GOTM 68 Spoiler

[URUWASHI]

I disagree , No wonders except t Pyramids were essential.
Magellan was a good though...but unnecessary in my play book since I was building Airbases every 10 tiles
Bach , Michelangelo , will be necessary if you play in Democracy....why will a war fought in democracy ?? TRade is useless, in Fact I have not aquired " The Laser " and is 2029 ..what doI want it for ?
Look at the Map and you find the Irrigated SQuares.
The UN is unnecessary..Apollo is an option until you realize that Irrigated squares are a city location....
Apollo was a consideration ....but a waist of shelds
What I did was build Air Bases every 10 squares, and move my troops without a Carrier I Build Paratroopers , Bombers , Fighters and missiles and send them all over...every 60 squares I will built a city...just to send my troops ..Paris , Beijiing , Moscow and Madrid after conquered had airports...Caravans were useless , so I sent my paratroopers thru the UPS, speeding the conquest.
Should have made more concrete plans about the English and I could have finished several turns earlier.
Democracy was a No - No, the other " trick " I played was allowing the Barbarians to take a city of + 3 .....soon as the city was conquered you get 9 to 10 Partisans ..then take the city over with a Spy, and 10 free defending units ( that were at the end unnecesary ) because the AI had not expanded
Im sure that If I play game again , knowing the issues , it could be conquered by 2028..I was expecting the AI to have more cities .....
Anyhow , taking a break , will finish the game tomorrow

 

[golem]

Except for the 20 points, Apollo was unnecessary. All you had to do was examine the map for farmland. It took me less than 5 minutes to find all the AI civs after reading Peaster's post #1. This is not really a huge map. It just seems like it. It is just a long ribbon and you can see both poles at the same time, so just clicking around the world solves the problem.

I suppose you are right. My problem is that I hate looking for one lost city somewhere in the map.

On the other hand, what would you do if the capital was somewhere inside - not on the coast. I did not read spoilers before, so I did not know the locations.

 

[golem]

I it could be conquered by 2028..I was expecting the AI to have more cities .....

I agree, maybe even sooner. I have twice more cities and units than I need. I thought AI's will have more cities two - only French had two cities in my game.

 

[Tanstaafl]

I used the transports, veteran armor and spies to roam the coasts and through the continents/islands to find the other civs. Didn't build much...Adam Smith to make things cheap and the basics for only 3 of my own cities: granary, walls, barracks, port facility, temples, aqueducts.
Finished in 2038 Sep. Should have been faster but underated my needs in whipping the other civs.

 

[URUWASHI]

One thing that I should point.
As the game started, I look for the Irrigated tiles...and found 5.
Could not find the 6th...and I wondered , with such a massive map if I have overlooked.
Wrote the location of all Irrigated tiles.....and again, Came up with 5...!!
Interestingly the one that belong to the Blue ( I learned that later ) was invisible and I found it by luck.
Since I started settling the " Island " to the south...I realized that location 174.34 near the south pole will allow a passage by building a city to the next island....then I also realized that it was 2 great spots on the " Next" island to the left...that had to great place to buid cities and get thru the Continent ( 151.25 and 155.25 ) , I build my cities there so my transports could get a faster route to the west then " Paris " appeared...the only "irrigated " square that was not visible...
I have also some luck with the Barbarians....let them conquer 3 of my size 4 cities, and got 10 to 12 " None " Partisans per city..then I dismantel them and 2 Partisans ( 50 shield ) + 10 , bought me several Cruise Missiles..
So I got about 15 " Free " Missiles and Paratroopers.
I made some basic misstakes ( ie , creating too many Bombers 120 shield , instead I could have created Cruise Missiles , or Paratroopers 60 shields )
Creating airbases is confusing because the distance between them is critical....I built 2 or 3 AirBases a bit to far ( 11 or 12 Tiles , instead of 10 ). Paratroopers are Ok , but Fighters were not...then I realized..I did not need any fighters....!
I think Cruise Missiles and Paratroopers are the simplest faster solution in this game.
Still, is October 2029 and Only the english are Left, I am very Near their Capital, but I have only 1 settler Buiding airbases from Moscow to the East ..I am thinking " How " can I finish this before December , and is almost imposible.

 

[Bestbank Tiger]

This GOTM was a great concept.

I expanded southwest, made it across the second continent, then sailed west to the continent that turned out to be the EU's. They immediately sneak-attacked that city and killed it off

I loaded an engineer and a few defensive units onto a transport and built on that little one-square island, which was within cruise missile and paratrooper range of Paris. Then I rained cruise missiles on Paris until it was undefended and dropped a paratrooper in. Bye-bye, you sneak attacking weasels. Eat that.

