Fort Commanders

[Valkrionn]

Alright, we have a few Fort Commander UU's now. I'd like, if possible, to add one for most civilizations... Feel free to make suggestions.

Currently, we have:

1. Dwarven Commander - Khazad. Higher Strength than normal, and an extra tier of culture available. Meant to show the superiority of Khazad forts.
2. Jotnar Commander - Jotnar. Archer, rather than siege... More promotions available. At level 5, it can convert the Fort into an actual Staedding, making a city. The Commander becomes a Huscarl.
3. D'teshi Commander - Legion of D'tesh. Does not gain xp naturally, either passively or via combat. Instead, units can be sacrificed to grant him xp equal to their level. Rather than ranged attack, he has a death damage AoE, capable of killing.
4. Pioneer - Kuriotates. Not REALLY a Fort Commander UU, but is able to sacrifice itself to generate a fort and Fort Commander with Expanded Influence (first tier of culture). Kuriotate Commanders are also able to attain the second culture level, like Khazad.

I could add the Dwarven Commander to the Luchuirp, but I'd rather they have a golem-based commander.

I'm also thinking a Centaur Commander would be nice for the Kuriotates... Would have to make the Pioneer a Centaur, but that's fine. Or better yet, a Musteval, now that Sezereth is working on them.

Commanders needed:

• Chislev
• Cualli
• Kuriotates
• Lanun
• Mercurians
• Scion - See here
• Sheaim

Proposed Commanders: Keep in mind, these are NOT final, and are subject to change.

• Amurite - Tower Mage. Details here, credit MrUnderhill.
• Archos - Spider. Should definitely have some mechanic to represent the spider-webs that surround the fort. Possibly a slow spell, or a PyPerTurn that automatically affects nearby, non-archos units (without cauing war). The Commander itself should be a spider. Spiders are the Fort Commanders of the animal kingdom.
• Austrin - Falconer. Can summon a Falcon capable of scouting. For more info, gohere.
• Balseraphs - Gypsy Camp. Gypsy Camp. Drain culture from nearby rival cities, upgradable to drain gold, food, production; add culture to friendly cities et cetera. Able to turn into an alternate form that can move, but doesn't project influence. The alternate form can claim forts becoming a normal commander, thereby allowing you to transfer your experienced commanders to where they are needed. Lower strength than normal commanders, possibly higher upkeep.
  
  In order to turn the city damaging stuff off when mobile, one would need to use bAutoAquire and bMustMaintain with a prerequisite of the immobile form and a bought "seed" promotion.
• Bannor - Uninspired, but some kind of commander. I'd make it able to lead 2 units and grant a training promotion to their charges. That way you can send raw recruits to remote outposts for some training and basic guard duty.
• Calabim - I would see a Calabim fort as filled with traps and it would probably have a good amount of magic guarding it as well. The commander would probably have first strikes to represent the traps and fear because of the "rumors" of what the Calabim to do prisoners.
• Clan of Embers - Goblin Fort. Will look like a barb Goblin Fort, and the Clan will be able to use the various 'Hire Goblinoid' spells here. Commander will be Scorpion Archer.
• Doviello - A Doviello fort commander would not have his job for a very long time. The commander would constantly have to fight to keep his position at the fort. I think that Doviello units should be able to challenge a commander for his position and be able to become the commander keeping both their promotions and the commander's level and experience.
• Dural - Battle Architect. Has various spells reflecting their statues. For more, go here.
• Elohim - Able to claim unique features as well, provided they are unclaimed. Actually that's probably too powerful, but automatically give them nine tiles if placed next to a unique feature.
• Grigori - Living units in the tile can cast Sidequest, which grants a promotion Questing for 5 to ten turns. Questing grants 2 experience each turn and an effect like Lost.
• Hippus - Commander can cast Hire Mercenary at Currency.
• Illians - Terraforms like a lesser version of the Temple of The Hand.
• Infernals - Not needed. With no extra effort will spread Hell Terrain by the simple virtue of being infernal lands.
• Kahdi - Elemental of some kind. Idea from here.
• Ljosalfar - Creates Forest on the tile. Commander is Treant/Satyr/Fawn/Guardian Vine. Forts use art from the Kohan Elven Pack.
• Luchuirp - Sculptor. Can 'build' various golems. Full details here.
• Malakim - The Malakim fort would probably be the citadel of light and the commander would be able to cast some fire/sun magics.
• Mazatl - Converts adjacent tiles to Jungle, damages units that come in range. Blowpipe UU. Idea from here.
• Mechanos - Mobile Fort. Upgrade to the normal Commander, becomes the 'fort' itself. The improvement is destroyed, and the units stats are buffed... Will only be able to move on Railroads. Need to add the DLL work to accomplish this first.
• Sidar - Fort Commander has access to a variant of the Severed Soul spell. Grants the Soul a promotion based on the type of fort he is on. Soul can summon the Commander, destroying the original fort, and creating a new one of the same level. Upgrade time would be reset, but that's a good balance factor.
• Svartalfar - An illusory defender of some kind.

