GOTM 42 Second Spoiler - Entering the Industrial Ages

Mark Cutt · Apr 29, 2005

Going for Spaceship victory.

Rome became a Republic and entered MA around 500BC. At this point I had 9 cities and 11 warrior.

WARS & GLs
In 330BC Egypt didn't want to leave my territory and declared war on us. My Legionaries triggered GA in the same year. The war was slow but easy, Egypt was terminated in 230AD.
In 30BC I got my first GL, he built Copernicus in Rome.

In the meanwhile I tried to find the other continent but I lost 2 galleys to barbs.

Around 400AD I attacked Greece. I got the 2nd GL in 440AD who built FP in Thermopylae (the former Greek capitol) in 490AD. The 3rd GL appeared in 690AD and built Newton University in Rome. In 730AD Greeks were banned from the main continent.

In 790AD Rome attacked Carthage. in 800AD we got the 4th GL who built JSB to increase population happiness. This was my first "defensive" GL since ages. In 860AD Carthage was terminated.

Around 1000AD I terminated Grece and got the 5th GL who built ToE.

I met the other continent civs in 770AD. They were behind in tech. Only Russia has enough money to buy techs from Rome.

In 1180AD I attacked Aztecs just to connect Incense and to produce GL (the 6th arrived few turns later), I conquered two cities and sign a good peace treaty.

After the short Aztec war nothing special happened. I built both SETI and Internet.

I was surprised when, 4 turns before my spaceship launch, Russia attacked my 2 "aztec" cities. I was so surprised that I lost the city with incense. One turn before the end I got a second "defensive" GL.

Quick Survey: How many of you have ever got 2 defensive GL in a game?

TECHNOLOGY
I did not manage to keep a 4 turns pace for technology. During IA Rome needed an average of 5 turns (maybe more). Only after the Internet I managed to keep a 4 turns pace.

I launched my spaceship in 1610AD ... not a great date but this is my first spaceship attempt since 2 years ... I can only improve my performance.

ionimplant · Apr 29, 2005

Mark Cutt said:
Quick Survey: How many of you have ever got 2 defensive GL in a game?

i only did that once with an elite pikeman. the generated lead was killed immediately in that turn before i got a chance to move it. :mad:

it isn't in gotm though and so not too bad.

Jove · Apr 29, 2005

Predator. Goal: Domination

Arrrr, I thought I was off to a roaring start. 30AD Im a new monarchy, in the middle ages, my GA has started, and I have contact with the other continent. DOW on Vikings, Celts, ally the Aztecs and Russians for currency. All I have to do is wipe out the Carthaginians and Greeks and Im home free, right?
It didnt work out quite that way. Maybe I spent too much of my GA building libraries instead of legionaries. I start the war with Carthage in 170, using cats to bring down those NIs a little. In 250 I had occupied Carthage and captured the Great Library, gaining Republic and Monotheism. To repel the Carthages GA counterattack I moved a number of units into Carthage to defend it, and sure enough it flipped that very turn. I lost 6 or 7 units, but it was bad enough to qualify as a disaster. I couldnt fight anymore just now, so in 290 its peace for a town, Chivalry in 10, Greece with its cities on the hills is next. I didnt fight Carthage again for a looooong time. I MUST learn to keep my units out of foreign towns!!!!
It didnt have to be that bad. But it got worse. Greece had the Great Wall, so I made sure to build a very healthy stack of cats while I waited and saved for knights. In 470 I felt I was ready. Except for that PTW bug where bombarding towns with walls supplied by the Great Wall causes the game to crash. Forgot all about that. So all those cats that could have been horsemen or whatever (18 or so) turn out to be absolutely useless. Damn. Once I realized this, I went ahead with the headlong charge against Knossos, hoplites fortified on hill with double strength walls, sheesh! 6 dead and many red knights later I give up, and wait to build and overwhelming knight force. My game quit being competitive somewhere around this point..
I was ready again in 620. This time I won. 650 I cut Greece off from the horses, 700 Greece starts having muskets. Great. Finally got my first leader in 680, settled for my second choice of FP locations in 710. In 850 I captured Sparta and the Great Wall. Finally. Id played this land is my land with Greece as much as Id fought them, settling their land as often as I took it by force. Thank goodness I had chosen to be a monarchy, or war weariness and unit support would have eaten me alive!
Anyway, getting the great wall was the turning point. Id spent the game fomenting on the other continent, giving up everything, including contact, just to keep them fighting. Eventually I got a city for peace from the Aztecs without ever setting foot on that continent. First time I ever did that, thanks to Aeson for the idea. I made peace with everyone, bought settlers over there, gained furs, cut off saltpeter, and prepared to invade while I cleaned up the other continent and worked on Barb Island.
Once I got MT, the other continent was easy to defeat. Even with my disasters, this game could have been faster with better planning of my navy and faster research. An earlier GL would have been nice. The first was in 680, leaders 2-8 appeared after 930. Twice in the 1200s I got 2 leaders in one turn. Weird luck this game.

