Getting technology from captured cities

[mikehunt]

Sorry if this has been mentioned, I tried searching and reading through a few pages of thread titles and didn't find it.
I'd like Civ4 to bring back the ability to gain tech by capturing cities. maybe make it one of the options that can be turned on and off on the game setup screen. I really miss this from the older civ games

 

[Aussie_Lurker]

I always felt that this was too powerful-and favoured warmongers. That said, I believe that you might have a chance of picking up a 'boost' to your current research in line with the amount of resources the captured city's nation has invested, and how large the captured city is. So, for example, lets say that India has invested 50 beakers per turn into the Industrial stream, and Bangalore (a large city) is captured by an enemy, then that enemy would recieve a boost of 10 or 15 beakers to their current industrial research. Of course, the culture group might also effect things. So, if CHINA invaded Bangalore, then they might get 15 to 20 beakers, but if the Aztecs invaded, they might only recieve 5-8 (to reflect the difference in Language and thinking!).

Yours,
Aussie_Lurker.

 

[DexterJ]

I would hope that the defending army would burn any sensitive documents prior to the city being captured to prevent it falling into enemy hands.

 

[warpstorm]

This was way too powerful in the previous Civ games and I am glad they changed it for Civ3. If it were to be put in, warmongering would be best play style.

 

[Woody]

I would like the concept back but I would not want it to be automatic. Something like you have a 1 or 2 % chance of learning one of your enemies techs if you capture a city. You can think of it as examining captured weapons or finding the one stack of papers that didnt get burned or capturing a key scientist.

 

[Lief Ericson]

Maybe only if you capture the capital? You must remember that there a numerous instances in history when this did happen, but usually only after the nation had bee defeated. Japan and Germany, for instance, after World War II, gave the U.S. many technologies, concerning biological weapons, rockets, etc. that would give the U.S. a lead in the Cold War.

 

[brinko]

germany never used biological weapons on the battlefield in ww2.
since hitler was gassed in ww1 he seen how bad and devestating it actually was, so there was never any gas attacks on the battlefield. however, it was not exempt from using on the jews, and what the used, the americans had long ago discovered.

the germans were the first ones to ever use rockets, (nebelwerfer) a day later the russians used theirs.

other then that before the war started hitler had the infamous "burning of the books"
where the nazis undertook great lengths into burning books with knowledge in them, i really think that after the war was one for the allies, there wasnt to much knowledge available from germany, but that of the v2 and me 262, worlds first fighter jet...to think if hitler would of actually believed that air superiority was key to winning wars, with the me 262, he probaly would of done it.

too bad for hitler that they built them so small

 

[DexterJ]

the germans were the first to use wire guided rockets which were launched from aeroplanes, first rockets (V1) and first missiles (V2). I think they were trying to develop a V3 to hit NY. the US also used the scientists who did experiments on people in the concentration camps as well for biological and chemical weapons.
I agree if you capture the enemys capital then you should get 1 or 2 advances - because you might capture their central store of knowledge and examples of its implementation, unless you raze the city.

 

[brinko]

it should all depend on the swiftness of attack...if the country falls within 5 turns, yes i think some techs should be aquired, but if it takes more then 10 and becomes bloody and long, then no, i dont think any.

 

[Grand Cadfael]

Actualy I've got an idea of my own on this:with a certain advance you can build a new unit,the arcaeolist(sorry for the spelling) a razed capital leave would leave ruins you park the unit their and give it a comand to search for something turns during that period theirs say a 15% chance of discovering a tech it may be something very useful chivalry (to a warmonger) or it may be music therory (once again to a warmonger)

 

[sir_schwick]

Instead of techs necessarily, culture goodies that could be attributed to any city.

 

[mikehunt]

making it a percentage chance sounds good. plus as I said have it be one of the optional rules in the game setup screen

 

[Aussie_Lurker]

Well, I think that when you capture a city, whether you get any 'beakers' towards your science-and how much-should depend on the answers to some of these questions:

1) Is the nation in question ahead of the capturing nation in any particular research streams (both in quantity of beakers invested AND # of techs ahead in said streams)? If not, then the capturing nation gains NO benefit whatever-in scientific terms-for the city capture.

2) What KIND of streams are they ahead in? Military, infrastructure and industrial techs should grant the greatest beaker 'capture', as they are easiest to 'reverse engineer', pure science, commerce and agriculture techs would produce the next best capture, the least one would be cultural and religious techs, as they are the most nebulous in nature.