Contributors-
Listing you all here rather than by your ideas... The commander list has grown a bit faster than I expected.

1. MrUnderhill - Amurites
2. Vermicious - Ljosalfar, Sidar, Clan of Embers
3. Odalrick - Archos, Balseraph, Bannor, Elohim, Grigori, Hippus, Illians, Svartalfar.
4. Cyther - Calabim, Doviello, Malakim
5. Swinkscalibur - Austrin, Luchuirp
6. Korias - Dural
7. The_Glorious - Kahdi
8. Darksaber1 - Mazatl

 

[MrUnderhill]

Tower Mage
Unique Unit for Amurites
Arcane Unit instead of Siege.
3/3 , 1 (Immobile)
Starts with Channeling I/II, Force II, Kylorin's Legacy, and Influence.
Authorized to obtain Commander I/II, Expanded Influence.
+1 Force affinity.
No natural bombard strength, but with Force II it has the same bombard strength as a normal Fort Commander (though with a slightly tighter damage limit).

Basically a normal Fort Commander with spell options. I actually have this one implemented in my modmod, and it works really nice. The fact that you can pick up tier II spells early is offset by the fact that Tower Mages are stationary and can't go around leading sieges and such. It does make barbarians comically easy to deal with at times, but let's face it, the Amurites need all the early game help they can get.

 

[Valkrionn]

That sounds good... I'll add it to the list.

 

[Vermicious Knid]

Elf: Have the claim fort spell create a forest on the tile. Perhaps the commander could be a guardian vine with a ranged attack (hail of thorns?)

Scion: Have the Fort Commander be a Blooming Creeper. Could sac to hit invaders with burrs, then respawn (with another unit present to reclaim).

Sidar: Allow the fort to move. Slips away into shadow, then reappears elsewhere. Would basically use air-drop for the commander, then a spell/ability to recreate the fort where he lands.

Clan of Embers: Have the Fort turn into a Goblin Fort(art-wise). Commander can be the functional equivalent of a scorpion clan archer. Allow the various "recruit a goblinoid" spells.

 

[Valkrionn]

Elf: Have the claim fort spell create a forest on the tile. Perhaps the commander could be a guardian vine with a ranged attack (hail of thorns?)

Scion: Have the Fort Commander be a Blooming Creeper. Could sac to hit invaders with burrs, then respawn (with another unit present to reclaim).

Sidar: Allow the fort to move. Slips away into shadow, then reappears elsewhere. Would basically use air-drop for the commander, then a spell/ability to recreate the fort where he lands.

Clan of Embers: Have the Fort turn into a Goblin Fort(art-wise). Commander can be the functional equivalent of a scorpion clan archer. Allow the various "recruit a goblinoid" spells.

I'm assuming you mean for the Ljos? That could work... I think a Treant or Fawn/Satyr would be better than a Guardian Vine though. Could also change the art for this one... Use some of the Kohan art.

Not sure here... I don't think they'd use a creeper to guard a fort. Now, a commander who could SUMMON creepers would be different...

Hmm. As described, that would be EXTREMELY powerful, mostly because you could build forts somewhere safe, in your culture, and then airdrop them to surround an enemy city. Rather than airdrop, how about a Severed Soul type mechanic? You have to walk the Soul to where you want the fort... And I'd make this one visible, or at most INVISIBLE_ANIMAL. That way it can be intercepted. Will also have to figure out how to maintain the level of the fort... Maybe have the Commander grant the Soul a promotion, based on the level of the fort he is on? IIRC, Masters can grant their minions promotions no matter the range. Would also have to destroy the first promotion, but we should be able to get the master's coordinates pretty easily.