Domination in 1345. 8185 Jason points. Couldve been worse. Ill have to check, I think this is my first domination submission! I will do better next time.
Hey, thanks staff for the recent run of great maps! Keep it up!

Redbad · Apr 29, 2005

@Jove
I think you probably should have have gone for MT in the first place: a Greek or Cathagian fortified defender is tough for a knight

BTW
Shouldn't you change your avatar to something like COTM9 rocketman?

Jove · Apr 29, 2005

@Redbad
I should have done a lot of things this game. I wanted to edit into my report that when I recaptured the Great Library in 940, I got Astronomy, Banking, Printing Press, Economics, and Navigation. I really thought on emporer the AI would have had at least Chemistry by now, maybe even Metallurgy, but I guess I did too good a job fomenting. As a monarchy, I didn't have the gold to do really fast research, and my original strategy went out the window, so I kind of had to improvise. But thanks Redbad, any advice is always welcome. I think you're right.
Regarding the avatar, well, you're joking, but I'm considering changing it to the face of the SoZ wonder splash. My concern is appearing, um, something other than humble. What do you think?

Redbad · Apr 29, 2005

I agree it's most uncommon for the AI to research that deep on the upper region of the MA techtree, while having so little researched on the bottom tree. And then as you said, you're in trouble being in Monarchy and having to research yourself to MT.
I didn't realise it, as in my game and in some other posts the AI (and especially the Greek) had little trouble researching towards MT.
But then again it is one of nice things of the Civ-games: even with the same starting situation they can turn out very differently. This also without the interference of the human player. A nice example of that is the different situation that evolves on the other continent, when you read the posts.

btw.
The SoZ does seem a little over the edge... but the SoP(oseidon) would be in order

(With my little joke, I see now I should have referred to the signature and not the avatar.)

Edit
Arrr you really got me this time Jove. I only realise now that Jove is Jupiter :blush:

So Zeus is your Greek name

Jove · Apr 30, 2005

Redbad said:
I agree it's most uncommon for the AI to research that deep on the upper region of the MA techtree, while having so little researched on the bottom tree.

I hadn't really looked at it as uncommon, just a big pain. But I think you're right. It looks like I killed and/or redirected the AI research without killing the AI. (Assuming my actions were the determining factor). It would be handier if I could do that strictly at will.

Redbad said:
the SoP(oseidon) would be in order

Well, Poseidon does have a fantastic beard, and it floats all over the place, which renders really well into stone.... Sounds good! Why don't you upload the graphic for me?

Megalou · May 1, 2005

Open,

Gah! RedBad is giving me problems with my victory condition. I had sort of decided on the MOO TOO but it's so boring that I feel it's cruel if either of us has to miss the award. (Best thing would be if only one fanatic went for it.)

