Great people - proper usage (bulb?)

[Zortex]

I have been playing for a month and pretty much nail Noble without many issues. Playing my first Prince atm and am pretty sure I will take out the victory.

Anyway I am always a bit confused as to the best use of my great people. I tend to have one GP city, and don't run the unlimited specialist civic. As such I normally end up with merchants/scientists (2 scientist from library, 2 merchant from market - 2 more merchants once I get grocer). I usually get 2-3 scientists out before my market goes up, then 50/50 with merchants.

Generally this is what I do with each one:
* Great General - Wait till a new military tech then attach it to my newly created strike force. I sometimes build the military academy if my production city is lacking.
* Great Scientist - Make the science building with first one, then settle - in my best commerce/cottage city.
* Great Merchant - Send him to a large/distant city to get the cash, cash is generally used to deficit research.
* Great Artist - No idea what to use it for tbh. I tend to save it till I am having issues with a captured city possibly flipping. Don't get them much anyway.
* Great Spy - I tend to ignore espionage so don't get these much.
* Great Priest - Rarely get one of these, and I normally haven't founded a religion so they are quite useless.

I sometimes also use my artists/scientists for golden ages (try to avoid using merchants as I like the cash). Generally I pop golden age as I get a new military tech, then change to +xp civics and crank out units. I declare war after the golden age is over and I am confident I have enough troops to do the job.

Anyway I feel like I am not using my GP to their potential. In particular I hear alot of people talk about bulbing as part of their core tactics, but I had always thought of this as a waste of a GP.

Basically I'm looking for a rundown on how I could improve my GP usage, any help would be appreciated. If you would like any more information about how I currently use them or any other information you may need to comment please ask.

 

[admtanaka]

At higher levels, bulbing becomes more important as you will need to trade for techs to keep up with the AIs. Frequently, using a Great Scientist to bulb Philosophy is a smart move.

On the other hand, if there is nothing to trade your recently-bulbed tech for, you might be better off settling the GS. It really depends on the situation.

 

[Ghpstage]

What your doing with them looks alright in most cases. There is no 'proper' use, it all comes down to personaly preference and ingame situation. Heres what I do

* Great Spy - I almost always settle the first, I find that espionage points are handy to have, even in modest quantities. If I get more I didn't intend to have later, they will often become Golden Age fodder.
* Great Prophet - If I can get Theology first I will bulb it, the AP is way to strong to allow an AI to waste it . If I have a widespread religion (which is rare) I make a shrine. Apart from that I usually settle, 5 and 2 is arguably the best settle yield, especially early on. Settling will be concentrated to my future Wall Street city.
* Great Artist - If I get one of these the first thing I do is cry . I always use them for Golden Age fodder, a GA for a GA. No other use unless i'm after a culture win (which I never do).
* Great Merchant - Mission gold is handy for defecit research or mass military upgrades (cats and trebs to cannons ). As I like to run a high slider, I often settle these guys in my chosen Wall Street city, the raw and half the food needed for another merchant is great. Don't forget about founding Sids Sushi or Cereal Mills.
* Great Scientist - Academy in my chosen Oxford Bureaucracy capital, some settling in Oxford city (more if I get the mids for Representation), lots of bulbing, maybe more academies.
* Great General - A lot of people like Medic 3 super medics on obsolete units (so won't be defender), but I nearly always settle them or build a military academy in the later game. Using them for combat troops is usually a waste. Attaching does however get 20 of the 26XP needed to build West Point, Charismatic leaders only need 20XP so attaching a general allows it right away

There are a few reasons I bulb,
1) To get a good trade tech.
-Philosophy, Paper, Education and Liberalism fit this category best. Trades only work if the AI techs fast enough to have something to trade though, not really effective till Emperor.
2) To get a tech that will give me a big advantage fast.
-Optics for caravels if isolated. Theology for Apostolic Palace, and Theocracy. Education for early Oxford. Liberalism (or toward it!) for free tech and 2 good civics.
3) Founding a religion with a tech makes AIs less interested in them.
- Being necessary for Liberalism, Philosophy is chief among these. Bulbing it first buys me time to get Chemistry to allow free Steel from Liberalism