This one I like as is.


Edit: Added the Clan, Ljos, and changed Sidar ideas to the first post. Scion idea I'm not sure on.

 

[odalrick]

Archos
Should definitely have some mechanic to represent the spider-webs that surround the fort. Possibly a slow spell, or a PyPerTurn that automatically affects nearby, non-archos units (without cauing war). The Commander itself should be a spider. Spiders are the Fort Commanders of the animal kingdom.

Balseraphs
Gypsy Camp. Drain culture from nearby rival cities, upgradable to drain gold, food, production; add culture to friendly cities et cetera. Able to turn into an alternate form that can move, but doesn't project influence. The alternate form can claim forts becoming a normal commander, thereby allowing you to transfer your experienced commanders to where they are needed. Lower strength than normal commanders, possibly higher upkeep.

In order to turn the city damaging stuff off when mobile, one would need to use bAutoAquire and bMustMaintain with a prerequisite of the immobile form and a bought "seed" promotion.

Bannor
Uninspired, but some kind of commander. I'd make it able to lead 2 units and grant a training promotion to their charges. That way you can send raw recruits to remote outposts for some training and basic guard duty.

Elohim
Able to claim unique features as well, provided they are unclaimed. Actually that's probably too powerful, but automatically give them nine tiles if placed next to a unique feature.

Grigori
Living units in the tile can cast Sidequest, which grants a promotion Questing for 5 to ten turns. Questing grants 2 experience each turn and an effect like Lost.

Hippus
Commander can cast Hire Mercenary at Currency.

Illians
Terraforms like a lesser version of the Temple of The Hand.

Infernal
With no extra effort will spread Hell Terrain by the simple virtue of being infernal lands. Just pointing it out.

Svartalfar
An illusory defender of some kind.

Scions of Patria
Some sort of affinity with haunted lands would be nice. From what I understand, a fort in haunted lands is likely to chew you up and spit out your gnawed bones all by itself.

By the way, are you able to claim a fort in rival territory if you aren't at war with them? And can you build forts in rival territory? If so a rather large exploit presents itself: build lots of forts in rival lands, claim them and starve a "friend" to death.

 

[cyther]

Calabim:
I would see a Calabim fort as filled with traps and it would probably have a good amount of magic guarding it as well. The commander would probably have first strikes to represent the traps and fear because of the "rumors" of what the Calabim to do prisoners.

Doviello:
A Doviello fort commander would not have his job for a very long time. The commander would constantly have to fight to keep his position at the fort. I think that Doviello units should be able to challenge a commander for his position and be able to become the commander keeping both their promotions and the commander's level and experience.

Malakim:
The Malakim fort would probably be the citadel of light and the commander would be able to cast some fire/sun magics.

 

[Valkrionn]

Vis a vis Creepers, some sort of major "Haunted Tree" could fit the bill pretty well. ("Devouring Oak"? I dunno.) The whole fort could even be made out of Haunted Land "stuff." The fort might even *be* the Commander. Could be really nasty. IMO the Haunted Land/Creeper stuff has been taken as far as it should be, if not a little further. (Which is why I'm not really considering any HL-tied World Spells.) But maybe it'd be worth extending it for forts, since there's a nice synergy: Malleable defensive terrain + defensive structure.

Anyway... assuming the HL idea isn't used, I'd go with a mage-type. Because the Scion magical-aptitude has been de-emphasized too much, I think.

Using a Necromancer (Gravelord? Corpse Baron? Bone Knight? Praefectus Castrorum?), you could assume that bones and/or corpses are built into the fort and animated or enchanted. That'd justify most any special Fort Commander spell you'd want. Increased defense, damage (animate fort), wasting disease, spell resistance, a push effect, no ranged attacks into the fort (I don't know how you'd code that)

Or, going back to the HL, maybe a Scion Fort Commander can plant a HL in the fort tile, and give the Scion fort extra defense (Though the HL being there might cover that in itself.)

I'm torn between the 'Haunted Tree', and the Gravelord ideas. Opinions one way or the other?

Archos
Should definitely have some mechanic to represent the spider-webs that surround the fort. Possibly a slow spell, or a PyPerTurn that automatically affects nearby, non-archos units (without cauing war). The Commander itself should be a spider. Spiders are the Fort Commanders of the animal kingdom.