It would probably be close. Obviously the hairy one had a better start, but I was faster subduing the Greeks and Carthaginians and had all but destroyed the Aztecs when the Middle Ages ended (1060 AD.) One thing that favours Redbad is that I usually keep my citizens one hair's breadth from rioting in the early stages of the game. And I haven't purposely increased my population by building more cities within my borders.

Sorry, can't make up my mind now.

Here's a detailed but not exhaustive timeline:

Spoiler :

Redbad · May 1, 2005

Megalou said:
Gah! RedBad is giving me problems with my victory condition. I had sort of decided on the MOO TOO but it's so boring that I feel it's cruel if either of us has to miss the award. (Best thing would be if only one fanatic went for it.)

Please do compete, Megalou.

I wasn't that happy with my result, but if there isn't any competition I'll never know if it was indeed a mediocre result. I would be a little surprised if you won't outscore me: getting rid of the Greek and Carthagians earlier is a good advantage and I find your COTM10 firaxis quite worrying, especially considering that it's a milking that went wrong.

And above all: someday I want to tell my grandchildren that their grandpa fought the mighty Megalou.

Megalou · May 2, 2005

Correction: The Mightier-Than-He-Thinks Megalou. In his darkest dreams he has visions of a beard ablaze, consuming all it touches. And there is also the time factor and a new COTM to consider. I haven't played another turn since I saw your tantalizing post, and I'm gonna tantalize you back by not revealing my decision.

Shigella · May 8, 2005

1.27

Going for domination.

Link to Ancient Age Spoiler

I entered the Middle Ages in my Golden Age and at war with Egypt. I had just captured the Great Library in Thebes.

Egyptian War: 610 BC (continued from previous spoiler) 30 BC
Progress was rapid against the Egyptians. I captured their last town on the continent in 310 BC, but they had a settler in a boat. No problem, I figured. I would just let them found their town on an island and then go kill it. Unfortunately, I encountered a significant problem with this plan. Egypt founded a new town on the small western island in 210 BC, and I sent a couple of legions over to take them out in 130 BC. What is wrong with this picture?

This is 5 or 6 turns since the Egyptians founded their town, and they already have a worker who has completed a road and a mine. The AI never sends workers in boats, and the island doesnt have a 2-food square. In other words, Egypts new capital had been founded as a re-spawn, rather than a simply a town guarded by a single spear. Has anyone else ever documented this occurs when a civ re-founds a capital with a settler in a boat??? :crazyeye:

I tried to take their capital in 50 BC with 4 legions, but couldnt kill all their troops (I counted at least 4 spears and 2 archers that I eventually killed). I was distracted elsewhere at the time, so I decided to give them peace in 30 BC.

Regionally Intense Barbarian Activity:
Meanwhile, I was sending some settlers down to the southern island. I landed my first settler pair down there in 110 BC (after sailing along the coast for 3 turns before I found an open tile). My legion escort survived the first turn and I founded a town on the island in 90 BC. I immediately lost the legion and was ransacked by the 15 barb horses in the greeting party.

I had a foothold on the island, but barbs would be poofing themselves into my town for the next several centuries. In retrospect, my approach here might have been a mistake. I made certain that I spent as much gold as possible at the end of each turn, so I was able to minimize the amount of gold the barbs carried away. It took a long time to fully occupy this island, and I dispersed at least 8 camps in the process of doing so.

Government:
The Great Library taught us Monarchy at the end of the 110 BC turn, and I immediately revolted. After a 5-turn anarchy, I was a Monarch in 10 BC. I dont know if this was the right decision, as I was low on gold for most of the game. However, I did a LOT of war-mongering and didnt have to pay very much luxury tax or unit support for the rest of the game.

Second Greek War: 50 AD 130 AD
Alex had demanded tribute again at the end of the 150 BC turn, and I told him to piss off again. This time he backed down. I took the warfare to him in 50 AD by using ROP abuse to capture 4 of their core cities, including Athens. I lost 17 legionaries in the initial assault, while killing 11 hoplites. I was already dreadfully behind in culture, so all of the Greek cities were burned to the ground and I filled space with several settlers.

