How close is too close?

[playshogi]

When you get the AI warning "You settled to close" and I agree to "look elsewhere in the future", how close can I settle in the future without breaking the promise? If I ignore the request, I still get dinged for "failing to make a promise".

 

[stormerne]

Further away than the city that caused the warning in the first place. Exactly how much further, I'm not sure.

One trick, if you suspect you'll get a warning, is to settle several offending cities in a line in one turn. You only get one warning from the civ and you have then filled all the area you need.

Another trick, almost always employed by the AI, is to forward-settle and back-fill. If you settle deliberately close, leaving a large gap between that city and the rest of your civilization, then you promise not to do it again when they complain, you can fill in the gap with impunity AND you get diplomatic kudos for keeping to an agreement. Doing things the opposite way and gradually creeping toward their borders risks repeated dings and yields a smaller overall settlement area.

 

[Futumch]

I think it's defined in the Global Parameters XML file :
Line 85 : <Row Name="CITY_MIN_DISTANCE_FOR_INCURSION" Value="8" />
Not 100% sure though.

 

[LethalLeigh]

I settled 20 hexes away from the AI once and I still was told I settled too close. Other times I settles only about 10 hexes away and they say nothing.
It is annoying not knowing how close is too close.

 

[Victoria]

Yeah I think they changed it from 6 to 8 at one stage but can confirm this.

 

[Rosty K]

Is it from existing cities, or can they also get pissed off if you settle where they were planning to?

 

[DizzKneeLand33]

I think it's defined in the Global Parameters XML file :
Line 85 : <Row Name="CITY_MIN_DISTANCE_FOR_INCURSION" Value="8" />
Not 100% sure though.

Correct, this is the exact line in Global Parameters (line 85 in notepad++).

And, I *think* this is from any of their cities. So, if they forward settle your capital and you settle near your capital another direction, it triggers. It also triggers if you settle a city and then they capture a city too close within so many turns, it seems....

 

[Victoria]

Not where they are planning to AFAIK. I have held a settler in place with a scout and settled where they were likely to go a few times with no complaint.

 

[DizzKneeLand33]

I don't think it's where they are likely to go -- I think it's where they actually are.

 

[Futumch]

Maybe this distance also allows you to use the diplomatic option "promise not to settle too close to my cities".

Ugh. That reads horribly. It sounded better in my head, believe me.

 

[Victoria]

Maybe this distance also allows you to use the diplomatic option "promise not to settle too close to my citie

Indeed it is as well as when you settle within 8 of theirs. While you are considered a human player so treated differently in some ways, when it comes to diplomacy the AI is tracking your diplomacy as if you were an AI civ. This includes such things as they came too close to your borders... it's all in the diplomacy_modifiers.csv in the log file.

It's a damn shame it does not show in game what the AI thinks I think about them as I suspect it counts in some of their actions.

 

[joncnunn]

In actual practice, experts love when they get the message. They are now exploiting it firing by having said city be the last in a settlement wave and settling on purpose just to promise to stop for the relationship bonus.

 

[xISOADIx]

I really wish we could find out the distance. I'd push the limit as much as possible. And finally it takes wayyyyyyy too long to get multiple settlers than position them properly and than finally settle them all at the same time. By the time that all happens you def get forward settled.

 

[DizzKneeLand33]

I really wish we could find out the distance. I'd push the limit as much as possible. And finally it takes wayyyyyyy too long to get multiple settlers than position them properly and than finally settle them all at the same time. By the time that all happens you def get forward settled.

The distance is clearly stated above, 8 tiles.

 

[xISOADIx]

The distance is clearly stated above, 8 tiles.

I'm a lazy reader sometimes lol I just started an Inland sea game on 7 as scythia. I will forward settle and test this ASAP.

 

[DizzKneeLand33]

Ooooh, and one other thing, if you settle more than one city all in the same turn, they don't ask you to not settle again until you are all done. Sometimes it's fun to settle 2, 3, (4!) cities on the same turn for just one small ding to your rep, which can turn into a plus.

 

[PYITE]

When they complain that you settled in a region they consider their own, is that 8 tiles from their capitol?

 

[Victoria]

From any city

 

[DizzKneeLand33]

Yes. In fact, I've gotten the message several times after another civ has forward settled *my* capital (literally 4 tiles away) and my capital was my only city.

 

[PYITE]

"You settle to close" is a complaint

"You settled in a region they consider their own" is the denouncement for doing it.

Is that right?

What are the corresponding diplomatic modifiers?