dreadknought
timelord
hi, Just give us a quick grade on the conquest AI. A-B-C-D-F like in school and comment if you like......
Grade the new AI
- Thread starter dreadknought
- Start date
MarineCorps
Explosion!
A. It used marines the correct way, it's smarter and more cunning then ever. It backed up 3 paratroopers with 5 marines in a transport after the troopers had taken the city, no longer does sucide runs. The AI navy is not just attacking any unit that it wants, but decides which stack it has a better chance of defeating. Oh BTW it has yet to bombard the hell out of my land. 
A
It adds more playtime but not only that but also *fun* playtime. I love it. I love it when I go to wars and get and I get a SGL and I rush the Knights Templar and I get crusaders and then I get a MGL and I form an army of crusaders. It is the best thing that can happen at that time.
It adds more playtime but not only that but also *fun* playtime. I love it. I love it when I go to wars and get and I get a SGL and I rush the Knights Templar and I get crusaders and then I get a MGL and I form an army of crusaders. It is the best thing that can happen at that time.
I
Incomplete, that is. It'll take time to evaluate the strengths/weaknesses and abilities of the new AI. Plus, seeing how they modified the game parameters rather strongly (new and different-valued specialists, higher OCN, etc.), it'll take time for us humans to adjust, too.
It's just way too early to tell, IMO. There's still a lot (I mean A LOT) of circumstances to test out the AI. Give people a couple months and then maybe we'll have the answer.
Arathorn
Incomplete, that is. It'll take time to evaluate the strengths/weaknesses and abilities of the new AI. Plus, seeing how they modified the game parameters rather strongly (new and different-valued specialists, higher OCN, etc.), it'll take time for us humans to adjust, too.
It's just way too early to tell, IMO. There's still a lot (I mean A LOT) of circumstances to test out the AI. Give people a couple months and then maybe we'll have the answer.
Arathorn
Stuie
Laudir Agus Mir
Shouldn't this be a poll?
Regardless, Arathorn's right. I just started the Industrial Age in my first game, and that was after playing about 12 hours yesterday. The AI seems ok so far, but let's see if it can keep up late in the game.
Regardless, Arathorn's right. I just started the Industrial Age in my first game, and that was after playing about 12 hours yesterday. The AI seems ok so far, but let's see if it can keep up late in the game.
cgannon64
BOB DYLAN'S ROCKIN OUT!
I've noticed that on Monarch (I play Monarch and Emperor) they AI doesn't send troops with their settlers. Maybe this is new, or maybe its not - I never noticed.
Although from the few turns I played sampling the WWII scenerio, they seem to be pretty good with navies now, at least in sea combat. I haven't yet witnessed a naval invasion of land, if they can do that well, then BreakAway games deserves some praise...
EDIT: Grammar. Wow that was a 1st-grade level post.
"don't send troops" 
Although from the few turns I played sampling the WWII scenerio, they seem to be pretty good with navies now, at least in sea combat. I haven't yet witnessed a naval invasion of land, if they can do that well, then BreakAway games deserves some praise...
EDIT: Grammar. Wow that was a 1st-grade level post.
"don't send troops" 
Puppeteer
Emperor
Too early to tell for sure, but here are my insights playing to 440 AD (about 4 techs into the middle ages) on emperor difficulty, standard map, random civs, random land and climate, standard aggression, default barbs and rules. I got Incas and appear to be on a warm or temperate wet (almost zero desert, but grassland near the poles and very little turnda) continent with America, Myans and Aztecs.
I interpreted "suicide runs" as sending, for example, one archer to your town fortified with pikemen and MDI. For the most part the AI hasn't done this, but has sent combined arms of attackers and defenders and frequently has a lone archer in the stack. Now that archers bombard they get first shot at you if you attack any unit in their stack.
The Aztecs have dropped off a lone troop from a galley twice, but it was a spear--not an offensive troop. Once I didn't get to him fast enough and he pillaged a tile. I think that is smarter than it was before when it would drop off a warrior or archer and try to attack you.
The Myans built the wonder that makes the ancient cavs, and those thing are a pain with their extra hp and the fact that my part of the continent has no horses. I saw a couple of those alone, but that was before I had pikemen or many MDI and they did a fair bit of damage to me through their attacks and retreats. But the Myans also have sent two large (5-10 units) attack forces; not all in one stack, but definitely in a group. Luckily my border isn't too wide so I can concentrate most of my troops in a small area. The Myans are in the north with the Aztecs; I'm in the south and the Americans are on a skinny part of the continent inbetween, so the Aztecs and Myans are fighting long-distance and doing a decent job of it.
