Giant Death Robot in Civ !?

Do you find useful an option in Custom Game to choose if you want GDR in game or not?

  • Yes, I want that !

    Votes: 310 55.2%

  • No, not really...

    Votes: 252 44.8%
  • Total voters
    562
Lyoncet said:
I can see why people don't want unrealistic units, but you're comparing a unit that functions exactly like all the units that are (very) rough facsimiles but is unrealistic to a magic points system which is entirely at odds with how… everything, I guess, works. Not a very strong parallel.
Click to expand...

So you don't believe in magic? David Copperfield would be very much disappointed.
 
adam_grif said:
This is where all of that BS people spout about "oh, legs are great for going over rough terrain!" falls apart completely.
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In theory the advantage would have little to do with climbing over rocks, instead compare the ability for something with legs vs. something with tracks or wheels to a) jump and b) clear obstacles (e.g. step over them). Compared to wheeled vehicles you also have things like break-over angles to consider.

I'm not saying your long-winded argument was wrong, just pointing out everything you decided to skip to enforce your point. Take your 'running on rocks' argument and replace it with 'walking up steps' with the same argument of scale I'd be curious to see how well tracked or wheeled vehicle could climb steps with a 1m (3ft) riser (not quite 10x the scale of normal steps).

The added ground pressure is also not always a bad thing, consider that a 60+ ton tracked vehicle can be stopped dead in its tracks (no pun intended) by a concrete block less than 1m high and compare that to the same result of all that weight coming down on top of that same block.

Don't forget that years ago many engineers said helicopters would never work so I'm going to venture a guess that engineers aren't always right. ;)

Personally, I agree that they'd be a waste of resources in the real world but for different reasons than you focused on. Miniaturization is the way to go, not the other way around, but Hollywood likes things to be BIG. :)
 
Seven05 said:
In theory the advantage would have little to do with climbing over rocks, instead compare the ability for something with legs vs. something with tracks or wheels to a) jump and b) clear obstacles (e.g. step over them). Compared to wheeled vehicles you also have things like break-over angles to consider.
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Sounds like something going up a mountain cliff here. Better off with a helicopter or plane in this case. If terrain is so rough that jumping over big things is required on a constant basis, and the unit is on front line or in combat zone, that is too easy of a target for enemy infantry and booby traps.
 
tom2050 said:
Sounds like something going up a mountain cliff here. Better off with a helicopter or plane in this case. If terrain is so rough that jumping over big things is required on a constant basis, and the unit is on front line or in combat zone, that is too easy of a target for enemy infantry and booby traps.
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Naturally, but that comes at the price of even less armor and armament which was a bit part of the argument I was referring to. I don't think there is even a debate as to how vulnerable a helicopter is to infantry in that same situation.
 
I'd like to add my own two cents, cause i was reading the updated features list after a few months away from the forums and i was reading it and going "not bad, right on, nice, cool..... wait..... giant death robot?" so i looked this thing up and apparently this is serious, then i read this thread and somehow i found the thread that apparently started the idea. Big thumbs up to Firaxis for taking the ideas of the consumers, thumbs down for picking something so unreal. I mean im barely holding onto my suspense of disbelief because of the biped war machine, also one moment modern age, next moment super awesome future tech, my rationilization and it reflects pretty good in the game seeing that it costs the most amount of hammers out of all things, is that my military decided to go balls to the wall and spent a shitton of resources to make the best working fighting and missile launching robot they could. But still thats a stretch. But i'm gonna say something that might get some flak against me. The robot isn't all that powerful, check the units list and if all that is correct or close to it in the final game then 3 modern armor units with each a strength of 80 can take care of a GDR, maybe two if you had promotions and luck on your side. So yeah, all those turns spent on a robot that if you don't keep an eye on, take care of, plus feed its apparent hefty maintence cost and it could die so quickly by a stupid mistake or underestimating an enemy. But don't get me wrong, please keep the 1000 hammers to make the thing, i beg you, i want this to not be in the game until 200 years after im finished the tech tree and by then i might only see 1 or 2. Having these things running around everywhere when the last best unit was a modern tank is kinda killing me thinking about it lol.

