Holding off a superior foe

[EQandcivfanatic]

After playing on a huge pagnega map with 12 civs, and only building ten cities while the rest ended up with around 20 each, and being surprised attacked numurous times by people stronger than me i think i can safely say that i know tactics to use in each age to hold off a superior foe without doing the wimpy way of getting the whole world to ally against them.

-Ancient Age-

-If you have horsemen, use them to your advantage. Using your road network to quickly circle around and attack resting or retreating units, then retreating just as quickly is valuable skill. The AI always sends badly wounded units back to rest in a nearby city. Ambush these as they retreat.

-If the enemy has Iron and you dont, don't give up. Fight a delaying war with archers and spearmen. Dig in on the best possible positions you can (across rivers, on top of hills or mountains, or in a fortress). Use Horsemen or Archers to counterattack weak units. Only go on the offensive if the enemy is badly damaged.

-Never build catapults unless in a time of peace, otherwise it is just a waste of sheilds, since of lousy bombard.


-Early Medieval-

-Once again horseback warriors are invaluable. Use knights the same as you used Horsemen in the Ancient Age. Knights are their own Pikemen, so don't waste time sending Pikemen along with them.

-Without Horses, the stradedgy is the same as with the Spearmen in the Ancient Age. As someone once said, the best defense is the best offense.

-Without Horses or Iron i suggest slapping yourself with a pillow until you quietly shut off the game and restart. But, if that doesn't work for then this should: Pillage. Pillage roads across mountains or jungles espacially as it will seriously slow down enemy knights, which will give you time to prepare for a new defense line. Of course this doesn't really matter until they capture your cities. But, if you have no Iron or Horses you're bound to lose a city or two. Your best bet in this worse case scenario is to buy time and hope you have saltpeter somewhere in your territory.

Late Medieval Ages

-In best case scenario, with saltpeter and horses, just mass up calvary and counterattack like you have never counterattacked before.

-without horses, build muskets and do the same stradedgy as with Pikemen or Spearmen. Longbows are also useful here, but never make the mistake of sending them undefended.

-Once again, if you have no resources or only Iron i suggest you whack yourself in the head with a pillow or preferrably a hammer untill you restart the game. Otherwise, just pillage.


more to come pending further interest.

 

[DB_Terror]

Some more thoughts: Use your quick units to pillage the enemy's key resources, e.g. horses, iron or saltpeter. Find bottlenecks in the enemy territory and pillage roads to cut off his luxury / resource supply. If necessary, take a ship to send your units to pillage the resources.

 

[Knight-Dragon]

Another one - ally with other AIs against the offending civ. The first time, you may need to pay; but when renewal comes you can even get them to pay you to remain in the fight. Also the AIs hooked will ally with other AIs to fight that first offending AI, thus setting up a chain reaction.

 

[MSGT John Drew]

Knight-Dragon, I think EQ did point out his post was for:


...hold(ing) off a superior foe without doing the wimpy way of getting the whole world to ally against them.

But I do agree with KnightDragon. What's wimpy with getting the whole world to ally with them, anyway? In my games I always make it a point that the other 'strong' civs will not have a chance to ally with my enemy against me. Better WE against him than THEM against me.

But if you do have a yearning to be the one to conquer the offending civ...

 

[Richard III]

I find running in terror is working well for me in my current game.

 

[Knight-Dragon]

Originally posted by MSGT John Drew
Knight-Dragon, I think EQ did point out his post was for:


...hold(ing) off a superior foe without doing the wimpy way of getting the whole world to ally against them.

Ah, I miss that for some reason. But I don't think making use of the AI to fight the AI and then set them all back terribly is so wimpy; more like ruthless...

 

[billindenver]

I've been using all of those in my current Monarch game, with no iron, playing as Japan. I don't like playing as a constant warrior, but the AI hasn't given me the choice. I'm on a good sized continent with the Zulus, Indians, and Chinese, and ever since early in the game they have been ganging up on me big-time. I managed to do ok with just horsemen, almost eliminating India and taking most of their prime cities. Once China got Riders, I was in trouble, since I couldn't even build pikes to defend with.

Longbowmen helped some, but I ended up losing 1 city (which they promptly destroyed, the bastards), and being forced to give them another city for peace. But like clockwork, every 20 turns, they redeclare war.

I've FINALLY gotten gunpowder to even up the mismatch, but it's all I can do just to fend off their attacks. I sure hope to survive until cavalry. God I would love to pummel those damned Chinese and their AI butt-buddies.

In a situtation like that, I really don't consider it wimpy to get an alliance. It may be the only way out.

 

[PersianImmortal]

Hi Guys. my first post on CivFanatics

I can sooo relate to all this.. playing my first game on Monarch.. boy.. do I miss Chiefan.. used to whoop AI's behind.. always as Persia.. why did I have to go choose Random. :rant:

Now i'm stuck as Lincoln.. Iron everywhere but the Iroquis kicked me out .. they so mean

Nothing but spearmen.. and i have had countless retakes of my border cities.. they take it.. attempt to take my capital guarded with spearmen.. fail, and then their cities overthrow the Governor to come back to daddy again. Helps to build culture i tell ya..

btw.. how do u 'sell' the gold in a city?? i've had so much ransacked cuz i couldn't get rid of cash quickly..

Also i tried disbanding a city but don't know how.. any tips??

I'm very close to using the 'pillow tip' posted above.. cuz the other civilizations are building wonders of the next age but my stupid AI neighbors have me entangled into this useless war.. they aren't going anywhere and won't let me get anywhere either.. morons.

