how do i get a civ to ally itself against a 3rd civ?

[jirojan]

im trying to convince greece to delcare war on egypt, but the option is in red so i cant pick it.
how do i get them to assist me?

do i have to declare war on egypt before i ask them to help? do i need to do anything to get them to help me?

thanks

 

[Willowmound]

They won't do it if they don't like you.

They won't do it if they like the target.

If they like you and they don't like the target, they might be willig, but you are going to have to bribe them with tech.

 

[Tristan daCunha]

but you are going to have to bribe them with tech.

Or a lot of money. A lot.

 

[aronnax]

like them or not u have to be ripped of your money.

 

[Blaarg]

I've asked them to declare war on another civ as a gift, and they accepted. I forget who the leader was, but it was an agressive one if I recall. Alexander or Napoleon, I think.

 

[SwordofStriker]

If you want another civ to attack someone for free, they must be "friendly" towards you. A relation of "pleased" or lower will almost never result in any favors of that nature. However, if they are also "friendly" towards the other civ, I wouldn't get your hopes up.

You can simply ask each civ how they feel about the intended target and try getting the ones who really dislike Egypt to declare war. I usually play civ's off on one another like that to make my job a little easier. If they aren't "friendly" towards you though, you will have to do like others have said and pay either a LOT of gold, or a tech to get things started.

 

[LucyDuke]

If you're at war with the target already, they're more willing to join in. Your own DoW can make the difference between the option being red and white. It's usually pretty expensive if you can pull it off, but it's generally worth it if they're closer to the target than you are, or if their military is much stronger. There's no guarantee how long their part in the war will last, though, so be careful what you pay. You can make peace with the target and leave them to finish the war sometimes.

So, declare war on Egypt yourself and Greece may be more willing to join the brawl.

 

[SwordofStriker]

Also, remember that even though they agreed to declare war, that doesn't necessarily mean they will actually do anything. I can't count the number of times I paid exorbitant amounts of money for someone to declare war on a particularly troublesome foe and they happily took my money, declared war, and sat on their tushes and didn't move any troops. How aggravating.......

 

[Codex]

Also, remember that even though they agreed to declare war, that doesn't necessarily mean they will actually do anything. I can't count the number of times I paid exorbitant amounts of money for someone to declare war on a particularly troublesome foe and they happily took my money, declared war, and sat on their tushes and didn't move any troops. How aggravating.......

I had to at this one!

Too true, and of course we're all too honourable to do the same thing, no? (Sure, Julius, I'll help you out. Just give me a few centuries to, ooomph, get my intercontinental strike force ready. No, really, I'm coming. Really. You just hold the line...)

A bit more OT, you can at least ensure that the ally won't be coming after you, and there are less obvious consequences to a DOW than open combat. (Hurt feelings, cessation of resource trading, and a general economic arising from the cutting off of trade; I'm sure that there are more.)

 

[LucyDuke]

Also, remember that even though they agreed to declare war, that doesn't necessarily mean they will actually do anything.

Damn right! This is the most aggrivating thing. It's not too terrible if your ally is physically between you and the target, because then they're going to bear the brunt of the attacking forces whether or not they lift a finger. Probably the only time you can count on the help. I can't stand paying the AI to effectively cut off trade and pick up a few diplo modifiers.

Just an hour ago I bribed Elizabeth to join my war against Brennus. (Custom continents, six civs, we had one each. Standard size. Toroidal wrap, so everybody was everybody else's neighbor. Not an odyssey to cross the ocean.) Probably ten turns later, I brought Frederick into the fight. Frederick got there before she did. Lazy English grumble grumble...

Like Codex said, though, how many times have you taken the tech/cash for the diplo hit, never sending any attack? If it's not one of my best friends, I won't get involved at all, but I'll confess that I do it occasionally.

 

[feldmarshall]

Also, remember that even though they agreed to declare war, that doesn't necessarily mean they will actually do anything. I can't count the number of times I paid exorbitant amounts of money for someone to declare war on a particularly troublesome foe and they happily took my money, declared war, and sat on their tushes and didn't move any troops. How aggravating.......

but you can do "why don't you attack..." choice. it usually works with me

 

[LucyDuke]

but you can do "why don't you attack..." choice. it usually works with me

This does work, but that option is only available if they're your vassal.

Edit: I was wrong, they don't need to be a vassal for the option to be there. Sometimes it's there if they're not a vassal, though I'm not sure what determines it. It's not always available with all allies. Anyone know?

 

[tycoonist]

it is very annoying how the AI can make unreasonable demands from us at any time but we cant make them from him

 

[LucyDuke]

it is very annoying how the AI can make unreasonable demands from us at any time but we cant make them from him

Of course you can! Pick out what you want, and the first option, above "what do you want for this?", is effectively "give me this." (Don't offer anything in exchange.) If your rival is Friendly or Pleased, I think it's "Could you spare this for a good friend?" and you can ask without a diplo hit. If they're Cautious or lower, it's a demand, and you'll take a diplo hit whether or not they agree to the demand.

 

[trundle]

Right, but the AI reds out certain options so you can't ask for them at all. That always struck me as odd. I mean, it's useful from a gameplay standpoint (you know what the AI absolutely will not give you), but it's annoying that I can't set "red" options of my own. I suffer a diplo hit when they ask for the most unreasonable things -- techs I just discovered that turn, war with my greatest ally, etc.

 

[LucyDuke]

Right, but the AI reds out certain options so you can't ask for them at all. That always struck me as odd. I mean, it's useful from a gameplay standpoint (you know what the AI absolutely will not give you), but it's annoying that I can't set "red" options of my own. I suffer a diplo hit when they ask for the most unreasonable things -- techs I just discovered that turn, war with my greatest ally, etc.

Yeah, I can see what you mean. It sort of makes sense, though, considering that you don't really have a diplomacy score of your own. I mean, the human doesn't work like the machine, there's no "You refused to give us tribute!" score kept for the human player, so there's no need to keep track of it when you want something they'll never give up. The "Brennus just demanded my iron, he's a bastard I won't trade with" that you keep in your head matches the "You refused to give us tribute!" that Mao keeps racking up. I imagine that multiplayer makes more sense of it.

Beyond that, even, I wish you could put up some kind of "do not disturb" without it being a negative thing. Just because I just discovered Writing does not mean that I want every civ on the planet to ask me for Open Borders! Luckily when they offer a deal rather than just make a demand there's no diplo hit, but it's still a pain to deny everyone one at a time. It is unfortunate that the human cannot set "Refuses to talk!" with anyone, but it would probably just complicate the interface unnecessarily.

 

[feldmarshall]

This does work, but that option is only available if they're your vassal.

Edit: I was wrong, they don't need to be a vassal for the option to be there. Sometimes it's there if they're not a vassal, though I'm not sure what determines it. It's not always available with all allies. Anyone know?

i play vanilla and it's available if you share a common enemy at war

 

[LucyDuke]

i play vanilla and it's available if you share a common enemy at war

Is it always available? My last game, Elizabeth, Frederick and I were allied against Brennus. (I'd declared and brought them in as allies.) I could ask Elizabeth to attack certain cities, but the option wasn't there to discuss it with Frederick. It's Warlords, but I can't imagine what the difference would be.