Galleys and Subs

[valamas]

NUMBER 1 Galleys
Ok, first gripe, Galleys. When i have my galley attack another galley, i can almost be certain i will lose the first battle. If i get my second galley to attack the hopefully damaged galley i just attacked, it is likley i will still lose my galley. The score is now 2 - 0. Finally, my third galley can kill the enemy galley. Yipee!

I feel like i get a raw deal with my galleys atttacking other galleys. I don't get that feeling so much when both the AI and I have more advanced ships. (Had the galley feeling/gripe in normal random maps and as Rome in Rise of Rome).

NUMBER 2 Subs
Ok, so I have got a few subs ... in international waters! My GRACIOUS AI runs his transport into the same square that my sub happens to be. Now i am at war. I had the unfortunate occourance of this happening on two successive turns with two different ... friendly civs. What can i do about that one?

thanks all!

 

[a4phantom]

You need a clearer agreement about who owns which seas. Divide them evenly with the rest of the world - your ships can have the surface and top half and the other civs can have the floor.

 

[Admiral_Tarton]

Originally posted by a4phantom
You need a clearer agreement about who owns which seas. Divide them evenly with the rest of the world - your ships can have the surface and top half and the other civs can have the floor.

HAHAHA!

 

[Zardnaar]

Originally posted by a4phantom
You need a clearer agreement about who owns which seas. Divide them evenly with the rest of the world - your ships can have the surface and top half and the other civs can have the floor.

Good idea

 

[wilbill]

1 - Bad luck with the RNG. Are you building your galleys in cities with Harbors? If not you may be attacking veteran galleys with regulars. You'll only win about 30% of those battles.
2 - A known bug that existed for a while in Civ 3 and reappeared in C3C.
I like a4phantom's idea, too.

 

[valamas]

Im building veterans and saving elites which still die.

Does anyone have some text on this known bug that wilbill tells?

I just don't understand how it starts a war. I have not been using Subs much as i was a Pangea player. But wasn't it that you just could not move your ship into a square that a sub occupied even tho it was invisible?

 

[lbhhh]

When you're moving your ships and accidently run into an AI sub you get a pop-up giving you the choice to attack or not. OTOH, when the AI runs in to one of your subs, it always declares war, even if it a stupid thing to do, hence the bug.

 

[wilbill]

Originally posted by valamas
Im building veterans and saving elites which still die.

It's a 1:1 combat with the 10% bonus to the defender, so you're only goiing to win a little less than half the time.

 

[valamas]

Thank you, i hope they fix the sub bug. I hate it when my friends declare war on me. I guess i am going to have to stop using subs unless they are part of a fleet of something. Very annoying. They are almost unusable now.

 

[metalhead]

Not if you want to start a war without the penalties of being the one to declare it

 

[valamas]

Yes, a good way to exploit that bug! Payback...

 

[derekroth]

Galleys are not offensive units anyhow. No wonder you loose them all the time.

 

[valamas]

Originally posted by derekroth
Galleys are not offensive units anyhow. No wonder you loose them all the time.

Yea, but i am attaking other gallies which are also 1/1/1

I have more luck (well, i have great luck) when i attack Spearmen 1/2/1 with warriors 1/1/1 Rahhh!

 

[derekroth]

You are right. I was thinking Gallions, not Galleys. For some reason I still think gallies are called trimes like in Civ II. Next time I will read closer.

 

[Longasc]

Force the enemy to attack you galleys and DEFEND and FORTIFY:

According to the
http://www.civfanatics.com/civ3combatcalc.html

Combat Calculator you then have a 63.8 Chance of winning.

If YOU attack an unfortified galley, the defender has the same defense value as your attack value is, plus a +10% bonus, even more if fortified.

45.6% is your chance of winning.

But I know what you mean. A bad streak and you seem to die more often than app. 50%

Chances are 50:50, but the attacker usually goes down even if only 4-5% less chance for victory are calculated.

Strange... this random number generator is a mystery.

 

[Park Ranger]

I avoid naval battles where both attacker and defender have full HP. If I want to sink enemy galleys, pre-astronomy, I wait until they are close enough to shore to soften up with catapult bombardments.

In my mind a naval battle is like a knife fight: there may be a "winner" but both sides will be bleeding. If you need the ships, don't get into it. In my games I send a lot of AI ships to ocean floors, but unless I have lots of bombardment capabilities quite a few of my own end up there too.

 

[valamas]

Originally posted by Longasc
Force the enemy to attack you galleys and DEFEND and FORTIFY

Thanks for the advice. I usually am the attacker and will try to do defence. The problem with that is the enemy has fleets of 3 galleys that are in transport role mode, and they don't attack

 

[Jaybe]

Re: Fortifying naval units

Occasionally players will mention fortifying naval units. I have my doubts that fortify defense bonuses apply to them. Is there any evidence that they do?

 

[Gen]

Long time ago Soren or other Firaxian wrote that they don't. Can't find the thread ATM...

 

[Roi du Culture]

I have the same luck with galleys. Seems like every attack is a guarenteed loss. I have sent a navy of 12 galleys against three ai galleys...and lost miserabley. Granted this is pretty unusual, but i find there is a 1/3 chance of victory.