Discussion in 'Civ4 - MOO2Civ' started by fulano, Feb 18, 2010.
Why not merge the two of them and have one combined MoO2 mod?
I intend to (it already works w/my current working version of v. 5.0); I just remarked that fulano and me appear to be the only ones playtesting it, and there have been reports of people not being able to get v. 5.0 Beta working, so I would like to know if the minimod also works with previous versions (I expect it does, but I'd like to know for sure, that's all). If so, an official upload might be useful. It wouldn't need future updating for that purpose, as I intend to go ahead with the current version of MOO2Civ.
So I've tested to turn 118 and had the barbarian problem... There has been about 9 stars captured by battleship IIIs so far and they're getting worse. First time I've seen the problem while testing this minimod.
So far things seem to be running fine otherwise. It's tough to tell how things balance out with everybody just barely fighting off the barbarians. I wonder what causes that, maybe it's just on certain games? Or do they have the ability to build battleship IIIs once they capture a star? The Battleship IIIs might have started showing up after they captured Meklon...
But on to other things...
I really want to reduce the type of units barbarians can get, but I'm not sure how to do that. (like no ground troops & scouts or something). Any ideas? I noticed some things in the CivilizationInfos.xml that could be related.
Or another idea I had that is related to this is to change the <bNoCapture > setting on battleships & destroyers and such to 1, so they can't capture stars, just destroy the defenses (like BTS helicopters). Then Invasion Ships would be used to actually capture the star.
-It would be more like MoO2's method of capturing stars.
-It would help keep the barbarians from forming their own nation.
-I personally think it would improve the game.
-We could prevent the barbarians from getting invasion ships (if that is possible) to keep them from capturing stars.
-Special defensive units could be added later that focus on on transports to hinder an attacking fleet (to add dynamic to the game.)
I'm not sure if the AI will like it though. I also think the change should wait until later so there is time for testing. What are you guys' thoughts on that change?
It would be good to keep a separate upload of this "minimod" for people who have to use older download versions. I was confused at what you meant for a minute. Where does a person do an "official upload"? What does this mean? Do you mean put it on the download thread?
I'm going to upload the latest version in a few minutes, so if it's not changed to 1.5.1b yet it soon will be.
Ajidica suggested this:
But barb difficulty also depends on settings, maps size and difficulty level used.
Ideally, ofcourse, no space ships should be able to capture systems, only ground forces. (But I don't know if the AI can handle that.) Personally I have no problem with limiting system capture to Invasion Ships for now, though.
With 'official upload' I mean a proper announcement in the 'Announce your Civ 4 creations' thread and uploading it to the Downloads Database - like most modders do. (I was asking, because you said in the beginning you didn't want to have to continually support your minimod - which, seeing as I want to make it part of the main mod, wouldn't be necessary IMO.) Sorry for the confusion.
Okay, so basically you'll merge this minimod with MoO2Civ and any future changes will be done by people who want to work on it in the future?
I think this must be referring to the CivilizationInfos.xml? I did check it and actually the Barbarians have every unit set to none there, except doomstars.
Turn 90 when the barbarians started raiding with Battleship IIIs and they've taken 6 stars in the last five turns. Darn. I think there is a connection between the barbarians and what is on the map as well. The games they barbarians aren't destroying everybody the stars only have three or four planets usually. In the last two maps I played the stars had five planets minimum, usually 6 to 8. now I know I should just quit if I find stars that big. Also their first ships were Destroyer IIIs so that could be an indication of when the game will go bad.
I also found out why everybody always beat me to all the techs. It is because I almost always played as Mrrshan. I love the +50% attack. I now decided I need to play as random to get a true feel for the game. I played as human in the last game and got the first two values easy.
I don't plan to make any of the big changes I've discussed for a little while. I want to make sure this version works well. Maybe even consider it the latest major update for version 1 so next time I can start with version 2.0! I do still want to fix any problems anybody finds as soon as they are found.
Ideas for the Minimod 2.0:
(at least three weeks away unless I get to excited about it. I might get too busy too. )
-Pictures of the ship part upgrades
-Only capturing stars with invasion ships (unless it doesn't work)
-New buildings and Techs (I want to add several of the new tech ideas I posted in the other thread)
-New experience promotions (Using more of the unique features, and expanding current ones like capital ship tactics II and III)
-Change troops to star defensive bonus rather than city defensive bonus.
For playtesting I usually play random.