This initial assault also left me a bit thin on attackers, so I fought a holding action until the Greeks would talk. Alex would finally chat in 130 AD, but I still hadnt generated a great leader to rush my FP. I decided to attack the lone Greek troop within range of one of my elites before giving peace, and generated my first leader!

I immediately gave a peace treaty to the Greeks (charging Alex an island town and all his gold), and rushed my FP on the same turn in a town I had founded in old Greek territory.

Contacting the Other Continent:
I finally sent out some more suicide galleys in 190 AD and met Russia in 230 AD. I traded for contacts and maps, but did not sell my contacts to the other civs. I had already broken a ROP deal, and was planning several more dastardly acts in the near future. I didnt foment any wars on the other continent, as they were doing a decent job of that without my help (Aztecs v Russia; Vikings v Celts). I did sell some tech to the other civs when they could pay decent GPT, so that helped my economy a bit. Unfortunately, that also sped them along to Gunpowder.

Second Egyptian War: 340 AD 380 AD
I finally landed some more troops on the Egyptian island in 340 AD. By this time, my formerly Greek town on their island had flipped to Egypt. I captured Egyptian capital and eliminated them in 380 AD.

Carthaginian War: 350 AD 620 AD
This war was fought with MIs and a few legions. I used ROP abuse (I had signed a ROP agreement with Carthage right before abusing it against the Greeks) and captured (and quickly burned) four cities including their capital. After the initial backstab, I made slow but steady progress against them. I gave them a phony peace for a town on barb island in 600 AD. I re-declared in 610 AD and captured their last town in 620 AD. I burned most Carthaginian towns due to the very high flip probabilities, but did keep a few including their town containing the Great Lighthouse.

Third Greek War: 420 AD 610 AD
I used MIs and legions in this conflict as well. Progress was painfully slow, but I eventually eliminated the Greeks in 610 AD. I burned most of their towns, but did manage to keep a few at the end.

Continued in next post.

Shigella · May 8, 2005

The net effect of all my war-mongering on the home continent was that I had eliminated Egypt, Greece and Carthage before they could meet the other continent. So, despite all my back-stabbing, my rep on the other continent was as pure as the driven snow. Of course, it wouldnt take me long to tarnish my reputation with the other civs either.

Before delving into more warfare, here are some other developments during the Middle Ages:
350 BC Golden Age over
210 BC Carthage completed the Great Lighthouse
580 AD Russia completed Leos in Moscow.
600 AD I FINALLY generated my second (and last) great leader on my 48th elite victory. It was too late for Leos, so I used it to create an empty army (later to be a knight army) to use as a nut-cracker on the other continent.
700 AD I finally completed a temple, only the third culture-generating building in my empire!

Free Techs, Some Trades and Just a Little Bit of Research:
I relied on the Great Library to provide tech for a long time, learning Monarchy in 110 BC, Feudalism and Engineering in 90 AD, Theology in 250 AD and Education in 400 AD. I traded for Gunpowder and Chivalry after the library expired.

I finally started research on Astronomy in 480 AD, but it was learned on the other continent in 490 AD. I traded for Astronomy in 500 AD and started research on Navigation. Being a bloody monarch with no science buildings (I never built a library the whole game), I didnt learn Navigation until the end of the 590 AD turn.

In 800 AD, I purchased Chemistry, Banking, Music Theory, their WM and 158 gold for 124 GPT. I then traded Chemistry to the Celts for Printing Press and some GPT. I declared war Russia the same turn, so I never paid for their techs and gold.