Overall I didn't do that well--my power is Supreme but I'm not used to playing Deity. I probably won't be able to conquer the world by the end of the game, plus I forgot to save when I was supposed to.

 

[Ace]

I suppose you are right. My problem is that I hate looking for one lost city somewhere in the map.

On the other hand, what would you do if the capital was somewhere inside - not on the coast. I did not read spoilers before, so I did not know the locations.

A couple of the Capitals were 2-4 hexes inland. No problem, land a settler, build a city, move your transport and ageis cruiser into the city, and wipe out the AI city.

 

[Merlin_Pilgrim]

I have also some luck with the Barbarians....let them conquer 3 of my size 4 cities, and got 10 to 12 " None " Partisans per city..then I dismantel them and 2 Partisans ( 50 shield ) + 10 , bought me several Cruise Missiles..

That is just a very nice trick - thanks for that

Still, is October 2029 and Only the english are Left, I am very Near their Capital, but I have only 1 settler Buiding airbases from Moscow to the East ..I am thinking " How " can I finish this before December , and is almost imposible.

I re-tried the game twice and with different strategies I came up ending in sept or oct 2029. I think it's very hard to finish in 2028.

But I got a question concerning the scoring system of the Civ II game. How come that I got totally different scores even though I finished the same time (oct 2029). Once I got 104% (7.26 Mio people, 6 Wows) and the other time I got 164% (5.37 Mio people, 4 Wows) - is it to do with the less cities you have the more scoring points you get?

And where can I find the scoring system of the GOTM. I have seen it before but can't find it again.

Thanks for any help and comments

 

[Magic_gorter]

And where can I find the scoring system of the GOTM. I have seen it before but can't find it again.

Look at
http://civ2gotm.civfanatics.net/civ2gotmrules.shtml

There is also a link to download an excel file with the GOTM score.
Is very easy to use.

 

[Peaster]

Bye-bye, you sneak attacking weasels.

Yep. I like to leave my cities undefended, and have had several little problems with sneaks, especially by paratroopers "out of the blue".

I re-tried the game twice and with different strategies I came up ending in sept or oct 2029. I think it's very hard to finish in 2028.

I'll be interested to see who wins the green star this time. Not me - I am playing for gold. But I wiped out 5 civs in late 2028, and have kept the Indians as a pet for another year since then - a pretty large pet, actually. But I'd guess that a 2027 finish is possible.

But I got a question concerning the scoring system of the Civ II game. How come that I got totally different scores even though I finished the same time (oct 2029). Once I got 104% (7.26 Mio people, 6 Wows) and the other time I got 164% (5.37 Mio people, 4 Wows) - is it to do with the less cities you have the more scoring points you get?.

Your Civ2 score comes mainly from WoWs (20 points each) and plus 1 point per citizen . The happy citizens count double. Population does not matter (for example, two size 4 cities count like one size 8 city) and neither does the ending date. Barb level, pollution, peace years and future tech do count (but usually for less). Not sure how the percentages are computed, but they do not affect GOTMS.

 

[URUWASHI]

Game 68-

Game Log-

2020-2022- Fundamentalism- 4 Cities- Population 80.000 - Tax Rate 80% on Taxes
Income 10 - Cost -0 -
visible Irrigated Squares 4, Closest to the left (West ) 104.8, close to the right ( 266.24 )

2022-2023
Pyramids Built- 4 Cities - Population 130.000
All Cities, building Engineers.
Goal: Build cities in SW Continent then move to Next Continent left

2023- 2025- 12 Cities- Population 490.000
New Continent ( SW) Has 7 Cities - Called the cities in the Continent South American Cities, useful when dealing with Caravans or Moving Armies
Building Cities on the Second Continent to the Left ( Africa ) , 153.24-153.25 lake in the Continent provide a quick round to the West , Building Cities at 151.25 and 155.25

2025-2026 - 14 Cities- Population 1.130.000
Canal thru Africa Built-Sailing towards Island 6 ( Visible Irrigated Square at 104.8)
Looking for 4 Special locations in " Africa " find Paris
Demand Tribute- Got $ 250 Gold-

