G-Major 14

Actually, I think Free Speech affects specialists also....could be wrong, but I would have sworn so.

As for a tip on my first attempt for the gauntlet...when would you suggest the cutoff be for settling a GA rather than building a great work with him?
 
...when would you suggest the cutoff be for settling a GA rather than building a great work with him?

You would only settle a GA in a city you plan to have lots of cathedrals/hermitage, i.e. the capitol.

In my games, the capitol finishes fine without any bombs, so it doesn't need a settled artist. So it's all bombs for me.
 
I have seen three banana tiles show up in my 28 attempts to date. So, yes, quite rare. Same goes for rice, actually.

I always get lots of pasture resources, which are always late to be hooked up when going the Wheel-Pottery-Writing-Alphabet route.

Does anyone have any responses to my tech trading question a few posts above?
 
well, I would hold off any trading until you can get Economics, but I don't know when that would be, since it isn't a monopoly and they still aren't willing to trade it, for some reason.
 
How can I get economics without trading? Surely I should be shutting off science now that I have Liberalism and Nationalism? I thought there was some nifty way of trading your way from a Liberalism monopoly all the way through Printing Press, Economics, and Corporation. Is that just a myth?

And Thrallia, I don't think I would ever settle a Great Artist in this game. Not that I know much, but I would only settle a Great Artist if I got him really early plus I knew I was going to get Sistine Chapel. I'm happy to be proven wrong though.
 
I never settle them either, but in past writeups, I've seen Jesusin and other settle their earliest GAs, so I wondered if anyone was doing that this game.

In the screenshot you posted, no one was willing to trade you anything, even though there were only 2-3 techs they had that you didn't.
I'd refuse to trade anything until they were willing to trade Economics(or is that not economics that a couple of the AI had for trade?), at which point, hopefully you'd be able to then trade that and/or nationalism/liberalism to someone for PP.
 
I spotted another thing that helped my game...I had almost every health resource except seafood. +20 in the capitol.
 
Thrallia, I've already traded away Nationalism - that's why there is nothing left for them to trade to me. I got all the good stuff on offer at that point.

WastinTime, health is huge in these games. If I had more time, I would be fascinated to see how an Expansive leader could handle this. Would the time saved on Aqueducts and trading health offset the extra commerce from the Financial leader?
 
Dang. Gandhi very nicely postponed his launch in my first attempt until 1635AD, much later than seems to be the norm, but I lost by 11 turns. I had my capital and GP farm set to go legendary in 9 more turns, and my other city set for 2 turns later.

I would have won, had I done a couple things differently:
1) Set up a secondary GP farm earlier. I didn't bother farming the FP around my 4th city until I'd already popped 6 GAs. If I had, I could have had one proper GP farm and 1 minor one. That would have given me at least 2 more GAs, which would have gotten me closer to the goal.
2) Avoided getting Emancipation passed. Emancipation passed with about 35 turns left to go, removing my GP farm from its ability to run its meager 5 specialists. Instead, I was able to run 2, and quickly cottaged it up, to give it mroe native culture to go legendary faster. If I hadn't lost Cast System, I would have gained 1 more GA.
3) Bad luck. The only GP my secondary GP farm produced was a Prophet, at 6% odds(94% artist) The first GP my Gp farm produced was a scientist, I ended up using him to lightbulb half of PP, but I'd have rather gotten a GA.

If those 3 things had happened, those extra 5 GA would have given me the win.

Additionally, I only ever got Cows, Corn, and Sheep for health resources...no one got more than 1 Wheat or Rice, and apparently no one got more than 1 of any sea resource either, because I couldn't trade any of my happy resources for foods.
 
I have seen three banana tiles show up in my 28 attempts to date. So, yes, quite rare. Same goes for rice, actually.

I always get lots of pasture resources, which are always late to be hooked up when going the Wheel-Pottery-Writing-Alphabet route.

Does anyone have any responses to my tech trading question a few posts above?

I don't believe it is possible since you have traded Nationalism and don't have pp or econ yet. You may want to consider taking pp as your free tech sometimes. It gives an immediate commerce boost and I've found the AI is often a bit slow to research it. You can then use it and Lib to trade for Nationalism.
 
So are you saying that the GP farm should be one of the 3 culture cities? I thought someone said that was a bad idea because you could never build anything there and it had no commerce because it was all farms?

It can be. Whether it should be or not depends on your strategy and map. It may not have much commerce, but each artist is base 4CPT that is wasted if the city is not legendary. As WastingTime has proven, you can pop 16GA's, which means you only need legendary cities 2 and 3 to produce 3650 culture each. Certainly doable if you're running 9-10 Artists.

EDIT: It can be legendary.
 
In my game, I didn't research Liberalism until around 450AD....but I was immediately able to trade it(and either music or drama as an add-on) to different AIs for both PP and Nationalism.

For some reason, Cyrus never bothered researching Liberalism, so I was able to trade it and 1200 gold for Corporation about 600 years after I'd stopped teching.
 
Answering now some old questions:

Library is for NE, as already mentioned.

I don’t like popping my BC GS in the capital. Nor in the GPfarm. I would like to pop them in auxiliary cities, thus halting their growth instead of the growth of the good cities. However, I am aiming at 3GS and I have 4 cities, so no many options here!

I stop growth in my capital by building Settlers and Workers. Sometimes (rarely) I let it grow beyond the happiness limit.

No settling artists in Quick speed games. Now that I think of it, it makes no sense. Let’s rephrase it then: no settling artists in 13xxAD finishing games. I have settled artists until 500AD in 1750AD finishing games, the threshold depending on the number of multipliers.

