GOTM and QSC Submission Process AND STATUS

[cracker]

kryszcztov,

Sorry to be busy with taking care of just the basic details.

I know this is a tough issue and I apologize on behalf of the Civ Gaming WOrld that you are inconvenienced by the choices that Infogrames/Atari has made in tandem with Firaxis to implement the localized language versions in a way that makes them incompatible with other versions of the game. Unfortunately this inconveniences not just you but all the players who have purchase French, Spanish, German and other language versions.

Delays, bugs and mismatched functions in the PTW software and patch versions also have substantially incapacitated us in our efforts to support you.

We have had to pull away resources from adding the extra support for your language group just to deal with a number of behavior issues and that is unfortunate that you have been victimized by these choices made by others.

Hopefully we will get caught up to fully including you in future games as these issues are sorted out. It is extremely difficult to address these problems when the software developer and publisher are notably unresponsive to these issues in this version of the software.

 

[Moonsinger]

At the moment, the submission page doesn't work. I will try again tomorrow morning. Good night!

 

[MadScot]

I noticed when submitting the last QSC - which I did in a huge rush, hence no timeline - that the new QSC submission page has no option to not have a timeline. I just submitted a text file that said, in essence, "no timeline". But it might be nice to have a "no timeline" option?

 

[DaveShack]

Originally posted by MadScot
I noticed when submitting the last QSC - which I did in a huge rush, hence no timeline - that the new QSC submission page has no option to not have a timeline. I just submitted a text file that said, in essence, "no timeline". But it might be nice to have a "no timeline" option?

The QSC scoring requirements have changed. Timelines are necessary to ensure the process runs smoothly, so they are no longer optional for the QSC. I'll try to find a link and edit it in here later.

 

[MadScot]

Well, had I known that (and a quick scan through various QSc pages shows no hint, by the way) I would not have wasted my time playing, nor the system's time in processing my game.

No credit for non-timeline QSCs, no credit for losing/stalemated GOTMs and increasingly long games.........

 

[Txurce]

Originally posted by MadScot
Well, had I known that (and a quick scan through various QSc pages shows no hint, by the way) I would not have wasted my time playing, nor the system's time in processing my game.

No credit for non-timeline QSCs, no credit for losing/stalemated GOTMs and increasingly long games.........

MadScot, Aeson's instructions for the updated QSC submissions state that "All fields in the form are required for your submission. The save file you submit may be either a SAV or a ZIP file. The timeline may be in TXT, HTML, HTM, or ZIP format." Given the "all fields required" warning, the timeline-format clarification, and that there is a field for timelines, it seems pretty clear to me that timelines are now required.

More to the point, I'm not sure how you wasted any time playing the QSC, since it takes zero extra time if you don't keep a timeline.

And I think you're off about there being no credit for losing GOTMs - there's no credit for unfinished GOTMs. I'm not sure how unfinished games could be fairly included, unless parameters were established as to minimum length of play.

 

[MadScot]

I said "losing" not "lost"....

if you get to the point in a GOTM where you cannot force a victory, yet the AI will not defeat you with any kind of speed, you end up with a "losing/stalemated" game. I've been caught that way several times in the last few months - the AI won't call a UN vote (so I can't throw the vote even) and is so slow to any other victory type that it becomes impossible to obtain the required game ending conditions. Apparently this means I'm "not putting in enough effort" to quote another GOTM member. I really can't justify playing the GOTM to the exclusion of any other game when it's such a drain on my playing time, and it seems so easy to get 'stuck' and disqualified from submitting. (Unless you do something really bizarre, like disband your entire civ. That seems rather against the spirit)

And I didn't consider the timeline to be a "field in the form". I thought that meant the 'info' fields. I don't recall any mention that timelines were now required (in, say, the results announcements, or the game start/setup pages).

The wasted time is in having started the QSC knowing I had not enough time to keep a timeline, and not enough time to have a hope of completing the GOTM itself. Had I known the timeline was mandatory I would have not tried to complete the QSC (which I started on the 20th) but would have done something else - like 5-4 perhaps?

At least I know for next month I guess.

 

[DaveShack]

Originally posted by MadScot

Had I known the timeline was mandatory I would have not tried to complete the QSC (which I started on the 20th) but would have done something else - like 5-4 perhaps?

At least I know for next month I guess.

Just so you'll know all the necessary info for this month, the deadline to submit a completed QSC is usually around the 20th, unless it has been relaxed since the last time I saw a date. The files required are a 1000BC save (taken after you complete all your actions for that turn, but before hitting enter) and some form of timeline, usually in text or excel format, but any of the formats Aeson mentions will do.

