Grandmaster's Chapel - spoiling unit production?

[CoconutTank]

For me, Grand Master's Chapel gives me a way to dump faith while also getting units into key places on the map. Even during peacetime, GMC helps with finalizing armies and armadas, which is useful in preparation of war and for maintaining defense against stray barbs. I'd rather spend gold on buildings, and hard building units is generally not ideal, so GMC takes care of unit deployment very effectively. Sadly can't faith-buy air units with GMC, hohoho.

So yes, I guess the GMC does spoil unit production. Instead of nerfing the GMC though, I'd rather the military infrastructure have a bigger role. Effects that boost production for unit types should have an equivalent (or close equivalent) discount on faith and gold for said unit type, for example.

As a bit of a tangent, I'll admit I've built the Intelligence Agency more often than I've built the Foreign Ministry at this point, but I've pretty much always regret building the IA. I usually only build the FM if I'm playing as Hungary, but that's likely to start changing with the IA on the downturn.

 

[The Civs 6]

I dont think so. There are many things that needs faith (Great People being the most important mid-late game) that i never have enough spare already.

But let's be real here - if you really needed units to win the game, having GMC in your hippocket and foregoing a great person or two is way better than having to hard build a bunch of units with a faith-based game. And the latter is might be a better situation than having an industrial economy and having to choose between building units and building other stuff.

 

[Ivan Hunger]

People saying they only choose Foreign Ministry when playing as Hungry, what about Pericles and Sumeria? You'd think Pericles would want his city-states, especially distant ones, to be able to defend themselves better. And while Sumeria is normally a war civ, Gilgamesh's new ability in Heroes and Legends Mode seems like it could potentially open up more peaceful pathways to victory for them (depending on which heroes you recruit). Since they already get a built-in discount on levying units, forgoing a military completely and relying entirely on levied armies to keep hostile rivals at bay while they focus on infrastructure and economy seems like it could be a viable strategy for them.

Also, the people saying they never choose Intelligence Agency with anyone, not even with Black Queen Catherine? The synergy is so strong, there's even an achievement making a joke about it.

 

[Archon_Wing]

Intelligence Agency doesn't require any investment like GMC does, so it's pretty much the default failing everything else.

Though I guess if you are aggressive, you'd capture a lot of holy sites, but....

 

[CoconutTank]

People saying they only choose Foreign Ministry when playing as Hungry, what about Pericles and Sumeria? You'd think Pericles would want his city-states, especially distant ones, to be able to defend themselves better. And while Sumeria is normally a war civ, Gilgamesh's new ability in Heroes and Legends Mode seems like it could potentially open up more peaceful pathways to victory for them (depending on which heroes you recruit). Since they already get a built-in discount on levying units, forgoing a military completely and relying entirely on levied armies to keep hostile rivals at bay while they focus on infrastructure and economy seems like it could be a viable strategy for them.

Also, the people saying they never choose Intelligence Agency with anyone, not even with Black Queen Catherine? The synergy is so strong, there's even an achievement making a joke about it.

Well speaking for myself, the +2 envoys per levy is a big deal for Hungary. When levying as any other civ, I can lose my levy'd forces the moment another civ gets suzerainty, so a decent envoy lead is important for making sure they don't suddenly withdraw.

Good point on BQ Catherine, now I'm wondering if I haven't gotten that cheevo yet...

Intelligence Agency doesn't require any investment like GMC does, so it's pretty much the default failing everything else.

Though I guess if you are aggressive, you'd capture a lot of holy sites, but....

I dunno, I feel like there are eventually plenty of other sources of faith without needing to get a ton of holy sites, though they'd be nice to have. GMC giving bonus faith from pillaging definitely helps.

Personally, I've never found spies to even be tolerable unless I have both Machiavellianism and Cryptography slotted into my gov't at minimum. Otherwise, it takes a considerable amount of time for spies to travel, do their mission, only for them to likely fail over and over or eventually die on the way out. Randomized promotions on top of the randomness of successful missions is not particularly enticing either (and Non-State Actors is way too late to be of much use).

 

[Archon_Wing]

Personally, I've never found spies to even be tolerable unless I have both Machiavellianism and Cryptography slotted into my gov't at minimum. Otherwise, it takes a considerable amount of time for spies to travel, do their mission, only for them to likely fail over and over or eventually die on the way out. Randomized promotions on top of the randomness of successful missions is not particularly enticing either (and Non-State Actors is way too late to be of much use).

Listening post is risk free and gives you a free combat boost.

 

[CoconutTank]

Listening post is risk free and gives you a free combat boost.

Yes, thankfully.

I suppose I neglected to cover Listening Post previously. Afaik, Intelligence Agency doesn't do anything useful for LP. IA is supposed to help with the success rate of other spy missions, which is why I mentioned my miserable experiences with them, even after building the IA. If all I wanted spies for was LP, I wouldn't build the IA.

 

[Lily_Lancer]

Listening post is risk free and gives you a free combat boost.

The 1st spy costs 225, with +50% card it costs 150. The 2nd costs 200 with card or 300 without card. Intelligence Agency cost 290.

I don't care about spy slots actually. You don't need to listen to that many posts. Only 1 or 2 is fine. Spy takes too long time to move and establish themselves, and multiple spies cannot acclerate this.