I like that. Just a slow effect when you come near an Archos fort? Easy to do via improvement, harder with unit/promotions... I'll probably have to clone the fort line for them. Not hard to do though, and won't show in the pedia as the only change will be a PythonAtRange function.

Balseraphs
Gypsy Camp. Drain culture from nearby rival cities, upgradable to drain gold, food, production; add culture to friendly cities et cetera. Able to turn into an alternate form that can move, but doesn't project influence. The alternate form can claim forts becoming a normal commander, thereby allowing you to transfer your experienced commanders to where they are needed. Lower strength than normal commanders, possibly higher upkeep.

In order to turn the city damaging stuff off when mobile, one would need to use bAutoAquire and bMustMaintain with a prerequisite of the immobile form and a bought "seed" promotion.

I like it.

Bannor
Uninspired, but some kind of commander. I'd make it able to lead 2 units and grant a training promotion to their charges. That way you can send raw recruits to remote outposts for some training and basic guard duty.

Basically what I was thinking... They don't really seem to go for finesse.

Elohim
Able to claim unique features as well, provided they are unclaimed. Actually that's probably too powerful, but automatically give them nine tiles if placed next to a unique feature.

I can do that. I don't think claiming a UF would be too powerful... Remember, they get the traits just from walking on it anyway, and claiming a UF would mean no defense from the fort, or upgradeable culture beyond the one tile... The Commander promotions rely on a certain level of fort. Would basically allow you to claim it, long enough to get a city/fort out there... And I can work the extra ring in too.

Grigori
Living units in the tile can cast Sidequest, which grants a promotion Questing for 5 to ten turns. Questing grants 2 experience each turn and an effect like Lost.

I love it. Rather comedic, but in a good way.

Hippus
Commander can cast Hire Mercenary at Currency.

This works. Makes it slightly easier for them to get their UU.

Illians
Terraforms like a lesser version of the Temple of The Hand.

That would be nasty if used offensively... I like it.

Infernal
With no extra effort will spread Hell Terrain by the simple virtue of being infernal lands. Just pointing it out.

Good point. I don't think they really need one then, aside from an artstyle... but that's simple.

Svartalfar
An illusory defender of some kind.

Hmm. That would mean he'd be unable to kill on attack, but would heal to full if he sucessfully defends... Very defense oriented. Fits the flavour, though.

Scions of Patria
Some sort of affinity with haunted lands would be nice. From what I understand, a fort in haunted lands is likely to chew you up and spit out your gnawed bones all by itself.

By the way, are you able to claim a fort in rival territory if you aren't at war with them? And can you build forts in rival territory? If so a rather large exploit presents itself: build lots of forts in rival lands, claim them and starve a "friend" to death.

Answered the Scions above...

Had me worried here. You cannot claim a fort in rival territory if not at war, the python req checks for it.

Calabim:
I would see a Calabim fort as filled with traps and it would probably have a good amount of magic guarding it as well. The commander would probably have first strikes to represent the traps and fear because of the "rumors" of what the Calabim to do prisoners.

So, first strikes, fear, and maybe some magic? I can work with that.

Doviello:
A Doviello fort commander would not have his job for a very long time. The commander would constantly have to fight to keep his position at the fort. I think that Doviello units should be able to challenge a commander for his position and be able to become the commander keeping both their promotions and the commander's level and experience.

Hmm... Could incorporate that into the Duel setup. If the loser of the duel has the Influence promo, the victor becomes a Commander, gains all xp and promotions of the former commander?

Malakim:
The Malakim fort would probably be the citadel of light and the commander would be able to cast some fire/sun magics.

Basically what I'm thinking. I'm probably going to have to add fort clones anyway, along with spells for the relevent Commanders to convert their forts, so I think I'll make the Malakim line without a citadel... So Fort-Castle-Citadel of Light, rather than Fort-Castle-Citadel-Citadel of Light.

 

[Vermicious Knid]

Vis a vis Creepers, some sort of major "Haunted Tree" could fit the bill pretty well. ("Devouring Oak"? I dunno.) The whole fort could even be made out of Haunted Land "stuff." The fort might even *be* the Commander.

Ummm...yes please.

The Gravelord idea is perfectly workable as well, but not terribly different from the Amurite tower.