I do highly recommend keeping a timeline of those first 3000 years, and comparing the dates you complete things to the dates that others achieve, even if you decide not to formally enter the QSC. Also look at comparing your build priorities with the really good players, and with those who are near yourself in strength. My game has improved so much from this process that it's nearly impossible to believe it. If nothing else it made me slow down and think about what I was doing, instead of rushing through the early game...

 

[Tarkeel]

According to the QSC score page (which is a bugger to find BTW), the timeline is not mandatory, but gives a so high bonus to your score it wuold be silly not to make one.

 

[AlanH]

I'll swear I wasn't imagining it! I distinctly recall seeing somewhere a statement that the QSC timeline had been made mandatory. But I've scoured the current pages relating to QSC, timelines and scoring, and I'm damned if I can find it now. They all indicate the old 25% bonus deal.

So I've concluded I'm going insane or senile or both, or the rate of change of rules of this game has gone beyond my ability to keep up.

 

[Svar]

Originally posted by AlanH
I'll swear I wasn't imagining it! I distinctly recall seeing somewhere a statement that the QSC timeline had been made mandatory. But I've scoured the current pages relating to QSC, timelines and scoring, and I'm damned if I can find it now. They all indicate the old 25% bonus deal.

So I've concluded I'm going insane or senile or both, or the rate of change of rules of this game has gone beyond my ability to keep up.

Check out this link. It implies that the timeline is now mandatory.

Also look at this link where you saw the discussion on the mandatory timeline submission.

Edited to add additional link.

 

[AlanH]

@Svar:

I am aware of both of those links. The first one is what triggered the current debate, and as you say, it contains an implication rather than a statement of a rule. The second is DaveShack's post that eventually prompted to me to go looking. There's a promise in that post to edit in a link, and none has been provided, so it doesn't seem to be definitive. I was expecting to see a link to the clear statement that my deranged brain recalls having seen once before.

So I don't consider either of those as clear mandates demanding a timeline, and neither is the reference I was seeking. Compared to them, the large number of definite statements in the gotm pages saying that the timeline is a 25% bonus OPTION is overwhelming.

 

[Xevious]

I believe this thread is what you're looking for. It's the updates to the QSC scoring. I bumped the thread so it will be near the top for a while.

 

[AlanH]

Well done Xevious. You've saved my sanity, and straightened out a deal of confusion.

Now we just need to persuade the management to remove the multiple references to 25% bonuses in the gotm pages and replace the out of date "rules" on those pages with the ones that are actually in force but buried in Cracker's old posts.

Someone around here has, or had, a sig - something about the fundamental law of nature that if a set of data exists in two or more places then the copies will be inconsistent. Well, we have that here, big time. And "No", I don't want to know where that reference is

 

[DaveShack]

Originally posted by AlanH
@Svar:

The second is DaveShack's post that eventually prompted to me to go looking. There's a promise in that post to edit in a link, and none has been provided, so it doesn't seem to be definitive.

Sorry, I was having trouble finding it. I see that Xevious bumped the one I was referring to -- thanks! I'm equally glad to see that early senility isn't hitting me either...

 

[AlanH]

Originally posted by DaveShack


Sorry, I was having trouble finding it. I see that Xevious bumped the one I was referring to -- thanks! I'm equally glad to see that early senility isn't hitting me either...

I never said it was "early". You'll have to check out the recent F^4 thread on players' ages to decide whether I should be a current candidate for Alzheimer's

 

[akots]

Can please somebody tell how to submit France 5-6 game? Which victory type to choose (since there is no Commercial Domination in the list) and what to do with QSC (since it is not even in the list)? Sorry for stupid questions.

 

[MadScot]

@akots

Cracker mentioned in the thread announcing the France game that they will sort out the submission form, so I guess it's a case of wait and see on the victory type.

AFAIK there is no QSC for either 5-4 or 5-6 - they are 'pure' tourney games.

 

[CdB]

No sure if this is the good thread but ...

I have a suggestion for the submission pages. It should over-write the previous submission (if any).

I submitted wrong files for QSC of GOTM23 (my mistake). I tried re-submitting and I have now 2 entries !

 

[MadScot]

CdB

That would raise the possibility of malicious people posting fake results on top of valid entries.

While hopefully not a likely event, I'd hate someone with a grudge to be able to disrupt the submittal process.

While it's the admins' decision, I think dealing with an occasional double submission is better than trying to untangle a "who exactly submitted what" mess.