Aztec War: 500 AD 760 AD
In 500 AD, I had signed a military alliance with the Russians against the Aztecs (to cheapen the cost of Astronomy when I traded for it). Of course, this was a phony war until I learned Navigation (in 590 AD). After my Greek campaign ended in 610 AD, I immediately started assembling those troops to send them toward Aztec territory. The fleet landed 22 MIs and 2 legions in Aztec territory in 680 AD, and the carnage on the other continent began in earnest. The Aztecs were defending with spears and a few pikes, and most of their troops were at the Russian front. The biggest problems I had were the logistics of getting slow-moving troops through their territory and dealing with a few flips in captured towns (I didnt raze any Aztec towns). The Aztecs were eliminated in 760 AD.

Russian War: 800 AD 890 AD
Russia had muskets everywhere, and my attack force was comprised of MIs, a few knights and a 3-knight army. I used ROP abuse to capture Moscow (which contained Leos) and four other Russian towns in 800 AD. I immediately upgraded a pile of horsemen to knights back home, and then ship-chained them into the fray during the next few turns. Moscow was burned the next turn, as it was bound to flip back to Russia. Holding Leos for 2 turns saved me about 1200 gold in upgrades, so it had served its purpose. I had a few headaches with remote Russian cities, but managed to eliminate them in 890 AD.

Final Touches:
I was shipping settlers over to the other continent during my Russian campaign and used them to fill in spaces around captured Russian towns. Finally, I had to start poaching some land from the Celts by founding towns right against their cultural borders. I was a little late rushing some temples back in the homeland, so I didnt trigger domination until I got several cultural expansions and poached some more Celt territory in 910 AD.

Bottom Line:
Domination victory in 920 AD. Firaxis score 7468. Jason 9905.

I dont think Jason scores are going to be anywhere near the levels reached in GOTM41, so I wasnt too disappointed to just miss 10K.

Finally, some mini-maps.

klarius · May 9, 2005

Shigella said:
This is 5 or 6 turns since the Egyptians founded their town, and they already have a worker who has completed a road and a mine. The AI never sends workers in boats, and the island doesnt have a 2-food square. In other words, Egypts new capital had been founded as a re-spawn, rather than a simply a town guarded by a single spear. Has anyone else ever documented this occurs when a civ re-founds a capital with a settler in a boat???

When a civ founds it's first city it gets the difficulty level dependent bonus units.
This happens in the beginning, but also if a settler founds a new first city, after all cities are gone. So on emperor they get 4 defenders, 2 attackers and a worker.
It's not a respawn, then they would get even more units (iirc 7 defenders, 3 attackers, 2 workers and a settler on emperor).

k-a-bob · May 9, 2005

First spoiler: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=2752724#post2752724

Egypt still lives, but not for long. I plant a city close to Thebes so I can get to attack in 1 turn, build my forces and am ready for claiming the site for its rightful owner, and future summer home for great Caeser.

DoW, take Thebes and raze it (I can tell I will be doing a lot of this - I am not doing well culturally against anyone.) and replace with my own settler, founding Thebopolis. FP immediately started. I signed Greece and Carth in on this one, and I sit back for the most part building and filling in cities while they deal with Egypt.
After Egypt is destroyed, I command the area in between the 2 northern occupiers of Roman lands. They apparantly don't like each other, and commence hostilities. I immediately sign RoP with both, and watch the battles in my northern lands, weakening both sides.
I notice Greece starts getting the upper hand, so I slow his advance by forcing him through unroaded mountain tiles. I see my chance.
I am the only one with salt hooked up (site north of Thebopolis), but then disaster! My salt city flips to Greece. That seals it. I move out of their territory and attack. I sign with Carthage, and we start running through Greek lands. I end up taking all cities south of Athens (Athens border touches Roman red) and Carth gets 2 northern sites on the peninsula to the east of Athens. I make peace since WW is starting to bother me (Republic).

In the meanwhile, I am first to find the new continent, and I trade to be at tech par with everyone except Russia. Russia only has about 10 cities, but they look like they will be monsters eventually. They are tech leader, and all cities are maxed at 12.

Vikings are points leader, then Greece (but not for long) then Russia.
I am last among living civs. That will not last for long either. Carthage is starting to annoy me, because I don't like their num. mercs running around.