Two solutions in my opinion: expand the future techs, instead of 4 extra add a good 10-15 more, something, anything more. I'd really like to see this as "Yep, I got interplanetary trade and giant death robots are the norm".

That or make it a dreadnaught, loved that dreadnaught rolling through my enemies, it truely was a land battleship. Keep all the stats and numbers to it, 150str, 1000 hammers to make, XX maintence cost per turn yadda yadda. Just change it to an awesome dreadnaught.
 
Xoatl_169 said:
I'd like to add my own two cents, cause i was reading the updated features list after a few months away from the forums and i was reading it and going "not bad, right on, nice, cool..... wait..... giant death robot?" so i looked this thing up and apparently this is serious, then i read this thread and somehow i found the thread that apparently started the idea. Big thumbs up to Firaxis for taking the ideas of the consumers, thumbs down for picking something so unreal. I mean im barely holding onto my suspense of disbelief because of the biped war machine, also one moment modern age, next moment super awesome future tech, my rationilization and it reflects pretty good in the game seeing that it costs the most amount of hammers out of all things, is that my military decided to go balls to the wall and spent a shitton of resources to make the best working fighting and missile launching robot they could. But still thats a stretch. But i'm gonna say something that might get some flak against me. The robot isn't all that powerful, check the units list and if all that is correct or close to it in the final game then 3 modern armor units with each a strength of 80 can take care of a GDR, maybe two if you had promotions and luck on your side. So yeah, all those turns spent on a robot that if you don't keep an eye on, take care of, plus feed its apparent hefty maintence cost and it could die so quickly by a stupid mistake or underestimating an enemy. But don't get me wrong, please keep the 1000 hammers to make the thing, i beg you, i want this to not be in the game until 200 years after im finished the tech tree and by then i might only see 1 or 2. Having these things running around everywhere when the last best unit was a modern tank is kinda killing me thinking about it lol.

Two solutions in my opinion: expand the future techs, instead of 4 extra add a good 10-15 more, something, anything more. I'd really like to see this as "Yep, I got interplanetary trade and giant death robots are the norm".

That or make it a dreadnaught, loved that dreadnaught rolling through my enemies, it truely was a land battleship. Keep all the stats and numbers to it, 150str, 1000 hammers to make, XX maintence cost per turn yadda yadda. Just change it to an awesome dreadnaught.
Click to expand...

Actually looking at the basic combat, the damage taken seems to be
enemy str*enemy hp/(2*me str)

so a GDR would probably kill the first modern armor that attacked it and only take ~2 damage
the next one would survive with maybe 2 hp of its own and do ~2 damage
the third would survive with ~4 hp and do ~2 damage
So you would still have 4 hp GDR and 4 hp + 2 hp Modern Armors... if there is no healing, then the 4 hp one could attack, die and maybe take 1 hp off, the second one might take another hp off and probably die.

I'd say in a mano-a-mano 3 v. 1 would be a risk bets slightly on the GDR, 4 v. 1 would be the way to ensure it goes down.. and 3-4 Modern Armors cost 1200-1600... slightly more than the GDR

Now I haven't included Flanking bonuses or discipline, because once other units get involved it gets much more complicated.

so overall it seems reasonable, can't quite stand alone if it is being flanked, but if it has support.


Although I agree with the Dreadnaught... I liked the idea of a Land Battleship (and it would fit with Nuclear fusion... you need a Fusion power plant to provide the power that it has.
 
I think a four+ legged walker would be nice. I would also like future infantry, and other future units, thus making the walker the armor of the future era.
 
Perfection -

When asked, "how did you come decide to bring the GDR into the game?" you didnt even get a mention :(, the credit went to "the designer" mike something or other, It's like you don't exist perfection! Unless your name is Mike and your the GDR designer on Civ5, in which case :goodjob:
Although its nice to know jon shafer and pete murray are excited about the GDR, :D.