 

[Valkrionn]

That's the one I'm leaning towards too. Could have it spread HL around it...

 

[Korias]

Dural
Replacement: Battle Architect (Fort Commander UU)
2, Ranged 4
As standard fort commander, but has access to the following Promotions:

• Beacon of Inspiration Fort provides +1 Commerce on the tile. Requires Level 5
• Beacon of Hope Fort provides +1 to the Nearest City. Requires Level 5
• Beacon of Valor Fort provides +20% greater Heal Rate to units inside the fort. Requires Level 5
• Beacon of Loyalty Fort Commander may cast Loyalty. Requires Level 5
• Expert Fortifications Grants the Fort Commander +100% fortification bonus. Requires Level 3 and Masonry
• Demolitions Expert Never Defends the Stack. If the Fort Commander is ever destroyed, the fort is automatically destroyed. Requires Level 3 and Masonry

Demolitions Expert and Expert Fortifications are mutually exclusive. The Three "Beacon" promotions are mutually exclusive to each other.

 

[The Glorious]

Cualli/Mazatl - Spreads jungle to tile. Guardian vine for commander.

Kahdi - Elemental commander of some kind.

Lanun - Give them large, slow ships that function as a water fort. If there to OP make them a national unit.

Luchuirp - Give them a fairly weak commander that is able to build golems to help with the defense. Also give them a unique upgrade line that helps them defend the fort. For example: more advanced golems, traps, and weapons.

 

[Valkrionn]

Dural
Replacement: Battle Architect (Fort Commander UU)
2, Ranged 4
As standard fort commander, but has access to the following Promotions:

• Beacon of Inspiration Fort provides +1 Commerce on the tile. Requires Level 5
• Beacon of Hope Fort provides +1 to the Nearest City. Requires Level 5
• Beacon of Valor Fort provides +20% greater Heal Rate to units inside the fort. Requires Level 5
• Beacon of Loyalty Fort Commander may cast Loyalty. Requires Level 5
• Expert Fortifications Grants the Fort Commander +100% fortification bonus. Requires Level 3 and Masonry
• Demolitions Expert Never Defends the Stack. If the Fort Commander is ever destroyed, the fort is automatically destroyed. Requires Level 3 and Masonry

Demolitions Expert and Expert Fortifications are mutually exclusive. The Three "Beacon" promotions are mutually exclusive to each other.

That fits the perfectly.

Cualli/Mazatl - Spreads jungle to tile. Guardian vine for commander.

Kahdi - Elemental commander of some kind.

Lanun - Give them large, slow ships that function as a water fort. If there to OP make them a national unit.

Luchuirp - Give them a fairly weak commander that is able to build golems to help with the defense. Also give them a unique upgrade line that helps them defend the fort. For example: more advanced golems, traps, and weapons.

I'd prefer separate ones for them... I doubt they'd approach a fort with the same philosophy. Guardian Vines doesn't really fit either, I think.

I can see that one.

Hmm... I could give them a Floating Citadel, like in Rise of Darkness, but I'd still want something for the land I think.

What do you mean, build golems? Summon them?

 

[Swinkscalibur]

Luchuirp: Building off other ideas. Fort clones for the luchuirp: sculptor's studio -> golem workshop -> golem factory.
Commander UU: Sculptor - could "build" golems after gaining promotions that allow abilities.

Promotion: Apprentice Sculptor (no added requirements)
Abilities gained: Apprentice Mud Golem (10 turns) - Summons permanent mud golem. Apprentice Wood Golem (9 turns) - Summons permanent wood golem.

Promotion: Capable Sculptor (overwrites apprentice) requires golem workshop, level 3, Ironworking
Abilities gained: Capable Mud Golem (7 turns). Capable Wood Golem (6 turns). Capable Iron Golem (13 turns).

Promotion: Experienced Sculptor (overwrites capable) requires golem workshop, level 5, Mithril Weapons.
Abilities gained: Experienced Mud Golem (5 turns). Experienced Wood Golem (5 turns). Experienced Iron Golem (9 turns). Experienced Nullstone Golem (12 turns).