A few general points on GP usage.
-If you have the Pyramids for early Representation, then settling your GPs becomes a lot more attractive, even a settled Great General gives 3 under Representation.
-Bulbing gives a pretty much fixed amount of , its most effective for Medieval and Renaissance techs and you can find the bulbing preferences list here . Theres even a built in bulbing aid in the BUG mod.
-Scientists generate a lot more than the others with bulbing, all others are equal. Scientists also bulb a generally better line of techs.
-Later on settling becomes less powerful, and the impact settled GPs have individually becomes smaller.
-Into the Industrial era bulbing really loses its glamour, but with the appearance of corps, (Particularly Mining Inc and Sid's Sushi) and the rapidly imprcreasing value of Golden Ages, Great People can still be very powerful.

 

[robbyextreme]

Hey I will post this here hope you don't mind OP.

But I don't know how to build GP very well, if not at all. For example; in my science city I would much rather focus on cottage growth then switching people into scientists for GP generation.

Same goes for most things, I also rarely do build wonders which generate GP because I don't play any Industrious civlizations, so only time I do build one is if the situation calls for it and if I have double production from a resource...again hardly ever at all.

My style of play revolves around city growth.. A LOT, and military production. I hardly ever have religion/culture/Wonders or any other wacky strategy's in there. What can I do?

 

[VoiceOfUnreason]

It's probably worth reviewing obsolete's walkthrus to get a feel for the kind of impact settling lots of great people can have.

 

[ciel]

It's a bit obvious, but no one mentioned it: you might want to save mid-game GP's for corps.

For GS's: When I get these guys from the Great Wall (whether I build or capture it early), I settle the first in the capital, and use second to build Scotland Yard. (The +100% EP bonus affects the settled spy AND the +4 from the palace, so it's the best yield.) Combined with EP's from courthouses, it's enough to steal a slow but steady stream of techs over the course of the game, which can each multiply into several techs through trading. Fun!

 

[mike p]

* Great General - Wait till a new military tech then attach it to my newly created strike force. I sometimes build the military academy if my production city is lacking.

Probably a mistake, if you mean adding it to a new unit to get it XPs out of the gate. If you're going to add it to a unit, you should add it to your most experienced older unit. With a GG attached, you get free upgrades (for example, axe to maceman or maceman to Grenadier or Rifleman) and you don't get capped at 10xps when you upgrade.

Mostly though, I tend to make one super medic and then settle the next few so my Heroic Epic city can churn out 10 xp units.

 

[robbyextreme]

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=231222

Reading obsoletes thread is a little frighting, it's like his already seen me play!

 

[Grey Fox]

I use almost every method of using Great People.
I prefer Acadamy, settling, and Golden Ages.

With Great Generals I sometimes make a super XP city. Sometimes I attach them to many units, less often I build mil.acadamies. Depends on the game and my need (and traits).

 

[Crusher1]

If you're going to add it to a unit, you should add it to your most experienced older unit.

I'd rather promote a warrior or another weak unit up the Medic line for healing on the go. Weak units are good because if an enemy attacks you you're strongest units defend - this obviously gives your weak super medic the best chances to live and continue healing everyone.

I use almost every method of using Great People.
I prefer Acadamy, settling, and Golden Ages.

I almost always go Academy, bulb Philo, GA with free artist from Music, bulb Paper, bulb Education, bulb PP, Trade Mission with free GM from Economics, and then it deviates from more academies, settling, and bulbing.

 

[Grey Fox]

Don't forget, units with attached great generals get free upgrades!

 

[omnipherous]

is there a maximum number of units you can attach a GG to? or could you stick him onto a gimungous stack and get free upgrades galore?

 

[blitzkrieg1980]

is there a maximum number of units you can attach a GG to? or could you stick him onto a gimungous stack and get free upgrades galore?

A GG only gives 20XP total. So if you have a stack of 10 units, they will all get 2XP (which isn't much at all). Sort of a waste of a GG IMO. If you're going to attach a GG, I usually go for a Medic III with the +1 movement promotion. This unlocks HE/WestPoint and provides a super healer which will get the stack moving again in 2 turns maximum (inside a captured city). Some people love making combat generals that utilize the Morale (i think) promotion for double XP. I've seen some crazy units with all the promotions and hundreds of XP. Search the forums, there's a thread devoted to those.