Being dowed:
Being dowed in the BC is normal, there is not much you can do. In my second GreatPlains attempt (first one run out of space for my 3rd city!) I had everybody Pleased after trading Alphabet, Hatty dropped to Cautious, I revolted to HR the next turn bringing her to Pleased again because of civics, but she had already decided to dow and did so a few turns later.
Being dowed in the AD means you have not played right. Trade resources since the beginning, for that +2. Gift techs, you already have all you want. Chose your religion carefully. At 1350AD I tend to have everybody Friendly, maybe 1 AI only Pleased. Peaceful leaders don’t dow when Pleased.

WastinTime, health is huge in these games. If I had more time, I would be fascinated to see how an Expansive leader could handle this. Would the time saved on Aqueducts and trading health offset the extra commerce from the Financial leader?

One of the strategies I tried in the past was this, with 0 cottages, every city was a GPFarm. 1450AD finish, if I recall correctly. It is not the best strategy.

Harbourboy, a follow-up to your BC question before I sign off for the day: in your GP Farm, build lib and work 3 river cottages first, pref on FP's for growth, unless you need food for health elsewhere. Always work these - you now will need at least 1 less bomb to make it legendary and you early tech faster too. Then work mines/food, run a sci, build gran and run 2nd sci for edu, then bang out NE. Then build farms/aqueduct and your pop should be up enough by the time you are ready to spam GA's.

I don't agree. Maybe I am too simplistic here. If it is my GPfarm, only farms go there, no cottages at all. I understand that you farm over your cottages when NE is built. Maybe your approach is better and my problem is that I don't build enough Workers.

It will also be very helpful to trade up to corp. later on (lib and/or pp/gold for nat, nat to everybody for whatever they have, lib/pp/whatever for const, trade const for whatever, lib/pp/whatever for corp)

Well said!
The 320AD pic is a good starting point. Get Economy and revolt to FM asap (you have to wait for them to be willing to trade, be patient). GunPowder is the “whatever”. Of course you should be 0% research now. What did you get for Nationalism? If it was Optics, Engineering and things like that, that everybody already had, then you shouldn’t have traded for them. You want to trade for things that most of them don’t have, to keep the trading game alive.

So are you saying that the GP farm should be one of the 3 culture cities? I thought someone said that was a bad idea because you could never build anything there and it had no commerce because it was all farms?

Of course it is! Oh my, I thought I had already explained this.
There are 2 schools of thought.
The “cathedrals in all Legendary cities” one says you should have 9 cities and you should have hammers in all three cities, which are mainly cottage cities.
The “my GPFarm will be Legendary” one says that it would be a pity to not use all the culture the artist provide, so they use 2 cottage cities and the GPfarm. They are criticized because the GPFarm should not concentrate on hammers, but on GPs.
My answer to that is not building any cathedral in the GPfarm, so no need for 9 cities. The only problem with my approach is you need 7-8 GA to be bombed in the GPFarm, to take it all the way to Legendary.


I finally got a map I liked and played the game to the end instead of abandoning it. I should have gotten 1295 AD, but I got 1335 AD. A few things went wrong besides that last GA, so I think I can beat the 1280 AD date if I have time to go again.

Of course you will. If you had gotten Liberalism first, you would have saved maybe 6 turns of research plus you would have gotten Economy in trades... We will soon be finishing 11xx.


Nat Epic city ran 10 artists!

IMHO that is the key to your good result. In my 1280AD game the key was many small GPfarms helping my 8 artist big GPFarm.



By the way, I am back! I got a laptop that I can play the game in. As soon as I finish GOTM21, I'll be playing that 3GS, 11-artists-GPfarm game that will take me under 1000AD... probably only to discover that 3GS is a bit of overdoing things and 2GS is optimum :)
 
My second game ended in failure also.

1635AD launch to Gandhi(the first was was actually 1650AD, not 1635AD)

I felt I did better this time, even though I was a few turns farther away from finishing than last time, because I had a good GP farm from the start(although I went stupid all over it and didn't get it actually running artists until after 800AD), and thanks to my capital being located on top of about 8 FP, I was able to cottage everything and still run 6 artists there as well, and I ran a 3rd minor GP farm that held 5 artists by the end.

I popped around 10 GA, but I needed the time to pop about 3 more in order to win.
 
As soon as I finish GOTM21, I'll be playing that 3GS, 11-artists-GPfarm game that will take me under 1000AD... probably only to discover that 3GS is a bit of overdoing things and 2GS is optimum :)

Isn't it fairly straightforward to estimate the cultural value of a 3rd GS? If he saves you X turns of research, then your last legendary city needs to produce at least 2680 culture in your last X turns to make up the difference.
 
Of course you will. If you had gotten Liberalism first, you would have saved maybe 6 turns of research plus you would have gotten Economy in trades... We will soon be finishing 11xx.

Actually, I traded for Nationalism on the very next turn after I finished Lib, so I stopped research and went to FreeSpeech immediately. I probably could have gotten Economy, but I forgot to check the trade screen. I never would have gotten 16 GA's though without Merc, so I'm still not sure FreeMarket is the way to go.
 
Isn't it fairly straightforward to estimate the cultural value of a 3rd GS? If he saves you X turns of research, then your last legendary city needs to produce at least 2680 culture in your last X turns to make up the difference.

There are a few problems with this.

1) Assuming you're playing Liz (or non-spiritual), the real value of finishing X turns earlier is that you can switch to Caste/Pacif and get X more turns of GA points. It is for this reason that I'm going to skip Slavery and just run Caste. Then I only delay Pacifism which doesn't work anyway until you take a religion.

2) The value of those X turns (around turn 80 or 90) is not the same as the last X turns of the game. You need to calculate how much culture is lost on turns 80-86 (for example, if X=6)

3) each of your 3 cities benefit from the extra X turns running Free Speech, so it's not about 2680 all in one city.
 
Back
Top Bottom