Also when asked "is thier any progression into an anti-GDR unit" the answer was "no thier is no anti-GDR progression", oh yeah! GDR's are unstoppable baby!!!!

P.s I would include some epic "remove GDR button" as "Anti-GDR progression" so case closed? Confirmed indeed, no button to "anti" the GDR will exist,! thats the stuff!
 
This is just stupid IMO and I am not sure how something like this got in. There are plenty of other ideas for "future weapons"; GDR just looks like lazyness in thinking about the future of combat.

I'm kinda surprised that this is even really in the game. This is honestly the first time since Ive been playing the series that I thought that an idea was just plain dumb. (Have played the original Civ through Civ IV and every iteration of the game between)

Still look forward to the game though! :)
 
Though I absolutly hate the idea of GDR in Civ I have something to add about the realism aspect.

I see alot of people talking about the balance problem in such a machine as though this is one of the big reasons that it would never work. Well here is a video of a large (though not GIANT) 4 legged robot that has superb balance and is just generally super cool- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHJJQ0zNNOM Now no, it isnt two legged but I believe in the future that will be available as well.

Acually, I just think this is a cool vid so took advantage of the thread to post it. ;)

I still hate GDR!!
 
12agnar0k said:
P.s I would include some epic "remove GDR button" as "Anti-GDR progression" so case closed? Confirmed indeed, no button to "anti" the GDR will exist,! thats the stuff!
Click to expand...

You sound as if you are trying to predict the future with psychic abilities? I myself would not include a "remove GDR option" as an "anti-gdr progression" when the question itself was seemed to be specifically asking if there were any anti-gdr units in production to outmatch it. And for that I am thankful, because we definitly don't need 2k to include their next idea for oppositional future era unit - the giant mutated flying acid spitting lizard of death with 200 power and 50% verse the GDR.

A "GDR removal option" is in not confirmed as excluded from future expansions/patches/download content. It would be quite easy to include in any one of these types of add-ons.

2k obviously listened to a cry out from a demographic of fans to include this silly representation of future weaponry. I feel that there is a good possibility 2k again listens to the other portion of the fans and gives us a simple option to keep this unit from our games. Which in the end will have zero negative effects against the many people who voted (or meant to vote) "no" .
 
Seven05 said:
Naturally, but that comes at the price of even less armor and armament which was a bit part of the argument I was referring to. I don't think there is even a debate as to how vulnerable a helicopter is to infantry in that same situation.
Click to expand...

With all things similar, a helicopter has much higher speed and maneurability than a slow 20km/h (if your lucky) huge non-armored robot on the ground.

If there is an enemy on a mountain cliff, why make a robot climb the mountain to get them, better off doing some bombing runs and going in with troops after.
 
Pratputajao said:
Though I absolutly hate the idea of GDR in Civ I have something to add about the realism aspect.

I see alot of people talking about the balance problem in such a machine as though this is one of the big reasons that it would never work. Well here is a video of a large (though not GIANT) 4 legged robot that has superb balance and is just generally super cool- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHJJQ0zNNOM Now no, it isnt two legged but I believe in the future that will be available as well.

Acually, I just think this is a cool vid so took advantage of the thread to post it. ;)

I still hate GDR!!
Click to expand...

Yeah I've seen the BIG DOG robot and I think it's a pretty neat project they're working on but it's still primitive compared to say the balancing instinct of a chicken or bird.

This thing is pretty cool though.:cool:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gi6Ohnp9x8
 