You still haven't mentioned which level and mapsize you're on. That matters - a lot. On a Huge size map above Hard level I wouldn't recommend playing with Raging Barbarians: the map is actually all land squares which can only be settled and mined at specific locations; this means there will always be plenty of spawn locations. (I'm guessing - as I haven't played above Hard level - that at Impossible level barbs start 1 level up in unit types.)
Actually, on the barb spawning I seem to remember looking at that file and not following what should be changed...
One comment: when trading with the Gnolams I noticed I could trade Stock Exchange for Stock Exchange (except one of these is Space Port):
Sorry, I usually play standard size. Any bigger is too slow for my computer. I'll usually play with the default number of players, 7, though sometimes I play with six so i can get more stars before war starts. I usually set the star density to very dense. I also play on standard difficulty (the 4th one)
With the civilizationinfos.xml the barbarian leader has a list of all the replacement units he gets. (Like in BTS the japanese get a samuri instead of a maceman). All of the units of the game say NONE which I think people assume will make it so he doesn't get any units. I don't think that works though.
And thanks, I forgot the spaceport is actually called the banking system in the text files. I have it fixed now.
-Fixed the Anti-Missile Rocket to give a bonus versus missiles
-Fixed computers (I gave them more first strikes than I meant to)
I forgot to mention that I'd been looking at that xml file earlier and it didn't make any sense to me either, I'm afraid.
Well, I playtested a little more, finding no further issues, bugs or whatever. I'll hold off a bit on creating the scenarios - in case you do some more tweaking -, but expect to finish those around the weekend.
I myself usually have Raging Barb off when playtesting, as I want to keep an eye on how the AI is doing and switch between Large and Huge (depending on how much time I have). With my once multiplayer companion we played on Large size, but unfortunately 5.0 Beta doesn't work for him. I would like to MP test over the weekend as well, using the 'final' minimod version (on a previous version that works for us both). That leaves most of next week for any further tweaking or fixing of issues that might pop up in between before the expected upload end of that week.
Found another minor thingy: I noticed the Humans were at some point researching "United Planets". That should be "Galactic Council", I reckon. (Not sure I've already changed all UP references to Galactic Council ones, but if not I intend to.)
I've only used raging barbarians once, and it didn't seem to make a lot of difference to me. I turned them off for the last game I'm playing.
I'm not sure what else there is to change so I'll upload the v1.5.2b.
For a mp test, I've never played Civ4 online, but I'll give it a shot. I can test it on LAN too sometime. You're about 9 hours later than here it seems? I mostly have time in the afternoons or late morning today or Saturday.
EDIT: I'll change that to galactic council then.
Hadn't thought about that before...
As for Raging Barbs, we did have that on on MP, but got bored with fighting barbs instead of other races. It's... puzzling what rules those barbs...
Version 1.5.2b is uploaded. I do plan to at least test it on a LAN between my wife's laptop and my computer. I haven't even tried the MoO2civ mod on her laptop, hopefully it will work.
Will check and good luck.
I played two 50 turn games over a LAN, one with just two human players where we won with a permanent alliance, and the second was a small map with 2 humans and 2 computers. I saved the second game on turn 50 and reloaded it and it continued working fine.
It might be interesting to know that my wife's computer is a MacBook with windows on it, so it's good to know that it will run on a MacBook too.
I had absolutely no problems!
Sounds good - thanks! (Never had anyone reporting if the mod would run on a Macbook. I'll include a note for that on the DL Page once it's up.)
Over the weekend me and Zippadeedoodah will try if the minimod works with a pre 5.0 Beta version.
Found & fixed more bugs (not uploaded yet):
The bomb promotion icons were incorrect.
The missile promotions were way to strong.
The bomb promotions were way to weak
Added collateral damage to torpedoes (to make them useful)
What about ship speeds? In MoO2 all ships when the same speed unless you gave them speed promotions, but in here it starts out with scouts, battleships +1 and titans +2. I think they should all be dropped down to the same starting speed of 2.
I made the above changes and uploaded it as v1.5.3b. I really should have tested it earlier but I kept having good ideas!
Hadn't thought of that, but it's fine with me.
I checked the units in the game and some of the iMoves were wrong even, like the battleship I started at 3, then battleship II & III went to 2. I've fixed them though.
Also I fixed iPower further. Supposedly this number is what the AI uses to tell how strong a unit really is and for the titans it was set at 10 while the battleships it was equal to the battleship strength.
I am currently still testing for further bugs, I can upload the latest change when you need it.
I've squished a ton of bugs in the last hour, and I finally figured out how to change the order the promotions are listed in!
I'm playtesting for now just to see if I can find any more bugs.
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