2026-2027- 16 Cities – Population 1.610.000
Spy Investigates Paris- 3 Armies– Armor, Alpine Troop and Paratrooper. Building a second Armor.- Temple – Cathedral –Marketplace and Airport. Ready to Launch an Attack from Mbutombo ( 151.25 )
To The East- 2 Air Bases and 2 Cities built near the North Passage towards , Irrigated Square on 266.24
Units 8 Bombers , and 4 Fighters….reconsidering, since Paris has no SDI, maybe quicker to use Missiles
Another big error, Transport to the East has no Spy to check on Status of 266.24
To the West- Transport with 4 Settlers Building Cities and Air Bases towards 104.8
Last remaining Irrigated Square appears at 37.31

By July 2028- Population 2.670.000 20 Cities.
Paris Taken-
Beijing Taken- No Military Loses
Changing all Bombers to Missiles and Paratroopers
Stocking Armies Near 266.24 do not have enough Units to attack, Also no Spy to let me know the defending Units.
East Front : Airbases Built near 328.8 ….another Gigantic error, have only 1 transport with 1 Settler…If destroyed my whole expansion will be doomed
West Front : Cities and Air Bases built near 37.31.
Another Big Error…. Distance from 37.31 to Last known Irrigated square ( 390.14 ) is several turns away ( 6 cities or 6 Air Bases )…Too late.
Should have built more Transports and Settlers TO the East….I knew where 390.14 was

July 2028 thru September 2028
Population 2.840.000- 20 Cities
-“ Partisan Trick “ works well, Atacama ( South America ) and Eridu taken by Barbarians…. 24 None Partisans added to the Army , then dismantled and turn into Cruise Missiles.
Spies re take control of cities expending 130 Gold
37.31 is just 10 Squares Away.
Karakorum discovered, ( 266.24 ), 4 Missiles , 2 Bombers , 1 fighter , 3 paratroopers ready to attack
I chicken out by “ crossing “ the Straight where Future Moscow is located,. Afraid my transport will be destroyed. waiting for back up

BY January 2029-
Population 3.470.000 23 Cities- If I had taken a chance to go thru the Straight North of “ Future “ Moscow I could have gained 4 or 5 turns building Airbases…Karakorum Taken…Helicopters , prove to be a waste…..Again , I should have built ONLY Cruise Missiles and Paratroopers. Airports take , ( Paris , Beijiing ) prove to be great to send Paratroopers in One turn
Western Front – Amassed a Gigantic and useless fleet to attack Yellow, ( got 650 Gold ), some of those units should be on the East.

Late 2029- Madrid Taken- Several extra units dismantled to build Harbors , Aqueducts , Supermarkets…Those units will have been great on the Eastern Side
Moscow Taken…have to sell Units to Buy transports….Geography of the area will require 3 Transports , and 3 to 4 Settlers….To take Last City , Orange, Take a day off , to consider my options to finish before 2029….

Late –2029-
Settlers build 5 Air Bases ( 3 could have done the trick ) and 2 cities….another BIG error.
12 Cruise Missiles , and 5 Paratroopers ready to attack London.
After 3 Missiles , London is Taken……..wasted a lot of fire power.

AS usual, my Biggest Pet peeve is how many units I lost.

Units Lost Entire Game: 3 Paratroopers and 1 Bomber ( all in Karakorum )
WOW; Pyramids (Should have built Magellan ?? )

Build a few more, before the game end . Useless wonders to increase Points

Early 2030- London Taken- Population 6.6220.000-

 

[Peaster]

This game was different and fun. But like most modern ones, it leaves me exhausted, and I am mostly glad it is over. Still - I might replay the opening, especially if anybody else is also interested in that phase.

2020 - 2027: I switched to Democracy asap, hoping to grow faster than with the usual monarchy/ICS method. I thought celeb-growth would eventually allow faster production of engineers. Not sure how well it worked; I probably built harbors/etc too early. But it seems my overall growth rate was pretty similar to Ali's, so not bad. Other players didn't try for fast growth? I made some effort at overseas trade, but success at that was also unclear. Results thru 2027:

39 cities, pop 5M, Mfg 200, income 400g/t
3 WoWs: MC, Pyr, JSB. Embassies with all 6 AI's.

2028: Fundamentalism, for Money, Lateral Growth and War: My cities were reaching their maximal size from mere celebration. I wanted money for aqueducts, conquest and engineers - for more cities. Got 76 of em. Built Magellan's. Conquered 5 of the 6 AI civs late in the year. BooBoo: I made 2 very distant deliveries for about 600g each, but forgot to celebrate first. Might have been 900 each, I guess.

