelerated Production; this probably encourages your overproduction of units.

If you want to win by spaceship, you need to get to education (for universities) ASAP. You want libraries in all of your towns that aren't completely corrupt. Here you need to build libraries, harbors, and courthouses, not mounted warriors. Disband units in towns that are building these improvements. Finish invention, then beeline education. Then astronomy, then theory of gravity. Prebuild so you can build Copernicus' Observatory and Newton's University in big-commerce cities (the same one is okay, or in two different ones). Maybe the AI will research some techs for you, but don't count on it.

Until you meet the AI you won't know the real situation, but I don't see any reason to believe that you are behind. None of the middle-age wonders have been built. If you'd like to switch to domination, you can probably do that easily - don't disband your mounted warriors and ancient cavalry in this case, and build more galleys - but spaceship should work out fine.

 

[WeirdoJoker]

First, find the AI using "suicide galleys." You have the Great Lighthouse, so your galleys can go 4 tiles per turn and they can start on sea tiles. Send them out into the unknown ocean, going in different directions. If they don't find land, hope some survive to keep going the next turn. I expect you'll find the AI in one or two turns. It looks like you haven't gone anywhere that you didn't know was safe. Even if you aren't ready to send the galleys out on long ocean journeys, you can test the waters by sending them out 2 tiles and then back to safety. On a tiny archepelago map this will probably let you find most of the islands.

Got it. This had completely not occurred to me, and it seems I can risk losing some in the middle of the ocean in order to make this work.

Second, you are drowning in unit support, paying 192 gpt. You don't need any military right now, since you have no rivals. Disbanding your warriors will give you 34 gpt (plus 34 shields if you disband them in towns that are building something). Disband the chariots, archers, and spearmen, too, for another 36 gpt. I'd get rid of more units (like all slow movers and at least half of your mounted warriors), but you may not be comfortable with that. Stop building military units. Some of the towns building mounted warriors don't have libraries or courthouses; switch to them instead. You appear to be playing with Accelerated Production; this probably encourages your overproduction of units.

I hadn't thought of this either, but it did occur to me I might be overproducing military units. I just didn't see what else to do in most of those towns after building libraries and the occasional Colosseum (only to stave off unhappiness, I'm just as happy without them for purposes of this game). Plus, I missed one town where I thought I had built a library and hadn't, so I switch to that right away. Combining this with the first suggestion, I'll switch from military units to galleys for exploration purposes, and if necessary transportation later on down the road to achieve Domination (which I might be able to accomplish more quickly than the Spaceship). Also, switching to Courthouses in many cases in the off-continent towns, along with Harbors and the occasional Aqueduct (and one Temple to control for happiness, where corruption is minor).

If you want to win by spaceship, you need to get to education (for universities) ASAP. You want libraries in all of your towns that aren't completely corrupt. Here you need to build libraries, harbors, and courthouses, not mounted warriors. Disband units in towns that are building these improvements. Finish invention, then beeline education. Then astronomy, then theory of gravity. Prebuild so you can build Copernicus' Observatory and Newton's University in big-commerce cities (the same one is okay, or in two different ones). Maybe the AI will research some techs for you, but don't count on it.

This is what I was planning ... finish Invention (so I can build Leonardo's Workshop), then switch & go for all the science I can. Not sure what I can prebuild for Copernicus' and Newton's at this point, as they're pretty far away right now (but I'll try to think of something).

Until you meet the AI you won't know the real situation, but I don't see any reason to believe that you are behind. None of the middle-age wonders have been built. If you'd like to switch to domination, you can probably do that easily - don't disband your mounted warriors and ancient cavalry in this case, and build more galleys - but spaceship should work out fine.

Thanks. All the tips are appreciated.

 

[justanick]

I hadn't thought of this either, but it did occur to me I might be overproducing military units. I just didn't see what else to do in most of those towns after building libraries and the occasional Colosseum (only to stave off unhappiness, I'm just as happy without them for purposes of this game).

Well, you can build units just to disband them at 75% discount elsewhere so you have courthouses etc. everywhere. If for some weird reason you run even out of useful buildings worth building, than you should put your production on wealth. That way you at least avoid running out of money that you need for full research.

 

[CKS]

Not sure what I can prebuild for Copernicus' and Newton's at this point, as they're pretty far away right now (but I'll try to think of something).

If you build them in a city that isn't the capital, you can prebuild with the palace. Just plan ahead and start the palace so that you hit 400 shields about the time that you expect to learn astronomy. If you get rid of your crushing unit support costs, you'll start to research pretty fast - astronomy isn't that far away.

 

[Speedbird 95]

I accidentally cycled to the next turn before I could fix all the disordered cities. Set preferences to "always wait at end of turn"! Then you can check the domestic advisor for unhappiness before pressing enter.

I was thinking about the situation. My plans would be...

(1) set science to zero until you learn education from the great library. You will need the cash for rushing stuff anyway...
(2) disband units as CKS recommended
(3) set all coastal cities to build harbors and/or galleys.
(4) India owns the colossus ... in London! also the temple of Artemis. Your number one target! Take it with ancient cavalry.
(5) If going for space, consider rushing a new palace in London with your first leader, then cash-rushing improvements (harbor/market/library/university) ASAP, then starting a pre-build for Copernicus, Shakespeare's and Newton's wonders all in the same city.