3) How close is your culture group to theirs? The closer, the greater the beaker 'capture'.

4) How large is the city? The larger and more populous the city, the more beakers you can capture from it.

5) How 'long' was it between initiating hostilities against the city and actually capturing it? If you bomb a city with dozens of artillery before sending in your troops, then you should recieve fewer beakers from the capture, as the scientists and people have had ample time to 'destroy' much of the evidence of their high tech!

Hope that all made sense.

Yours,
Aussie_Lurker.

 

[iridios]

there wasnt to much knowledge available from germany, but that of the v2 and me 262, worlds first fighter jet...to think if hitler would of actually believed that air superiority was key to winning wars, with the me 262, he probaly would of done it.

Even if Hitler had thought of going for air superiority, the ME 262s came into the fight just a little bit too late to make it work. My uncle fought in WWII and was a quarter way into Germany when he saw his first 262 in a dogfight. (He was a ground soldier but got to watch plenty of the air action when in Europe.)

 

[sir_schwick]

The 262 came out in late '44, but they could have started produceing the ME 228(I think) in '40. The 228 had vastly superior ceiling, handling, and speed to the P-51 Mustang and would have been avaliable from the get-go. Of course Goering insisted that all aircraft had dive-bomb capability, putting the 228 out of the loop. This also goes along with Goering's failure to encourage the developement of a heavy bomber.

 

[Hyronymus]

Back ON topic now : instead of being able to steal techs from your enemies when you conquer a city you can also enhance the 'steal tech' option in the diplomacy screen. A nice feature could be that stealing a tech during war time is more effective than stealing a tech in times of peace. With this approach you simply improve a feature that's already their anyway.

 

[dexters]

Back ON topic now : instead of being able to steal techs from your enemies when you conquer a city you can also enhance the 'steal tech' option in the diplomacy screen. A nice feature could be that stealing a tech during war time is more effective than stealing a tech in times of peace. With this approach you simply improve a feature that's already their anyway.

Again you reward warmongers. It may becone standard exploit to declare war and rob the AI blind on the tech front.

Stealing techs without the fear of the AI declaring war on you while you're already at war is already a nice bonus under the current system.

There is a very good reason the tech reward for capturing cities was removed and I don't see a good enough reason given so far do change that, even if it was modified into what you're suggesting.

 

[Hyronymus]

Again you reward warmongers. It may becone standard exploit to declare war and rob the AI blind on the tech front.

Doesn't that entirely depend on how large your army is compared to the army of your enemy? And as I suggested it would be a higher chance, success shouldn't be a standard result of your attempts to steal technology.

 

[Khan Quest]

Well, I think that when you capture a city, whether you get any 'beakers' towards your science-and how much-should depend on the answers to some of these questions:

1) Is the nation in question ahead of the capturing nation in any particular research streams (both in quantity of beakers invested AND # of techs ahead in said streams)? If not, then the capturing nation gains NO benefit whatever-in scientific terms-for the city capture.

2) What KIND of streams are they ahead in? Military, infrastructure and industrial techs should grant the greatest beaker 'capture', as they are easiest to 'reverse engineer', pure science, commerce and agriculture techs would produce the next best capture, the least one would be cultural and religious techs, as they are the most nebulous in nature.

3) How close is your culture group to theirs? The closer, the greater the beaker 'capture'.

4) How large is the city? The larger and more populous the city, the more beakers you can capture from it.

5) How 'long' was it between initiating hostilities against the city and actually capturing it? If you bomb a city with dozens of artillery before sending in your troops, then you should recieve fewer beakers from the capture, as the scientists and people have had ample time to 'destroy' much of the evidence of their high tech!

Hope that all made sense.

Yours,
Aussie_Lurker.

I like this solution the best.

There should be some limitations to prevent a runaway tech capture such as a maxium number of beakers per civ per war or per turn.

Or maybe a decreasing percentage with each city captured (reflects common/shared research). This could change/reset when the enemy discovers a new tech.

 

[Hyronymus]

Or maybe a decreasing percentage with each city captured (reflects common/shared research). This could change/reset when the enemy discovers a new tech.

It's kind of OT (sorry about that) but you made me think: researching one tech with an ally might be a nice option for the Modern Age. Maybe put a limit on what techs can be researched together but i.e. medical, physics and chemical research could be 'shared' and perhaps militairy techs not.