By the time I hit the next age, everyone is furious with me (probably from all the razing). I still have no idea how I will win. Culturally I am in last, but Russia and the Celts are close together, so I don't think I will have to worry about it, unless one is wiped out.

Overall, I am pretty pleased that I am doing this well on a level I have never played before, with a hemmed in start.

My score is rising quickly, so I should be near the top rather quickly.

tR1cKy · May 15, 2005

I'll make it! I've just entered the industrial age, and at a glance i should be at 50 tiles short of domination, or even less.

The game is really top quality. :wow:

It's been great to play it, so much that, in the late turns, i preferred enjoying the game rather than winning in the fastest way possible. A furious rush for conquest has gradually turned into a slow, majestic march to world domination.

Time is enough to post a detailed report and then to play the remaining few turns into the industrial age. I'm writing it right now.

tR1cKy · May 15, 2005

FIRST PUNIC WAR

I've entered middle ages in 70BC, still in despotism. In the first turns i do nothing but amass troops and research Monarchy at a fastest rate available. A good bunch of warriors is ready to be upgraded into legions. In the meantime, i amass the max troops available for an expansion into Carthaginians territory. Archers and spears are becoming obsolete, so they are quite expendable. If a lot of them falls it's not a tragedy, and the survivors can be useful as an el-cheapo MP force.

In 30AD i declare on Carthage. A city is razed and refounded, and in the battle a leader is generated. The Forbidden Palace may be rushed in Thebes and the planned 2nd core of the empire becomes fully functional. Too bad the carthaginians offer a fiery resistance. Lots of harassers come around and i lose some precious troops to keep them away from the ex-egyptian cities.

In 150AD Monarchy is learned. I hold a revolution immediately and get 3 turns of anarchy. Next turn, a 2nd carthaginian city is razed and refounded but the attack is almost repealed and i leave 9 archers dead on the battlefield. The troops left spare for skirmishes perform even worse. 3 archers dead and not a single enemy swordsman killed. Peace must be signed immediately.

In the negotiations, i carve out Monotheism tossing in the deal 310 quids.

THE GREEK WAR

The first turn in monarchy are used to rebuild the military and amass forces. War with Greece is declared in 310AD and goes on for centuries almost uninterrupted, until Greece is completely eliminated.

The greek have been quite a problem. They were the runaway AS in culture from the very beginning. With a culture ratio near 9:1, the mere idea of keeping any captured city is simply insane. Scorched earth was the only option. I torch a few greek cities, resettle the open space at a good distance from greek boundaries and rush immediately a temple to avoid dirty tricks from cultural expansion. This strategy goes on flawless until 490AD. In this year i move a big stack just outside the major city of Thermopylae, with the intent of razing it as usual. In the interturn, Thermopylae completes the Sistine Chapel.

At this point i decide to keep Thermopylae. The idea is to have some cities near the core to grow big while mantaining the WLKTD. With Sistine owned, a marketplace, a cathedral and a few luxury spending are enough to remove unhappiness. Thermopilae is taken and some insurance troops are kept outside the city to retake it.

Two turns lated, my troops are just outside Athens, ready to take it next turn. And the interturn, Athens completes Sun Tzu. Since it already had the Pyramids, it is too good to be razed. Another city is captured and more insurance must be parked outside a city rather than used in battle. Obviously, i've left them open for recapture whenever possible, but even so they managed to flip back a few times. Athens 3, Thermopylae 2.

For two times i signed peace with Alex and extorted cities only to have war redeclared next turn. It was a just a way to speed up assimilation. Some distant cities were too distant worthless to spend the necessary turns for capture, but extorting them was fine.

In 670AD, a third city is captured rather than razed. It's Sparta and contains the Great Lighthouse. The remaining greek territory is quickly assimilated. In 730AD, Greece is reduced to a single colony on the Barb Island. In 800AD it becomes history.

