Humankind Game by Amplitude

I expect diseases could be efficiently handled as part of the event systems. That way you could customize the impact / choices by era, and it would represent truly horrific outbreaks, rather than the every decade or so events that, frankly, can be abstracted away as part of the underlying population growth system. Would be tough to have a general system about diseases without first having an underlying health-system, and it wouldn't necessarily add much to gameplay as it's primary effect would be to modify population growth. The most noteworthy outbreaks, the ones that had an impact on people's behaviour/thought, seem prime candidates for events. (This terrible thing is happening - how do you respond and how does that change your society going forward?)

Exactly. The underlying and continuous disease in the cities can be handled easily by making it Invisible: until a certain point in the 19th century it is simply a constant modifier to what would be optimal growth of population.

The capitalized Plagues, which could be local to one region/city or more general or even spread along trade routes (pick your mechanic or include all of them) would fit nicely into Humankind's Event system. You can hold special religious services, build a sewer (Babylon, Harappan cities, Mycenean citadels, Rome all had sewer/waste management systems in the Ancient and Classical Eras), encourage the teachings of some wierdo like Hippocrates, Galen, Dioscorides, al-Zahrawi, Pare, etc - don't even have to name them, since Humankind is apparently avoiding the Personalization fetish of Civ VI, just indicate their influence on surgery, diagnostics, herbal medicine, battlefield medicine, infection, etc.
 
Footnote/Addendum: In the late 19th century the combination of better sanitation, health care (clinics and public hospitals), germ theory and medications caused the population of Europe to more than double in less than 3 generations. That kind of Post-Plague population explosion, handled well in the game design, could give the gamer a real new set of problems to confront in the Industrial Era: how to keep all those new people happy, loyal, and fed. Among other things, it IRL led directly and/or indirectly to the Progressive Movement in America, the Social Democratic Movement in Germany, and a general increase in tension and conflict between the 'establishment' and the teeming mass of new population . . .
 
Chola can open up so much possibilities, as their rivals include Srivijaya (great trader and naval power) and Anuradhapura (renowned engineer), not to say that Srivijaya's position was later inherited by Majapahit (even greater trader and naval power).

Chola's a great idea, but Srivijaya is based on flimsy historical evidence, and perhaps the wishful thinking of scholars from my own alma mater (in Southeast Asian studies), Cornell. It perhaps did not exist. See this:

https://leminhkhai.blog/imagining-s...VprSKHTII_B_YyQ9_tyhIph_x0GSPN9Q-xqACsh-cNWJc
 
Chola's a great idea, but Srivijaya is based on flimsy historical evidence, and perhaps the wishful thinking of scholars from my own alma mater (in Southeast Asian studies), Cornell. It perhaps did not exist. See this:

https://leminhkhai.blog/imagining-s...VprSKHTII_B_YyQ9_tyhIph_x0GSPN9Q-xqACsh-cNWJc

Here in the early 21st century (to misquote Terry Pratchett, apparently the "Century of the Fruitcake") it's easy to forget how little real knowledge about Southeast Asia was being disseminated in the west back in the 1960s, when the Cornellians went 'all in' on Srivijaya.
At Penn State where I was attending, the ONLY course on Southeast Asia was a single upper-level course on Vietnamese History, for which there was considerable interest since most male undergraduates were looking over their shoulders for approaching footsteps of the Draft Board (there being a small disturbance over in Vietnam at the time). It was taught by an ex-Foreign Service officer who had spent 15 or so years in Vietnam, mostly dealing with the French there. He was brought in to teach despite not having any kind of advanced academic degree because there was no one available in US academia who knew diddly/squat about Southeast Asia!
 
Here in the early 21st century (to misquote Terry Pratchett, apparently the "Century of the Fruitcake") it's easy to forget how little real knowledge about Southeast Asia was being disseminated in the west back in the 1960s, when the Cornellians went 'all in' on Srivijaya.
At Penn State where I was attending, the ONLY course on Southeast Asia was a single upper-level course on Vietnamese History, for which there was considerable interest since most male undergraduates were looking over their shoulders for approaching footsteps of the Draft Board (there being a small disturbance over in Vietnam at the time). It was taught by an ex-Foreign Service officer who had spent 15 or so years in Vietnam, mostly dealing with the French there. He was brought in to teach despite not having any kind of advanced academic degree because there was no one available in US academia who knew diddly/squat about Southeast Asia!

I wonder if Philippine Studies was an exception, since we are part of South-East Asia and we were an American colony.
 