All my AI settlers have been escorted. One thing that was new is that one American settler was escorted by a horseman!
I interpreted "suicide runs" as sending, for example, one archer to your town fortified with pikemen and MDI. For the most part the AI hasn't done this, but has sent combined arms of attackers and defenders and frequently has a lone archer in the stack. Now that archers bombard they get first shot at you if you attack any unit in their stack.
The Aztecs have dropped off a lone troop from a galley twice, but it was a spear--not an offensive troop. Once I didn't get to him fast enough and he pillaged a tile. I think that is smarter than it was before when it would drop off a warrior or archer and try to attack you.
The Myans built the wonder that makes the ancient cavs, and those thing are a pain with their extra hp and the fact that my part of the continent has no horses. I saw a couple of those alone, but that was before I had pikemen or many MDI and they did a fair bit of damage to me through their attacks and retreats. But the Myans also have sent two large (5-10 units) attack forces; not all in one stack, but definitely in a group. Luckily my border isn't too wide so I can concentrate most of my troops in a small area. The Myans are in the north with the Aztecs; I'm in the south and the Americans are on a skinny part of the continent inbetween, so the Aztecs and Myans are fighting long-distance and doing a decent job of it.
All my AI settlers have been escorted. One thing that was new is that one American settler was escorted by a horseman!
tomart109
Perspicacious
They spent some time on the ai's sea combat, with attention to carrier air usage in WWII. And it has done some naval invasions of my islands...
Um, that's what i called their single archer/whatever sent by boat to my homeland coastline...
Fanny Brice
Prince
Great question.
I don't have the game yet but I'm very interested to see if some of the obvious AI improvements have been made.
I don't have the game yet but I'm very interested to see if some of the obvious AI improvements have been made.
cgannon64
BOB DYLAN'S ROCKIN OUT!
Well, I only played 2 turns of the WWII scenerio as Japan (and that was about an 1 and 15 minutes 
) so I don't expect to get naval invasions of islands yet. After all, you don't start with many land troops as the US, IIRC...
) so I don't expect to get naval invasions of islands yet. After all, you don't start with many land troops as the US, IIRC...MaximusParthas
Chieftain
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2003
- Messages
- 83
Ditto 4 me.
tx138
Chieftain
I'm not sure yet whether this is an improvement or a step back, but the AI at war late-game has tended towards Fascism rather than Communism in all the games I've played. In two of these cases, Fascism would be a bad choice, as India and Babylon both had good shots at a cullture win, but with a Fascistic government, couldn't turn their newly conquered cities into culture factories quickly enough that I had to spend time and shields building culture. On the other hand, the fact that the AI is actually mounting a significant threat to 100K cultural victory on Emperor is nice, as I rarely saw that in PTW or original Civ3 games.
Also, the AI seems to be better at building enough workers to develop its land than usual- I can't cite specifics, but I seem to notice that their land is developing more quickly. Anyone else seen anything like this?
Also, the AI seems to be better at building enough workers to develop its land than usual- I can't cite specifics, but I seem to notice that their land is developing more quickly. Anyone else seen anything like this?
cgannon64
BOB DYLAN'S ROCKIN OUT!
In a war I played, I noticed that the AI would send its units in stacks of 2 or 3 rather than SoDs. For example, the Celts had four or five stacks of 3 units moving towards the enemy cities.
Just pointing that out. Its hard for me to say whether this is new behavior or not, I never really noticed things like this before...
Just pointing that out. Its hard for me to say whether this is new behavior or not, I never really noticed things like this before...
Well, I'm currently playing a hopeless Monarch game. Bad island start. I'm missing iron, coal who knows what else, and all but one luxury. I won't win this one, but I am middle of the pack right now
The interesting thing is, I wanted to test the naval invasion AI. So America, which was pretty much domianting on the main continent wanted tribute. I told him to talk to my hand and he declare war. About 7 turns later, i began noticing American Galleons escorted by frigates (2 escorts per ship) pokeing around my coast for another 3 turns.
This puzzled me. Then I saw it. Another stack sailed in from a the fog of war.
In D-Day like fashion two stacks of ships sailed in at once, and landed a stack of about 8 Cavalry on a mountain. I made peace right away.
One little issue remains is that the AI seems to have forgotten its landing force. I've had that calvalry stack sitting on my mountain for 40 turns now.
I haven't been paying too much attention, but that seems to be the case. I'll have a look out next time I start a new game.