THIRD EGYPTIAN WAR

The Egyptian have played 2CC since my last campaign against them. They were culturally insignificant, and with all my forces engaging Greece it was a waste to capture those last 2 cities. Right after clearing the mainland from the Greek presence, the remnants of Egypt are assimilated. It takes only 2 turns to get rid of them.

CONTACTS

I've been quite unsuccessful with suicide galleys. After a few failed attempts, in 730AD a boat sailing from the NW frozen island reaches the Aztec shorelines. All the other continent civs are met in the next turns. I get a full world map and some money for selling mine. The Aztecs are quite backward, but the other 3 civs are advanced and strong.

SECOND PUNIC WAR

In 860AD the assimilation of the Carthaginian nation begins. After amassing a sheer number of legions and persian mercs, a RoP is signed despite my broken rep (i toss in spices and money). 3 cities are captured immediately, then the big stack moves toward Carthage. The 2nd leader of the whole game is created, and i use it to rush Leo's workshop somewhere after buying Invention from the vikings.

THE GREAT LEAP FORWARD

Carthage is captured in 940AD. In the interturn, the captured Great Library grants me a sheer load of medieval techs: Theology, Chivalry, Music Theory, Education, Gunpowder, Banking, Astronomy, Chemistry and Navigation.

With Navigation known i can trade with anyone. Incense and furs are secured. With 6 luxuries owned, happiness rises substantially everywhere, and for the 1st time i note that the score is rising a lot. I tried to keep up happiness in order to obtain WLKTD almost everywhere (and so boost production and money), and a side effect of this strategy is the score going up.

REPUTATION DISASTER

In 1030AD the last carthaginian city is captured, but they aren't out of the game yet. Here's something that i really don't like, and after this game i like it even less. A boat with a settler embarked is floating around. Some caravels that were already amassing to invade the Aztecs must be sent around to eliminate the boat ASAP. I kill 2 galleys (losing 2 caravels) with no success. Then the disaster happens. The vikings build a settlement on a tiny open space on the Barb Island. Next turn a Carthaginian galley passes by... the rest is easy to understand. Rep thrashed everywhere and bye bye with the idea of buying the remaining techs with gpt.

Two turns later, a damaged caravel is intercepted and sunk, and the carthaginians are gone for good. Too late.

Uh, didn't i mention that i was researching Metallurgy at max, only to see Russians, Vikings and Keltoi to apparently complete it the very same turn as mine? :mad:

AZTEC WAR

The Aztecs were quite backward. Cities defended by spears and a few pikes. No match against longbows, knights and mercs. War is declared in 1150AD. Incense is owned from the very beginning. In 1200AD i sign peace and extort Physics, then i exchange Printing Press for Navigation. War is redeclared immediately and in 1265AD, the aztec nation is completely assimilated into the Roman Empire.

WORLD WAR

In the late middle ages the AS go war-crazy. In 1200AD the vikings demand ivory. I refuse and they declare. They were collecting from me 3 luxuries and 52 gpt in return of furs. Go figure. I immediately draw Russia in an alliance against them.

I've put my personal contribution in this by declaring on the Keltoi in 1250. Controlling dyes was my goal, but even expansion and some possible pointy-stick research was considered. I've razed 3 keltoi cities and founded 5 of mine in the open space. Peace is signed in 1355 and Magnetism is extorted.

Meanwhile, the war with the Vikings continued uninterrupted, with the Russians also beating hard on them. I've razed a few vikings cities and substituted them with Roman settlements. Got control of furs and almost on the domination limit. But the war (and the game) isn't finished in this era. Just for the fun of it, in 1380AD i buy Theory of Gravity from the Keltoi and finally come out from an endless Middle Age.

Here's the score progression at the end of Middle Ages:

civ_steve · May 17, 2005

Predator -

Just got this one submitted with 2 hours to spare (again!) Went for a very simple, Despotic Domination victory.

Starting location was pretty bad; finally settled in 3700 BC on River Grassland to East of Wine space. Already had an idea about how much Desert and Jungle were around me, so a Palace Jump was definitely in the works.

