how high can a trade rout get

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pbg5000

Chieftain
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What is the highest number of extra trade arrows you can get from a trade route?

I have recently started to play this game more and more and thanks to help from here have gotten much better

But the most beakers I can get out of my SSC is about 144 - 170

I know trade routes help but can't seem to get them better than +5 arrows

Also how is it people win these games so early
My best is about 1850 ad or so usually by conquest
(only because I get tired of AI attacking me) in the recent game of the month it took me to at least 1900 ad
 
You have to pick the right city for the route, and there are several factors that add to the trade. I have problems remembering which factors are for the delivery and which are for the route, but an optimal road or rail connection will add a lot, and different continent/island too I think. I usually don't have any problems getting a beaker count of 800+, but I know some think it's easy to get it 2000+. Growing the city also helps.

To answer your first question, I think it's possible to get 60+ per route in normal games, but don't know the exact amount. I think Tim the Enchanter played an OCC in an optimal environment (created by himself), and he reached 96t/route IIRC.
 
To get the Trade Route up as high as possible you need to max the city (20+) and build an "optimal" RR connection with an AI destination city on the same continent as yourself, and you need SuperHighways and a lot of high-trade land tiles with roads. Ideally the AI city has SH as well, but that is a matter of their choice (unless you build the city and give it to them...). Colossus is also a benefit, but it expires in the late game when SH and RL are coming on line. Different continents help the delivery bonus, but not the TRs.

Second best TRs are done with the Twin City approach. See the GL at Apolyton.Net for a description of this idea written by La fayette. Both cities are yours, they are only far enough apart on the same continent that they can get to size 20, and you spare no expense making sure they develop quickly. You will suffer a 50% decrease over working with an AI city, but you are able to make sure the SuperHighways are put in ASAP and the RR connections are not interfered with.

My personal "real game" record for TRs was 45, to a nearby AI city sized 12 with "optimal" RR connection and SH only in my city. I gave him Auto but he never built SH. I also allied with him so I could send a few Engineers up and optimize his terrain for growth and trade. I ground my teeth when he sent his Settler out to turn the beautiful Gems into Grass!
 
Originally posted by funxus
I think Tim the Enchanter played an OCC in an optimal environment (created by himself), and he reached 96t/route IIRC.
Click to expand...
Actually, it was "only" +87 per route. And like you said that was an artificially created setup. You'd never be able to get that much in a real game.
 
If you had an extremely big island you could probably pull off well over +100 per route. The most I've gotten in a real game is +45, but then again I usually have blown up all the computers by the time I can get that kind of trade so I haven't had much testing. The keys would be having both cities on the same island, connected by railroad, superhighways, and colossus if possible. The amount of the route is a multiple of the distance between the cities, so the farther the better- Try being the french on the real world and trading with the chinese or something that would probably yield some stellar results. In the end, though, its not really that practical to go "big trade hunting", just stick to the basics:).
 
I thought that cities on two islands gave the same amount as conected with RR... And I don't bother with that because I make as little amount of RR as posible, and it must be shortest distance.
 
Well, I'm reopening this old thread..lol. I've been asking questions on another thread about trade routes, but I thought this would be a more appropriate place. I'm wondering, for mathematical analysis, what all the bonuses/deductions of trade routes are. I visited La Fayette's Twin City approach and found it quite interesting. I'm wondering, what does it exactly mean to have a direct road or railroad between two cities. Do you just have to have roads/railroads that connect the two, or is there more to it? So far I've found La Fayette's little formula: (HTA + DTA + 4)/8 equals trade route value. I also found from her that if both cities are yours, you divide by a further two. Also, with the direct route, the cities have to be within 22 squares as you put it. I thought you get a bonus for two cities being further apart. Secondly, what classifies if a city is on a different continent? Is it water seperation, or something else?
Finally, what is the bonus of trading with a city that demands your goods versus one that does not?
 
Never forget that, when you deliver a camel, you get TWO rewards:

1) One time bonus (a certain amount of gold PLUS the same amount of beakers)

2) Continuing Trade Route (a certain amount of trade that is added to the "Base Trade" of your city until the end of the game)

Distance between cities, "overseas" bonus and multiplier for demanded goods have NO INFLUENCE at all on the value of the trade route.
 
My personal recor is +50 for each route in an OCC game:
Colossus city with a lot of river tiles four trade specials, superhighways and a fat AI city nearby, flight not yet discovered.
 
The "definitive" answers:

Calculating Caravan Delivery Payments:
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=64729

Observations on Roads and Trade:
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=20540

Trade Roads:
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=87763

"Phantom" Roads&Railroads:
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=66560

The Trade Route Formula:
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=113450

The bonuses and deductions for trade routes are listed in the third link. The road/rail bonus depends on a "key" route that is not always direct - at least, not to the eye. It follows the path that an Explorer would take from the home city to the destination city, which sometimes starts out N/S/E/W, then takes a dogleg for awhile and ends up with another dogleg. There is a drawing of starting "key" paths in those threads somewhere, but it only shows the first 4-5 tiles from the origin. Most cases you need something that shows 10-20 tiles. The best way is to take an Explorer and give him the GoTo command from the home city to the destination city. This should be done BEFORE any railroads get laid down, because the 0 travel cost of railroads can skew the calculations of the GoTo command. Follow him up with an Engineer or Settler to lay down the line. If you don't have Explorers yet, give the Settler the GoTo command but realize that he will deviate for terrain like rivers that should not be considered. Distance between cities only influences the calculation of the bonus payment, not the ongoing trade route. And the determinant of the "Different Continent" rule is continent number, which you see when you right-click a tile on each continent. The multiplier for demanded goods only influences the one-time bonus payment, and varies based on the goods. The first link I cited has those values.
 
Thanks so much. The links were so useful. I'm just wondering, what does it mean for the Airport bonus to be superceded by the RD/RR factor? I should let you know, however, that the second link didn't work.
 
Thanks for catching that mistake. As a bonus, I added an extra one ("Trade Roads") that has an older graphic illustrating "key" paths.

Regarding Airports and RD/RR, some bonuses are cumulative, such as SuperHighways and Airports, but some are not. If you have a "key" road and Airports, the Road's 50% bonus will supercede the Airport's 50% rather than add to it. Thus the most you can get is 150%, with RailRoads (100%) and SuperHighways (50%).
 
Thanks! The third link was really helpful...escpecially the diagram (I printed that one off!). I'm just wondering, under the obstacles section...what is a determination point or crossroad point?
 
Zenon tends to complicate things with terminology... I think "determination point" and "crossroad point" are the same, but he gives no examples. Do you know how to calculate distance in Civ2 terms? Check Samson's Delivery Payments thread for an explanation. Basically, the idea is to find the path that has the lowest "distance" value, following several "start here/move this way first" rules. When I am in doubt, I draw a simple map in MapEditor, start a test game and run an Explorer over the terrain. All you need is grass and ocean; the path algorithm does not consider movement costs for different terrain. Also, ignore rivers - they throw off the GoTo command for one-move units, but the true path is calculated without the rivers.
 
ElephantU said:
Zenon tends to complicate things with terminology... .
Click to expand...

I don't think he did that on purpose: I think that Zenon is not a native English speaker (my guess is that he is German).

Yet he is one of the very best civ2 players, at least in the field of early landing :goodjob:

(too bad I haven't read a single post from him in 2004 )
 
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