 

[Bismarck]

* btw.. how do u 'sell' the gold in a city?? i've had so much ransacked cuz i couldn't get rid of cash quickly..

The usual advice is (a) trade away your treasury for a gold-per-turn agreement with an AI; or, if they won't do it, (b) rush as many improvements as you can with your gold! Might as well spend it on something (of course, this assumes that you're not on a pop-rushing gov't like despotism).

* Also i tried disbanding a city but don't know how.. any tips??

Just right-click it and choose "abandon city."

RE: holding off a superior enemy: my solution is usually to sue for peace! This is almost always cheaper than fighting a prolonged war with an equal, let alone superior adversary.

In general, I attack only when I have some sort of advantage over the enemy. This need not be a *global* advantage -- i.e., our militaries can be of equal size overall -- but it should at least be a *local* advantage (for example, concentrate half of my forces on two of his cities, so that I'll be irresistable at those points).

As an example of "the peace option", in my last Monarch game, playing as the Persians, I was quite happily crushing the Zulus until suddenly they secured the Bayblonians as allies. I underestimated the danger and deployed just a few Immortals on the Zulu/Bab frontier. About 6-7 turns later, a Babylonian stack-o'-death with 20+ bowmen appeared.

If I had rushed all my Immortals over there, I might have been able to stem the Bab tide -- but that would have put an end to my Zulu campaign. So instead, I stalled for a few turns, then bribed the Babs to get off my back. Only cost me Literature plus 80 gold.

I *could* have started to throw up fortifications, capture chokepoints, pillaged the Babs' resources, etc. -- but why bother? It's usually much cheaper to sue for peace, unless wearing down a strong adversary is your *strategic* objective.

 

[Hades]

My strategy depends on whether that superior foe is next to my territory. If they are and they declared war on you then your are finished. The trick it to find out which of my neighbours is superior and do something about it before they get hostile on me. Trade with them on a continuous basis would lessen the change of their attacking me. Invite them to attack another civ far away to move their core troops out of position. Cancel the military alliance after 20 turns and prepare my invasion on that "superior" neighbour. Most of their units should be somewhere on the other side of the continent by now.

If they are far away, why would I care if they are superior?

 

[EQandcivfanatic]

-Early Industrial-

- if you are at war don't be stupid by rushing to Raplaceable parts. It is much better to get 1 tech soon after the age begins, then waiting for Replaceable Parts which is a few turns away. Go for Nationalism.

-Calvary isn't as valuable at this age as it was in the Late Medieval. Use it for what you used knights and horsemen earlier by destroying damaged retreating units. Calvary also makes a good unit for raids behind enemy lines, to cut off resources and roads/railroads.

- Fortunately Riflemen don't require any resources so you can use them and still be up to date. You could even use them to attack if you can back yourself up with cannon. Use cannon at this point only for major attacks and defense. Without a full rail network or two tile ranged artillery, using cannon as a thing just to kill everything that walks into your territory is just not possible. As before, if heavily outnumbered dig in at fortresses, across rivers and on top of mountains.

Middle Industrial Ages

-In best case with rubber, build infantry and nothing else, as 10 defense infantry has the same attack as Calvary and requires less resources. I suggest using 50% of your core cities for artillery and the rest for infantry.

-Without rubber, continue building riflemen and attempt to hold out for a peace treaty. Use Calvary for attack, but this time send them with heavy artillery and riflemen support as the enemy infantry will annihalate your calvary if all by itself.

-With no resources, once again whack yourself with a hammer. Otherwise just build artillery and riflemen and hope for the best and make them pay for every inch of ground.

-Late Industrial-

-Best case, damage the invaders with artllery then destory them using tanks. You can also use tanks to destroy resting or retreating units much like horsemen, knights, and calvary did.

-Without oil, use trench warfare stradgy against enemy troops. If you can repulse enough tanks and calvary you can slowly advance into enemy territory using a infantry and artillery combo.

-With only saltpeter, iron, and horses, this calls for another whacking. With nothing it is a miracle you survived this long.

 

[zagnut]

In the late industrial age the AI seems to invade with lots of infantry. This seems to be its favorite unit to build up during peacetime. Very often it will not have tanks. If this is so and you do have tanks, even only a few, then you can defeat a much larger force.

The enemy infantry will be stacked, sometimes up to 50 units. But, if you have 3 or 4 infantry in your nearest city the AI will pass it by on its way to your next weaker city. Therefore, move lots of infantry to the first city in the stacks path and leave the next city bearly defended. The stack will head for the weak city and you can use a few tanks to pick off the infantry when they are on plains or grassland. The AI is reluctant to use infantry to attack, so why does it send infantry to attack you? I don't know.

Keep in mind that the infantry stack can only travel one square per turn and your tanks can travel 6. So they can attack and then retire to your nearest city with a barracks to recharge. In that way the AI is losing units and you are not. Your units are just suffering damage but live to fight another day. In this way you can wear down a much larger force.

 

[Zachriel]

Originally posted by Richard III
I find running in terror is working well for me in my current game.

All for the want of a horseshoe nail, Richard.

 

[Pi Seti]

Pikemen in the Medieval can be worthwhile to build over knights in many situations. They get a defense bonus vs. mounted units, and plus mounted units can't retreat from them if losing. Once war starts, entrenching pikemen in forts and cities and letting eager enemy knights get impaled on them can often give you a quick and decisive advantage in numbers.