Contacted Egypt, then Carthage, fairly quickly, and Greece somewhat later. Egypt was the target. I thought I would revolt later, so I used only Archers against Egypt. Built 2 more cities, Barracks in all 3, and a 10 high stack of Archers with more coming did the trick; captured Thebes and another city, destroyed 2, and got 3 more in Peace negotiatons; disbanded Rome shortly after to place my Capital in Thebes; this is roughly mid-600's BC. I also get my first GL in the last combat; I'll hold this for my FP.

By this time, I'm running out of time. So I abandon thoughts of higher forms of Government; I'll stay in Despotism, building Vet Warriors in my core cities for now, and plan to pop-rush Galleys in my border, coastal towns. Meanwhile I'll do minimal on Republic with one Scientist, and save money for Legion upgrades.

Greece makes one demand too many in 300'ish BC, no way, and he declares. I've got about 15 Vet Warriors in my closest border town, so it's time to connect Iron and start upgrades. My Despotic GA starts shortly after. Now Athens has the Pyramids (good) AND the Great Wall (not good). After demolishing Alex's attack forces, my legions sally forth, capturing his closest Border town (Knossus, which is on the Horse resource, so I can now build Horsemen - yay). A stack of Legions escorts a Settler forward to found a city right in the middle of Greece, and my GL builds the FP here; this will be my 2nd core. A huge stack of Legions attacks Athens some time later, and I don't quite take it :mad:

but I do get 2 GL's who form Armies. A 2nd wave with the army takes Athens the following turn, and it is the (very slow) beginning of the end. Greece's 3 defense Hoplites are tough for the Legions, especially all the times Athens decides to flip back and have to be retaken.

Meanwhile, a suicide galley makes contact with the 2nd continent in 70 AD. Four turns later in 150 AD my minimal on Republic finishes and I'm able to trade for all other AA techs, entering the Middle Ages. After taking all but 3 Greek cities in the North corner of the continent and 2 on the Ice island, I sign peace getting Feudalism and Monotheism from Alex, sometime around 300 AD.

I've been building up a Horsemen army in the meantime, and research Chivalry fairly quickly, but Carthage is already heading up the lower tech path. I got a big stack of Knights going against Carthage, but I get bogged down, and once the Muskets show up, I have to sign peace, managing to get up to Gunpowder myself, right around 700 AD.

I resign myself to researching to Military Tradition; Knights are marginal against Hoplites and NumMercs, and not strong enough against Muskets. 10 turns for Chemistry, Metallurgy and MilTrad finally researched in 1020 AD. I'm also able to trade Metallurgy for the AI Techs, all the way up to Navigation so the crossing is not a problem and I've kept MilTrad for myself. In the meantime I've been pop-rushing Galleys and Horsemen (one of my later GL's rushed Sun-Tzu's, so all my towns make Vet units) and have about 60 Ships and over 100 horse units by this time. It goes quickly after this, Greece, then Carthage, and on to the 2nd continent which is down to just Vikings and Celts due to some mischief I'd caused to happen. Domination in 1280AD.

Starting location definitely slowed things down; requires establishing a new core which takes some time.

3 Defense units are tough, especially before Knights, and really tough when Greece has the Great Wall!

It's amazing how big a force can be pop-rushed in Despotism when you have Pyramids and Sun-Tzu's; however the research really lagged - 10 turn research at the end of the MidAges.

GOTM 42 Second Spoiler - Entering the Industrial Ages

Mark Cutt

Analytic Chieftain

ionimplant

Prince

Jove

Not Lacking Altitude

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Redbad

should have shaved

Jove

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Redbad

should have shaved

Jove

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Megalou

Money is the currency of fear

Redbad

should have shaved

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Shigella

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Shigella

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klarius

... !

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Waiting patiently.......

tR1cKy

taking over the world

tR1cKy

taking over the world

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civ_steve

Deity

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