The thing is, the AI seems and feels more competitive all around. I can still take the lead, tech, economic, size, production in Regent, a difficulty level I graduated myself from in the summer. But when I went back and played a Regent pangea game just for kicks, the AI, while behind, kept on nipping on my heels, especially tech wise. It seems like the AI can manage their finances much better now, to allow them to purchase those techs I don't sell them.
This is because when I grab the techlead, I usually control who gets what tech and look for the best prices. This is not as easy to do (in regent), as the AI often will find a seller who will sell it before I want to. I mean, this happened in Civ3 and PTW too, but I think better AI cash management has made them more able to afford techs.
P.S. I've also noticed 3 city AI civs, paying 100 gold +10 gpt for techs to me. in PTW, a civ down to 3 cities usually fly off the rails and can no longer "play" the game in any meaningful fashion. That's the biggest change I've noticed.
The interesting thing is, I wanted to test the naval invasion AI. So America, which was pretty much domianting on the main continent wanted tribute. I told him to talk to my hand and he declare war. About 7 turns later, i began noticing American Galleons escorted by frigates (2 escorts per ship) pokeing around my coast for another 3 turns.
This puzzled me. Then I saw it. Another stack sailed in from a the fog of war.
In D-Day like fashion two stacks of ships sailed in at once, and landed a stack of about 8 Cavalry on a mountain. I made peace right away.
One little issue remains is that the AI seems to have forgotten its landing force. I've had that calvalry stack sitting on my mountain for 40 turns now.
I haven't been paying too much attention, but that seems to be the case. I'll have a look out next time I start a new game.
The thing is, the AI seems and feels more competitive all around. I can still take the lead, tech, economic, size, production in Regent, a difficulty level I graduated myself from in the summer. But when I went back and played a Regent pangea game just for kicks, the AI, while behind, kept on nipping on my heels, especially tech wise. It seems like the AI can manage their finances much better now, to allow them to purchase those techs I don't sell them.
This is because when I grab the techlead, I usually control who gets what tech and look for the best prices. This is not as easy to do (in regent), as the AI often will find a seller who will sell it before I want to. I mean, this happened in Civ3 and PTW too, but I think better AI cash management has made them more able to afford techs.
P.S. I've also noticed 3 city AI civs, paying 100 gold +10 gpt for techs to me. in PTW, a civ down to 3 cities usually fly off the rails and can no longer "play" the game in any meaningful fashion. That's the biggest change I've noticed.
Puppeteer
Emperor
An update on my emperor/normal aggression game mentioned above: I went to war with America in the middle/late middle ages. The AI seems more coordinated with attacks, and Lincoln had many defenders in his cities! More than I recall the old AI keeping around. Unfortunately (for him) he had no iron or saltpeter, so his defenders were a stack of spearmen and a bowman or catapult. Unfortunately for me I had no horses (that's why I went after him) or saltpeter (that's going to be the object of the next war) so I was attacking with medieval infantry guarded by pikemen.
After I had him knocked back on he quit venturing out to attack me except for one time when I left an unguarded worker too close to his territory and he sent the bowman out to capture the worker.
At the beginning and middle of the war, though, he sent horsemen, archers (and later bowmen) and spears in groups. Like cgannon64 noted they're not alone but not all in one stack, either.
Much of the world has Navigation and Military Tradition now, and I'm a bit worried that the other continent may declare on me and land a decent stack of cavalry.
After I had him knocked back on he quit venturing out to attack me except for one time when I left an unguarded worker too close to his territory and he sent the bowman out to capture the worker.
At the beginning and middle of the war, though, he sent horsemen, archers (and later bowmen) and spears in groups. Like cgannon64 noted they're not alone but not all in one stack, either.
Much of the world has Navigation and Military Tradition now, and I'm a bit worried that the other continent may declare on me and land a decent stack of cavalry.
cgannon64
BOB DYLAN'S ROCKIN OUT!
Another thing I noticed in my game was that there was a pretty significant dogpile on the Civ I was attacking. I declared war on the Iroquois and fought the war alone for a while, but then I noticed Roman, Aztec, and American troops in Iroquois territory. I checked the Foreign Advisor screen and, sure enough, they all declared war on him on their own accord, not with any MAs.
I think Carthage may have joined in at the end as well.
Again, this may have happened in vanilla Civ; I can't really be too sure. I've heard of dogpiles happening on the human player on Diety, but I've never seen a true dogpile (2+ Civs joining in by themselves) on Emperor or Monarch.
I think Carthage may have joined in at the end as well.
Again, this may have happened in vanilla Civ; I can't really be too sure. I've heard of dogpiles happening on the human player on Diety, but I've never seen a true dogpile (2+ Civs joining in by themselves) on Emperor or Monarch.
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