 

[WeirdoJoker]

Well, I ended up switching to and winning a Domination victory. After wiping out England's only two towns (including the capital), I sat for a while & built up to take over France. Took over 3 towns including the capital, lost one, then won it back, then made peace in exchange for its remaining town, leaving only the (new) capital. It gave time for the other towns to calm down while I went & took the capital for the defeat. In the meantime, I switched in some areas (including cash rushing a couple Temples in the former France) to cultural buildings that would expand my borders peacefully, which gave me the final win. My high score to date (by nearly 2,000 points) and a win at Regent on my first try. Will continue at Regent for a while & see what happens, but I enjoyed seeing myself identified as Hiawatha the Magnificent at the end.

 

[CKS]

Congratulations! (And, just so you know, it looks like there is a spot above Magnificent, but there isn't. You are now the best.)

 

[WeirdoJoker]

Congratulations! (And, just so you know, it looks like there is a spot above Magnificent, but there isn't. You are now the best.)

Thanks! I did think there was another spot. I've now been all but two spots - the two directly below "Magnificent" (and I didn't write down what they were, so I guess I'll have to either hit "Magnificent" again, or close to it).

 

[WeirdoJoker]

Just became "Osman the Wise" with a Spaceship victory / Small map. Now I'm going to a Standard map to seek a Cultural victory and am trying to decide on which Civ to play. Any ideas?

 

[Speedbird 95]

The civ 3 war academy has an article about 20k cultural victory. You would want to select a civilization which has at least one of the following attributes: industrious (for the extra shield in your 20k city, and fast workers), and either agricultural, scientific or religious.

For 100k culture you have to get as many cities as you can, as fast as you can, spaced close together except for your core, and then rush libraries & temples (+universities if scientific) in every village, then set all the corrupt cities to wealth or settler.
You might want Persians, Iroquois, or Celts for their UU. Babylon gets the cheapest culture but not the fastest empire growth.

Edit: there are 2 20k articles in the war academy: https://www.civfanatics.com/civ3/strategy/

 

[CKS]

For 100k: Celts are the easiest choice, by far. Agricultural + religious, plus a 2-move early UU makes them best. ToA means you'll never build universities anyway. Go for the republic slingshot to get out of despotism ASAP, build or acquire both Pyramids and ToA (on regent, the AI likely won't build it fast enough for you, so be prepared to build them yourself), and swap to feudalism when you are done warring (don't learn feudalism until then, since it will obsolete your 2-move gallic swordsmen and give you slow-moving medieval infantry). Religious is important because half-price cathedrals are easy to pop-rush, while full-price cathedrals are very hard to. 100k is _much_ easier with religious than with scientific.

For 20k: Scientific is a must, because you want the increased SGL probability. I like the Byzantines, because they are coastal, so you can build the coastal wonders, and they start with alphabet (= head start on republic slingshot + early curraghs=early contacts). Korea/Greece also start with alphabet, and commercial means fast research. (You need fast research so you can get to more wonders to build and also increase your SGL chances.) Babylon doesn't work well for me, but YMMV.

 

[tjs282]

For 100k: Celts are the easiest choice, by far...

*snip*

...I just posted a whole buncha questions to you in the Spanish-SG thread: wish I'd seen this post before I did that.

Feel free to ignore those questions on my account

 

[Speedbird 95]

Do the "free" temples from the ToA actually generate culture points in each village? I thought not. At least the culture points weren't showing up in the culture advisor screen. If not, you don't want the ToA for 100k culture.

 

[CKS]

ToA temples do give you culture. The cpt does not double after 1000 years (because the game treats them as newly built each turn), but you get 2 free culture points for each town. With 300 towns or so, culture adds up quickly. The catch is that you cannot learn education, or you have to rebuild all the temples.

 

[need my speed]

The cpt does not double after 1000 years (because the game treats them as newly built each turn)

Really? I never knew this... Good to know!

 

[WeirdoJoker]

ToA temples do give you culture. The cpt does not double after 1000 years (because the game treats them as newly built each turn), but you get 2 free culture points for each town. With 300 towns or so, culture adds up quickly. The catch is that you cannot learn education, or you have to rebuild all the temples.

Is this worth doing, considering that Universities add culture points of their own, speed up science and make it easier to get where you're going in the long run (e.g., getting to JS Bach's or Shakespeare's more quickly)? At least, it would seem so to me, though I've not calculated the mechanics of it. Get ToA and start racking up culture points right away ... Cathedrals, Libraries, etc. ... then rebuild the Temples later after getting Education and working on Universities as well.

 

[CKS]

If you are playing 100k, it is not generally worth learning education. Universities are expensive. It is better to cram in a few more cities with free temples. By the time you are ready to build many universities, you'll be close to winning anyway, and most 100k games don't go that far into the tech tree.

Suppose you have 300 towns with ToA temples. You will give up 600 cpt and then need to replace 9000 shields worth of temples before you can start on the 60000 shields worth of universities (assuming you are religious and not scientific). Additionally, the new temples aren't free; you have to pay maintenance on them, so you've just subtracted 300 gpt from your treasury.

If you are playing archipelago (see the succession game starting up now), ToA may not be helpful, but on pangaea or a large continent it is definitely the way to go.

 

[WeirdoJoker]

Completely random memory of the last game ... I somehow avoided a GA until very late in the game ... I didn't record it, but it was in the late Industrial, I think. By the time I got my second SGL, though, I was so fast it couldn't have helped with anything, so I started an Age of Science (which I am not fond of ... would rather rush a needed Wonder), and made a successful beeline for the Spaceship. (Had to DoW France to get the only Aluminum on the continent ... only one civ had two of them, and it was too far behind to trade for, so I took the easy route.)

 

[Speedbird 95]

The age of science does not work in C3C.