Jan 29 - Oct 29: Democracy + micromanagement... made lots of charts about city sizes and making enough freights for WoWs on each populated island. Arabia grew "upwards" about 10% per turn in this phase. Only about 10 new cities, but the old ones got bigger fast. Built 4 WoWs: CfC, AS, ShTh and SunTzu, and saved up many vans.

Minor problems with barbs and AI paratroopers invading my empty cities, but a few spies on transports can handle almost any surprise. I stayed at war with India mainly by avoiding contact, uncertain if my Senate would allow a real invasion.

Nov 2029: Collected approx 80 vans together to make last-minute WoWs. And a flotilla to finish the conquest. Still unsure about invading under democracy, so the Arabs went to anarchy for 1 turn [losing a precious turn of growth]

Dec 2029: Emptied Karakorum with a flotilla of 1 Eng (for a canal city), 1 spy, 1 armor and 5 Howies. Switched back to Demo, for better score. The last Howie enters the city with no comment from Indians or the Senate.

END: 89 cities, pop 31M, 23 WoWs. I switched govts 4-5 times this game. I think the benefits justified that, maybe not ... am interested in other opinions or comparisons.

 

[URUWASHI]

AS usual Impressive Peaster.
I played th game entirely in Fundy.
Built Supermarkets first , then Aqueducts..then Harbors...
Considering you play the game in Demo is incredibe you achieved the results you Did.
I built less than 30 Cities. And If you read My post I made several crucial errors.Your population far exceeds mine..and my wonders are lot less than yours.
I admit was a fun game, as usual Duke and his crew did a fantastic Job.
I will replay the game ( but is not the same since I know the events...the other civs growth and Location )
I still certain that a finish in Late 2027 or Early 2028 is Possible.
A Carrier send Early towards the Orange Civ , SWAILING EAST... with a Bomber and a fighter as Air cover , plus a Transport with A settler an a couple of Units, could built a city Near the farthest outpost ( London )...If Magellan is built then you reach that point maybe 6 turns earlier then BUild an Airport in this Location and send One Paratrooper per turn.( Paris , Beijing , Madrid have airports ...on my game ) ..Built 3 Cruise Missiles and LOndon will be gone ...
I calculated the distance from Babylon to the farthesr Irrigated Location...the trip from Home Continent going EAST was 30% shorter than West....Thats was my main error....
I should have loaded my East Armies and get to London....
I was betting on Using Yellow as a spring Board...Yellow was way to far from Orange...
Ohhhhhhh WEll ....Was a fantastic Game

 

[Peaster]

Thanks Uruwashi. Two interesting questions about this GOTM:

a) How fast can you conquer the AI ?
b) What is the best growth strategy ?

I am more interested in b), since the answer would probably help us with other modern scenarios - Maybe even with standard games, if republic growth beats monarchy growth. Anyway, I replayed 2020-2023 and did a lot better this time. In Dec23, I had 10 cities (instead of 6) and 7 were at least size 3, mostly celebrating/growing in democracy, and connected by RRs. Two small cities were overseas. IMO 20 cities by Dec24 should not be hard. Pop = 1.2M and Mfg = 42 (instead of 23).

Instead of harbors, aqueducts and vans (which ARE useful later on), I focused on engineers and temples. Usually I hate temples, but without HG, and with Mike's costing so much, they really helped my plan.

I also used the size one trick, disbanding the rifleman and placing a worker on forest for a few turns - can't understand how I missed this in the real game. Two barb partisans invaded in approx Dec22, and I had to rush a spy to defend. Despite that danger and cost, I think the size one trick is correct here.

 

[Ali Ardavan]

UN needed ? Apollo? Why ??? Didn't anybody read post #1 ?

Of course they did not. You are not supposed to read the spoiler till you are somewhat into the game.

My plan was to use my helicopter to discover the neighbors. I first went for the island to my west (by the time I made it I had colonized the island to southwest and knew it was empty). As I was exploring the western island with my helicopter, I saw farmland. That prompted me to look for more, but I only found 2 more. I did this very carefully and I am absolutely sure that none other were visible. Thus, there was a benefit to building the Apollo (but not the UN). Nevertheless, I agree with you that 600 shields is too much to spend on finding rival cities.

IMO 20 cities by Dec24 should not be hard.

For the first 5 years, I concentrated on growth and spent very little effort on other aspects. In Dec2024 I had 16 cities; 2 more were built the next turn. Had I spent all my effort on growth I think 20 cities would be possible but not easy.

I did think of using the 1 city trick but decided against it. In retrospect this would have been a good idea as defense was a non issue, but starting out you do not know that. I have lost at least 2 GOTMs taking risks like that.