I wonder if Philippine Studies was an exception, since we are part of South-East Asia and we were an American colony.

Up until 1970, at least, which is when I left campus, Penn State's history department was entirely European and American history with one lone professor teaching Classical Greece and Rome and one professor teaching Chinese history. Everything east of Byzantium and west of San Francisco was Historia Incognita.

Everything I knew about the Philippines I learned on my own because my father was stationed there when WWII broke out (he was in Manila on December 8, 1941 when the Japanese bombed Clark Field) and my great-grandfather was drafted to serve in the "Philippine Insurrection" in 1901.
 
Up until 1970, at least, which is when I left campus, Penn State's history department was entirely European and American history with one lone professor teaching Classical Greece and Rome and one professor teaching Chinese history. Everything east of Byzantium and west of San Francisco was Historia Incognita.
That's still more or less the case. When I was researching schools for my master's in history, I found very few that offered anything but American history (and those that did were either out of my price range or required history undergrad degrees, therefore excluding me, so I'm getting one of those master's in American history that I didn't want :crazyeye: ). (Caveat: I was searching for online programs. In-person programs might be better--but I still suspect your options for world history programs are much narrower than American.)
 
That's still more or less the case. When I was researching schools for my master's in history, I found very few that offered anything but American history (and those that did were either out of my price range or required history undergrad degrees, therefore excluding me, so I'm getting one of those master's in American history that I didn't want :crazyeye: ). (Caveat: I was searching for online programs. In-person programs might be better--but I still suspect your options for world history programs are much narrower than American.)

Odd. When I was searching for top master's programs in the US last year they've diversified. When was this?

Speaking of master's, I've would just like to share that I am going to attend a master's program in history later in the year. I've finally reached that goal!
 
Odd. When I was searching for top master's programs in the US last year they've diversified. When was this?
Last year. I started classes last August. Again, I was specifically looking for an online program and I only minored in history in undergrad so both of those facts limited some of my options. I did find a good world history program available online that I really liked, but the school was a little more expensive than I felt comfortable with and was going to take longer than I liked (I'm over 30 and not getting any younger here :p ) so I ultimately compromised the program I really wanted for one that better fit my needs.

Speaking of master's, I've would just like to share that I am going to attend a master's program in history later in the year. I've finally reached that goal!
Congrats!
 
There are a few centers that specialize in Southeast Asia in the US - Cornell, Berkeley (my academic affiliation right now), Wisconsin, Yale, Michigan, Washington, Northern Illinois. When I was at Princeton (before Firaxis), I was one of two - two - specialists in the region in the entire school. It was me, and a historian of the Indian Ocean who spoke Indonesian.

A lot of these institutes were set up with money in the 1960s for that exact reason that @Boris Gudenuf mentions - Vietnam, and so Southeast Asian studies in the US became a political science focused discipline, unlike in, say, Germany, where it has more of a culture/literature feel. This includes the Philippines, by the way! Yes, they were an American colony for a time, but that didn't translate into sufficient academic focus. In many history departments, the region was ignored, largely because access to languages was difficult to find (meaning, too, that many historians of that era only read French, or Dutch). My own discipline, anthropology, was a little better, as the region did produce good scholarship (Geertz, Leach, Siegel, Steedly - including New Guinea, there was much more).

There are now fantastic historians and anthropologists working on the region - Vincent Rafael, for instance, on the Philippines is great; Ann Stoler, etc. Liam Kelley, the author of that post, is a good one, too. Now, too, there are great historians who are also from that region (Thongchai, Rafael, Hierianto, Thak). And Japanese scholarship on the region is good, too (Tanabe, Iishi). But for outsiders (raises hand), access to language training is hard to find, and the languages themselves can be hard.

Wolters - the father of the Srivijaya hypothesis - was great, and his model of "mandala state" is one I love. And one reason why I put that name as one of the name for a policy card.

But history is hard. Chinese and Roman ancient history has long, long records (Vietnamese, too, of course); Khmer and Majapahit less so, and Sukhothai, "Srivijaya," Champa, etc., have very, very little. Records left by travelers (Zhou Daguan, Ibn Battuta) can be vague ("I travelled to an island with a queen..." in Battuta gets appliedto Java, Champa, and the Philippines - Zhou, I should say, is far more detailed, even giving a little TMI on his own personal habits). We have to speculate based on what we have, and Srivijaya (and Sukhothai) become myths that fit too much what people want to see. For scholars of Southeast Asian history as with Southeast Asian states themselves, the desire to have a vast, forgotten empire is a strong one. On one hand, I'm happy to see the region get recognized by Amplitude (or us!), on the other hand what you see on Wikipedia or elsewhere often paints a picture that seems more clear than it really was.