Promotion: Master Sculptor (overwrites experienced) requires golem factory, level 8, experienced sculptor
Abilities gained: Master Mud Golem (3 turns). Master Wood Golem (3 turns). Master Iron Golem (6 turns). Master Nullstone Golem (8 turns). Master Bone Golem (12 turns). Master Clockwork Golem (12 turns)

The so called fort defender should be weak. He can create his own defenders and should be defended or all the summoned units are destroyed as well this tempers the power.


Austrin: Fort Commander UU - Falconer.
Special Abilities: Falcon Spy Mission - like hawk and floating eye but with +2 range. Falcon Message Services (requires another civ city within 8 tiles) gives a 10 turn +1 relation boost. (10 turns to cast). Others are possible.


Lanun: on land, fort commander can gain an ability (requires level 5 and castle) to turn the castle tile to a coast tile with a floating castle on it. The growth counter is reset but the floating castle can grow to a floating citadel on a tile of water with the 9 surrounding tiles become coast as well.

 

[Valkrionn]

Good ideas, but a few issues....

Luchuirp - Casters can only have one permanent summon at a time. I could probably have the commander grant a +1 duration promo to his golems, making them temp summons alive so long as he is... Fits the idea.

Austrin - I like the basic idea, but I'm not sure it's possible to allow extra range on a recon mission, assuming you mean distance the bird can fly to. If you mean distance he can SEE... I could allow the commander to 'summon' a hawk, with Sentry 1&2.

Lanun - I think this one is too exploity. It basically allows a dedicated player to turn his section of the continent into an island, where the AI can't touch him. Not sure I like that, personally.

 

[Darksaber1]

How about for the Mazatle, it turns ajaisant tiles to jungle, and inficts a bit of damage to units that enter the jungle? The idea being the fort is actually the hub of a series of archer/blowpipe maned tree blinds, walkways and traps. Perhaips allow the "network" to spread at higher levels?

 

[Merddyn]

My thoughts on the Amurite one is just that having access to channeling one and two before KotE may be a bit too powerful, though I DO think the Amurites need a boost. Perhaps they should only get channeling two at KotE, instead of being able to access second level spells at the beginning of the game?

 

[Valkrionn]

How about for the Mazatle, it turns ajaisant tiles to jungle, and inficts a bit of damage to units that enter the jungle? The idea being the fort is actually the hub of a series of archer/blowpipe maned tree blinds, walkways and traps. Perhaips allow the "network" to spread at higher levels?

I like it. Can't actually expand the affected area beyond a 1-tile range, but I COULD up the strength.

My thoughts on the Amurite one is just that having access to channeling one and two before KotE may be a bit too powerful, though I DO think the Amurites need a boost. Perhaps they should only get channeling two at KotE, instead of being able to access second level spells at the beginning of the game?

Sounds like a reasonable limit.

 

[odalrick]

Luchuirp - Casters can only have one permanent summon at a time. I could probably have the commander grant a +1 duration promo to his golems, making them temp summons alive so long as he is... Fits the idea.

Actually, it's one permanent summon from each spell. So the commander would be able to build one of each kind of golem.

That sounds a bit overpowered to me. A master sculptor would be able to provide six free golems at a time, some of them of national unit strength. And with feedback experience from summons, level 8 wont be that far away.

One free golem at a time seems plenty good enough, especially since it's type can be changed quickly. (By disbanding the old golem and summoning a new one.) Build forts on useless tiles and have a horde of Mud Golems during peace, and a horde of free fighting golems during war.

It's fairly easy to limit to one golem at a time, just have the master grant a promotion to slaves that in turn grant the master a no casting promotion. Or even just have the Golem race promotion forbid masters from casting spells.

I do like this idea a lot better than having the commander be a golem. Fort Commanders seem like leader types, and with one exception, golems aren't leaders.

Hmm. That would mean he'd be unable to kill on attack, but would heal to full if he sucessfully defends... Very defense oriented. Fits the flavour, though.

To be fair, most Fort Commanders are unable to kill on attack.

 

[Castar]

Idea for the Bannor in the "aggressive, organised total war" spirit: forts are weaker, but can be built faster and, most importantly, in enemy lands (not rival lands). The weak forts have a commander with a weaker ranged attack, but with access to promotions that allow him to give bonuses to friendly units in the 8 tiles surrounding the fort.

Might make a fort next to one of your own cities *very* powerful though... Maybe normal, basic forts + commanders in owned/neutral lands, and a seperate type of "offensive" fort for enemy lands...