Graphic cards (GPU) questions

Rub'Rum

Rub'Rum

Hates acronyms
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A few months ago, I noticed my 2 years old ATI Radeon HD 2900 was overheating and crashing my games. I dusted it out and everything was okay after that. I was using it on an old 17 inch monitor, most of the time in a lousy resolution like 1024x768

For Christmas, I got a new 21.5 inches flat screen and I ramped up my resolution to 1920x1080. Now it seems my random crashing when playing games due to overheating is back (card goes to over 90 degrees and screen goes black and I have to reset my computer). I mean, I can dust it again... But it's only been like 1.5 months since last time.

It seems the resolution is too demanding? It says the Radeon HD 2900 supports "up to 1920x1080" ... But it has crashed even when I reduced it to 1440xsomething.

I'm thinking of changing my GPU, but I've never done that. Are they plug and play? Can I just get a higher level ATI card, plug it in, and yay I'm fine? Do I have to bother with stuff like power supply and adding cooling to my computer? Ugh. I'm thinking of just bringing my computer somewhere and asking them to upgrade it.
 
It supports that resolution at the default 2D desktop. The 2xxx series was also notorious for power draw and cooling issues. It pretty much drew way too much power and couldnt stay cool at the default fan speeds. My suggestion to you is to first off, dust it out more often. I clean my pc every 3 weeks to keep it running well. Secondly, change the fan speeds. They're probably set to go to 100% only at very high temperatures which is much too conservative. You want 100% fan at about 65-70C, not 95C.

With the HD2900, you probably have a decent PSU so a midrange graphics card should be no issue for you. The only problem might be if the graphics card is AGP or PCIe. If its PCIe, you're golden, get a GTS250 or a HD4670 and plug that sucker in. If its AGP, you're out of luck, as there are very few AGP cards more powerful than the HD2900 that dont cost a small fortune.
 
Thanks. I don't know how to change the fan speed; is this in the ATI catalyst software?

I also don't understand what you mean with the AGP and PCIe. Are you talking about my motherboard being able to accept AGP vs PCIe cards? How would I know?

EDIT: If I get a new card and I have multiple slots, can I use both cards at the same time (ie leave my old one in for the win)? I still have winXP 32 bits though... Might upgrade that at some point to Windows 7.

EDIT 2: Maybe it'd help to know that my card is a HD 2900 XT. I have a i7 quad core thingie. Bought the computer in like August 2007

EDIT 3: Is there a reason you recommended 4670 instead of 4770? What power supply should I have?

Man lots of questions.
 
The manual for your motherboard, or look up its specs online, will tell you which slots the board has. If you have the book for the graphics card, that will tell you which slot it fits. AFAIK, there were some graphics cards that have versions compatible with different slots.

A bit of Google tells me that:
ATI Radeon™ HD 2900 Series - System Requirements

System Requirements
# PCI Express® based PC is required with one dual-width X16 lane graphics slot available on the motherboard
# Connection to 550 Watt (750 for CrossFire™) or greater power supply with two 2x3-pin PCIe® power connectors is required.
# For enhanced performance with ATI Overdrive™, a power supply with one 2x3-pin and one 2x4-pin PCIe ® power connector is required
# Certified power supplies are strongly recommended. Refer to http://ati.amd.com/CertifiedPSU for a list of Certified products
# Certified system cases with good airflow and cooling are recommended. Refer to http://ati.amd.com/certifiedcases for a list of Certified products
# 1GB of system memory
# Installation software requires CD-ROM drive
# DVD playback requires DVD drive
# Blu-ray / HD DVD playback requires Blu-ray / HD DVD drive
# To complete the CrossFire™ platform, a second ATI Radeon™ HD 2900 graphics card, a CrossFire™ Ready motherboard and one CrossFire™ Bridge Interconnect cable per board (included) are required

So your mobo has a PCI-E x16 slot as its primary video interface slot. (Unless there's a version I'm missing). You can replace that with any graphics card that is built for that slot.

You can check, but odds are your mobo only has one such slot. So to run more than one card you need the second card compatible with one of the other slots.
 
Ah yes, if you have a Core i7 then you most definitely have PCIe, as there are not X58/P55 motherboards with AGP slots. I reccomend the 4670 because its easier to find. If you find the 4770, you may also have issues with your power supply. You should probably see what the rating on it is. If you open your case sidepanel, the power supply should have either some sort of name, or it should have a power output sticker that lists the voltage on the different rails (5V, 12V) and the total. What you want to look at is the total wattage, the wattage on the 12V rail and the amperes (A) on the 12V rail. You also want to make sure you have at least one PCIe power cable coming from the PSU. It should be a rather thick cable with an end that has either 6 or 8 pins.

If your PSU has 600w or more, I can reccommend the HD5770 for you. Its ATI's newest series of graphics cards and in the 150-200$ category, its pretty much king.
 
Genocidicbunny said:
Ah yes, if you have a Core i7 then you most definitely have PCIe, as there are not X58/P55 motherboards with AGP slots. I reccomend the 4670 because its easier to find. If you find the 4770, you may also have issues with your power supply. You should probably see what the rating on it is. If you open your case sidepanel, the power supply should have either some sort of name, or it should have a power output sticker that lists the voltage on the different rails (5V, 12V) and the total. What you want to look at is the total wattage, the wattage on the 12V rail and the amperes (A) on the 12V rail. You also want to make sure you have at least one PCIe power cable coming from the PSU. It should be a rather thick cable with an end that has either 6 or 8 pins.

If your PSU has 600w or more, I can reccommend the HD5770 for you. Its ATI's newest series of graphics cards and in the 150-200$ category, its pretty much king.
Click to expand...