Really spurious links get made, especially in the 60s and before. A reference in Chinese chronicles to "Ai-Lao" in Yunnan gets turned into a great Lao (Tai) empire (possible, but unlikely). An American missionary hears that the word for "Big" in some readings of Chinese is "Dai" and speculates that the word comes from a meeting between Chinese and Thai people (absolute bull****). Others are up for debate. Was Ramkhamhaeng real (in some form)? Was Sukhothai real (yes, but not to the extent that is claimed)? Were the Tasaday real (probably)? Was Srivijaya real (probably not)? And sticking a border around something and putting it in "your" civ puts a false binary onto the world. The Siamese at one point sent tribute to the Ming - does that make them part of the Empire? The Cambodians sent tribute to the Siamese AND the Vietnamese at the same time - where to put them? Lanna, Nan, Vientiane, Luang Prabang - these were all sometimes independent and sometimes vassals. To claim that "X empire = the total of everyone that ever sent tribute to its ruler" simply doesn't hold up.

Again, I quibble with the inclusion of Srivijaya, like I quibble with the inclusion of Sukhothai in Civ (and pushed for Ayutthaya instead in Civ6 as a city-state). Also, I note that their Khmer unit names are in Sanskrit, not ancient Khmer (roughly as if a Norman knight was called eques or something - not wrong in the sense that I'm sure people wrote about knights in Latin in Norman England, but not right either). But I see that word, Srivijaya, and my eyes do light up - someone is paying attention to this region!!
 
Better have these quotes before someone calls out how much we've veered away from the topic!

There are now fantastic historians and anthropologists working on the region - Vincent Rafael, for instance, on the Philippines is great

He studied in where I studied my undergraduate degree (Ateneo de Manila University). I had a minor in history, and I know he's left his mark because he's been talked about and referenced many times in the Philippine history courses I attended. And speaking of which..

Wolters - the father of the Srivijaya hypothesis - was great, and his model of "mandala state" is one I love.

The "mandala" hypothesis has also been mentioned a lot in those courses when we talked about pre-colonial Philippines, and its place in the wider Indianized South-East Asian sphere. It's great that there is increasing recognition towards how complex the region is, and I think that complexity is largely ignored in favour of national histories that are within a, not exactly Western, but more of a modern paradigm. Heck, even Europe had very complex structures prior to the birth of the centralized state (circa Westphalia).
 
Up until 1970, at least, which is when I left campus, Penn State's history department was entirely European and American history with one lone professor teaching Classical Greece and Rome and one professor teaching Chinese history. Everything east of Byzantium and west of San Francisco was Historia Incognita.

This is why area studies programs were created in US universities, starting in the 1950s and 60s, with the support of the Department of Defense, the Ford Foundation, the Social Science Research Council, and many others.
 
This is why area studies programs were created in US universities, starting in the 1950s and 60s, with the support of the Department of Defense, the Ford Foundation, the Social Science Research Council, and many others.

- And the CIA, which produced a pretty good series of basic data books on various areas of the world, covering geography, climate, basic cultures and languages, using both their own assets and also State Department, Department of Defense, and civilian academic specialists.
 

New music track, I love it.
 
Wow! That is phenomenal. The harp and valiha make it so whimsical. Arnaud Roy / FlyByNo definitely has a distinct style, I was a huge fan of the Endless Legend soundtrack, and Humankind is definitely shaping up to have the same sort of charm!

Glad they are still dropping crumbs for us little mice.
 
Humankind has exactly the type of aestethic I feel in my heart when I think of the human history in positive terms such as "progress", "diversity" and "heritage". It is exactly the type of aestethic I think that is worthy of 21st century video games.
 
Chola's a great idea, but Srivijaya is based on flimsy historical evidence, and perhaps the wishful thinking of scholars from my own alma mater (in Southeast Asian studies), Cornell. It perhaps did not exist. See this:

https://leminhkhai.blog/imagining-s...VprSKHTII_B_YyQ9_tyhIph_x0GSPN9Q-xqACsh-cNWJc

Well, there goes the backstory of one of my original characters, a Malay guy originating from Srivijaya in present-day Sumatra. 500s AD maritime SE Asia is a question mark. Is Langkasuka a fictional creation too? What about Funan?

Will Amplitude reveal the last 10 factions soon? Or is the release date for the game being pushed back?
 
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