If you have an IMP leader, sometimes it's fun to have a Medic 3 and a crazy combat unit in your stack together.

 

[Grey Fox]

I either try to give as much exp to my currently existing General units, or I try to get as many units as possible promoted this way (like if I have several units at 3-4 or 8-9 xp) - I've kinda gone away from always making the super medic unit, to trying to get Mounted units with 80% withdrawal and combat VI and leadership (double xp per kill yey). Though I still make a super medic unit if I need it.

 

[blitzkrieg1980]

Super medic first in my games. Then settle the next in my future HE (allows me to keep in OrgRel). Then attach the next for uber combat (with an IMP leader)(

 

[civzombie]

last game I popped my second great scientist when my economy is in the toliet from rapid expansion (seriously I was losing about 3 gold per turn even at 0% science). Since I was about 13 turns away from currency, or something like that, I burned him on a golden age to "get me over the hump". I got out of the tight squeeze much faster than normal. I was very pleased with the usage.

 

[omnipherous]

I was more wondering if it is possible. Say, with GG1 you create a super medic on a defending unit for the stack, then with a subsequent GG you join to the whole stack to make use of free promotions for the city raiders..

For example, I have an abundance of GGs in my current game as I have the Great Wall, and my good neighbour Monty continuously suicides fairly large stacks against a nearby choke-point hill-city of mine, I have a couple super medics already in different stacks (i'm building up while letting monty go nuts and fail again and again, before I invade myself) as well as 4 settled GGs in my main production/HE city...

I have/will have enough of them that I could spare one if it meant a large stack got free upgrades when riflemen come around!

Thanks in advance, awesome forum here..

 

[blitzkrieg1980]

last game I popped my second great scientist when my economy is in the toliet from rapid expansion (seriously I was losing about 3 gold per turn even at 0% science). Since I was about 13 turns away from currency, or something like that, I burned him on a golden age to "get me over the hump". I got out of the tight squeeze much faster than normal. I was very pleased with the usage.

eEeK! I would rather lose a few units than burn a GS on a Golden Age! Bulb philosophy and trade for cheap techs + gold to keep afloat after Currency IMO. Then again, it totally depends on situation. But burning a GS on a GA is an absolute last resort for me.

For example, I have an abundance of GGs in my current game as I have the Great Wall, and my good neighbour Monty continuously suicides fairly large stacks against a nearby choke-point hill-city of mine, I have a couple super medics already in different stacks (i'm building up while letting monty go nuts and fail again and again, before I invade myself) as well as 4 settled GGs in my main production/HE city...

Settle those GG! Wow... that's a lot! Honestly, you only need 1 super medic. A Medic 1 unit in other stacks works fine. I would settle the GGs instead of attach them to bunches of units. Why? Because you can achieve tons of promotions right out of the barracks when the unit is built when you settle GGs allowing endless 3-4 promotion units instead of just the group you would attach the GGs to.

 

[omnipherous]

I guess so.. I'll just have to get myself away from becoming attached to long-serving units and disband them (unless highly promoted) to pave the way for some out-of-the-shop promoted units..

This is only on Noble by the way, I STILL haven't beaten it! I always end up fairly far ahead in both tech and points, equal in power with the next best, but then they gang up on me.. darn religious groups! I may just have to aim for every holy city in the world and raze it to the ground! that should level the playing field... enough for me to completely wipe everyone out at least

 

[blitzkrieg1980]

I guess so.. I'll just have to get myself away from becoming attached to long-serving units and disband them (unless highly promoted) to pave the way for some out-of-the-shop promoted units..

This is only on Noble by the way, I STILL haven't beaten it! I always end up fairly far ahead in both tech and points, equal in power with the next best, but then they gang up on me.. darn religious groups! I may just have to aim for every holy city in the world and raze it to the ground! that should level the playing field... enough for me to completely wipe everyone out at least

Sounds like you need to work on your diplomacy a bit lol. Try bribing aggressive AIs to war with each other throughout the game creating disconnections in their little religious lovefest. And invade earlier.