Thanks. It seems I have a Toughpower ATX 12V 2.2 & EPS 700W supply. I remember when I received the computer in the mail, they warned me they'd send me an old powersupply that they took out of the computer to replace it with a more powerful one that was necessary.
 
Im gonna go out on a limb and say that the HD5770 will work fine. In that case, its probably what you want to get. I can tell you that it should be able to play anything at 1920x1080 beautifully.
 
Genocidicbunny said:
Im gonna go out on a limb and say that the HD5770 will work fine. In that case, its probably what you want to get. I can tell you that it should be able to play anything at 1920x1080 beautifully.
Click to expand...

Is it a waste with Win XP 32 bits and 4 gigs RAM? Oh damn. I got it wrong. I have a Q6600.

EDIT: How do I control fan speed?

EDIT 2: Here's a pic of my graphic card spots on the motherboard... Seems I have like 2 PCI-e?

Spoiler :
photo2.jpg
 
yes, you have two PCIe slots. I do not reccomend plugging both cards in at once. They will not work in tandem. In fact, its pretty much a waste of electricity. The HD5770 can do the work of 3 or 4 HD 2900's.

You can adjust fan speed using programs such as RivaTuner.
 
Genocidicbunny said:
yes, you have two PCIe slots. I do not reccomend plugging both cards in at once. They will not work in tandem. In fact, its pretty much a waste of electricity. The HD5770 can do the work of 3 or 4 HD 2900's.

You can adjust fan speed using programs such as RivaTuner.
Click to expand...

It still feels weird to put the latest card in a 2.5 years old PC. I kind of ordered it but am sort of hesitating still. Maybe I should just stay in the 4000 series. Ummm. Ow ow, the pain of decision.

Websites I find in Canada have 4670 for 90$, 4770 for 127$, and the 5770 is almost 200$. I don't know how long I'll be keeping the PC either, probably at least another year. It's a Q6600 2.4 ghz "2 quad" from Intel with 4 gigs of RAM.

Man, for 200$ I can almost get an XBOX 360, or a new set of frickin winter tires. AH
 
The Q6600 is aging, but if you overclock it, it will last another year pretty easily. If you dont want to spend that much, and dont play any heavy games, the HD4670 will do it for you. If you want high details at the native resolution though, the HD 4670 will find it hard to pull that off.

The interesting thing about games is that most are not limited by the CPU. For the most part, even a Conroe 2ghz is pretty much all you need. The GPU though, is different. A 3 year old graphics card will find it hard to handle high detail in modern games. Therefore, you may have an older CPU, but as long as you have a good graphics card, you can keep up with games.
 
Genocidicbunny said:
The interesting thing about games is that most are not limited by the CPU. For the most part, even a Conroe 2ghz is pretty much all you need. The GPU though, is different. A 3 year old graphics card will find it hard to handle high detail in modern games. Therefore, you may have an older CPU, but as long as you have a good graphics card, you can keep up with games.
Click to expand...

This is one of the reasons I like firingsquad (as I mentioned in the other thread), the way they give the numbers makes it easy to see when games are limited by the GPU or the CPU.

At 1920x1080, it's worth pairing a new card with a Q6600, you'll be CPU limited the majority of the time. (The vast majority of the time if you turn on high levels of AA/AF)
 
The Q6600 is fine, mine has had no problems whatsoever, and I only have 2 gigs of ram for XP32 too.

$200 is a fair price for a good video card, which I assume the 5770 is (I use NVIDIA GPUs and don't pay attention to ATI). Recently released and.or high-end GPUs run up at least $300, often over $400.
 
Zelig said:
This is one of the reasons I like firingsquad (as I mentioned in the other thread), the way they give the numbers makes it easy to see when games are limited by the GPU or the CPU.

At 1920x1080, it's worth pairing a new card with a Q6600, you'll be CPU limited the majority of the time. (The vast majority of the time if you turn on high levels of AA/AF)
Click to expand...

I believe you meant GPU limited.


And yes PrinceScamp, the HD5770 is 200CAD supposedly. I see it on Newegg.ca for 180 CAD though, which is more in line with the US prices.
 
Genocidicbunny said:
I believe you meant GPU limited.
Click to expand...

Er, what I wrote doesn't really make sense either way. It should read as follows:

At 1920x1080, it's worth pairing a new card with a Q6600, otherwise you'll be GPU limited the majority of the time. (If you turn the AA/AF up at that resolution, you'll be able to bring the CPU limit into play - ie. you'll be using the full power of your GPU.)
 
Sapphire is pretty good, although their support kind of sucks. The best one out of any of the manufacturers there is XFX, but its also pretty much the most expensive one.

You shouldnt have any issues in the first 30 days as you can go through Newegg, but after that, you'd be stuck with Sapphire support. YMMV a lot with their support. Ive had both good and bad experiences with them, although this was 4 years ago.
 
Genocidicbunny said:
Sapphire is pretty good, although their support kind of sucks. The best one out of any of the manufacturers there is XFX, but its also pretty much the most expensive one.

You shouldnt have any issues in the first 30 days as you can go through Newegg, but after that, you'd be stuck with Sapphire support. YMMV a lot with their support. Ive had both good and bad experiences with them, although this was 4 years ago.
Click to expand...

My current card is a Sapphire.
 
SimonL said:
My current card is a Sapphire.
Click to expand...

Again, if you have no issues with the card, then their support could be worst thing in the world and it wouldnt matter.

The question is if you wanna pay 20$ more for the rare occasion that your video card goes bad and you want to get it replaced. And even then, its a guarantee of definitely no problems with customer support vs very low probability of problems.

Personally, I wouldnt bother, I like my money. if it was 20$ on a 500$ item, then id consider it, on a 170$ video card that will more than likely last you 2 years if you take care of it, it may not be worthwhile.
 
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