Golem, Uruwashi, Peaster, congradulations on impressive finishes.

 

[Ali Ardavan]

Till Jan2025 almost all my effort was spent on expansion. In the following 3 years I set out to find my rivals, build some wonders, and grow through celebrations.

In Feb2025 a European Marine traveling on south pole shows up near Andimeshk which was founded a turn before. Europeans offer peace and I accept. Same turn I produce my helicopter for finding rivals. But, I forgot that it produces two unhappy faces even before taking off!

In June2025 my helicopter discovered Paris by first noticing a farmland and then flying towards it. In Dec2025 European embassy was established. I was surprised they only have 1 city. They also had 5 military units (4 of which are used for defense), a temple, and an airport. They have plenty of farmland but no supermarket!

In +2027/02 an Indian marine and Indian tank show up near two of my border cities on homeland. Fortunately my helicopter is in one of the cities. Howitzer and mech Infantry rush bought. Next turn Indians offer peace and I accept.

In +2027/03 I raise luxuries for the first time and widespread celebrations follow. For the rest of the year, the challenge is to build infrastructure to carry on the celebrations.

Status at +2027/12
Population: 8.62M; Cities: 31; Trade routes: 6D0F; Government: Democracy
Cost per turn: 37; Total advances: 83; Production: 211MT; 0 polluted tiles
Wonders: Pyramids, Michelangelo, Bach
Units: 22 Engineers, 1 None Riflemen, 1 Paratrooper, 3 Mech. Infantry, 1 Howitzer, 1 Helicopter, 2 Transport, 2 Spy, 6 Freight.
Russian: No contact
European: 1 city, 83 techs;
Bolivarian: 1 city, 83 techs;
Chinese: 1 city, 83 techs;
English: No contact
Indian: No embassy

 

[Peaster]

Ali - Sounds like your game is about where mine was in Dec27... with a few +'s, a few -'s. Best of luck as you proceed.

Of course they did not [look at post #1]....

Several players had finished and were already making conclusions when I posted my comment.

IMO 20 cities by Dec24 should not be hard.

I meant it should not be hard, starting from Dec23 of my replay . But I did not find the best methods in the real game, and actually only had 10 cities in Dec24. I'd consider 20 fairly hard, without replay.

Uruwashi's idea of using airports to speed up conquest intrigued me. I started to wonder if a 2025 EC might be possible. Starting from my Dec23 replay, I sent out 4 engineers on 2 transports - to colonize near Moscow, London, Beijing, and Madrid, and build airports + Howitzers, etc, as needed. As usual, I will worry about the nearby civs later.

As of Mar25, the engineers are approximately on schedule, to colonize by late 2025. But I just don't have the economy to pay for 4-5 airports and a dozen or so Howies so quickly [not to mention invasions at Paris and Karakorum]. A demanded van delivered to London from a large Arab city with airport might still provide hope for a mid-2026 finsh. This plan probably would've work better in Fundy than Demo.

Conclusion: IMO a 2025 finish is not possible with any plan that I know of. Probably 2026 is possible - with prior map knowledge, replaying, and some daring. Without replaying, 2027 would be a great feat IMO. [I got 5/6 in 2027, but had made no efforts at the Indians then].

 

[URUWASHI]

Playing against Peaster is like playing against the New York Yankees..LOL, you are doom, from the beguining...
I was " thinking"...how to beat him , and as usual he does GREAT...
Maybe I should get Peaster a Job in my company as a sales man....LOL
What he did was a consideration in my game plan....Fundy...built the infrastructure then Demo....then grow....nahhh too complicated
I Figure nahhhhhhhhh , go for for the Kills as Peaster does....
Im am glad that I manage to beat him ONCE ( game 60 , AZtects, Green star )...maybe next time I will beat him will be in 10 years from now....
( Smiling ) Great Game

 

[Peaster]

Uruwashi - You seem to be learning from every game. And you obviously enjoy Civ2 as much as anyone else on the planet. That's enough IMHO. But if you want even more success, my recipe is

* Read every Civ2 article in the GL at Poly.
* Read DaveV's guide to ICS again, and try it out.
* Replay your GOTMs, with notes. And whatever you do,
* Don't put a math geek on your sales team!

 

[golem]

A couple of the Capitals were 2-4 hexes inland. No problem, land a settler, build a city, move your transport and ageis cruiser into the city, and wipe out the AI city.

Yes, it is no problem to conquer it. I usually have a problem to find it.

My mistake was I did not read the posts and did not look for irrigation. I have played the same as if I have black map.