Xoatl_169 said:
I'd like to add my own two cents, cause i was reading the updated features list after a few months away from the forums and i was reading it and going "not bad, right on, nice, cool..... wait..... giant death robot?" so i looked this thing up and apparently this is serious, then i read this thread and somehow i found the thread that apparently started the idea. Big thumbs up to Firaxis for taking the ideas of the consumers, thumbs down for picking something so unreal. I mean im barely holding onto my suspense of disbelief because of the biped war machine, also one moment modern age, next moment super awesome future tech, my rationilization and it reflects pretty good in the game seeing that it costs the most amount of hammers out of all things, is that my military decided to go balls to the wall and spent a shitton of resources to make the best working fighting and missile launching robot they could. But still thats a stretch. But i'm gonna say something that might get some flak against me. The robot isn't all that powerful, check the units list and if all that is correct or close to it in the final game then 3 modern armor units with each a strength of 80 can take care of a GDR, maybe two if you had promotions and luck on your side. So yeah, all those turns spent on a robot that if you don't keep an eye on, take care of, plus feed its apparent hefty maintence cost and it could die so quickly by a stupid mistake or underestimating an enemy. But don't get me wrong, please keep the 1000 hammers to make the thing, i beg you, i want this to not be in the game until 200 years after im finished the tech tree and by then i might only see 1 or 2. Having these things running around everywhere when the last best unit was a modern tank is kinda killing me thinking about it lol.

Two solutions in my opinion: expand the future techs, instead of 4 extra add a good 10-15 more, something, anything more. I'd really like to see this as "Yep, I got interplanetary trade and giant death robots are the norm".

That or make it a dreadnaught, loved that dreadnaught rolling through my enemies, it truely was a land battleship. Keep all the stats and numbers to it, 150str, 1000 hammers to make, XX maintence cost per turn yadda yadda. Just change it to an awesome dreadnaught.
Click to expand...


How exactly is a land battleship more real than a GDR, your just being incredibly picky.

"Oh ffs a crossbowman, lame, mega LAME, longbowman makes so much more sense to me, and of course im right."
 
Schuesseled said:
How exactly is a land battleship more real than a GDR, your just being incredibly picky.
Click to expand...

I suppose you could drag a battleship on land and it could still have some kind of defensive capabilities. Garnison it with soldiers, and such? You could even make a blockade with them so that the enemy tanks would have to go around in a big circle. Don`t expect your dryland battleships to move, though :lol:
 
instead compare the ability for something with legs vs. something with tracks or wheels to a) jump
Click to expand...

Do you often see elephants jumping over things? :confused:

How about something that's taller than an elephant, but also weighs considerably more? Now how about one that is also bipedal?

The utility of legs does not scale well with size and mass.

and b) clear obstacles (e.g. step over them). Compared to wheeled vehicles you also have things like break-over angles to consider.
Click to expand...

Is the inability to step over (low) obstacles a serious military concern, of a size such that the deployment of these lumbering, useless behemoths is deemed necessary? Isn't clearing obstacles what combat engineers are for?

Even this one potential advantage is so minor that it cannot possibly outweigh the negatives.


Take your 'running on rocks' argument and replace it with 'walking up steps' with the same argument of scale I'd be curious to see how well tracked or wheeled vehicle could climb steps with a 1m (3ft) riser (not quite 10x the scale of normal steps).
Click to expand...

Do contemporary military forces routinely run into giant, mecha scale staircases that they must traverse? Because unless they do, this is an irrelevant point.

The added ground pressure is also not always a bad thing, consider that a 60+ ton tracked vehicle can be stopped dead in its tracks (no pun intended) by a concrete block less than 1m high and compare that to the same result of all that weight coming down on top of that same block.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure what you're saying here? That being able to destroy the giant mech stairs you're walking over is a good thing? Wouldn't the ground crumbling beneath you be considered generally inadvisable on something with an extremely high centre of mass, since it's liable to simply fall over as soon as that happens?


Don't forget that years ago many engineers said helicopters would never work so I'm going to venture a guess that engineers aren't always right.
Click to expand...

Which engineers? Did they have sound arguments backing this up? This argument is usually formulated as "well they said we'd never break the sound barrier, and we did!" The issue is that it's a non-argument, because people being wrong in the past about specific things doesn't mean that we're wrong in the present about an unrelated specific thing.

You can use it to "support" any position, including contradictory ones. Although I say "support" in huge air quotes, because the conclusion never follows from the premise.
 
The Defense against the GDR...the GDF (Giant Death Fortress),complete with a pretty maiden inside to rescue:lol:
Leviathan+006.jpg
 
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