Humankind Game by Amplitude

[Elhoim]

By "experiencing history" versus "boardgame" , I was not arguing for a rigid simulation. I agree that would be pointless, you're better of watching a documentary there. I was arguing where the focus should lie for a Civ like game. And where Civ6 has gone very far into the "a game needs to have a win condition" route (that is needed for example for multi-player), there is also the "the way is the goal" route. It matters less whether you win in the end, but at least you had fun along the way. You experienced a story! That can be very ahistorical, but you've experienced it.

I hope that my point has become clearer to you now and I still hold that there's quite a reservoir for such players compared to the nirvana for micromanagement maniacs that civilization has become.

Yes, there's also the point that everything in the game has to be a competition. You want your religion to believe in something? Snatch it first! You want a great person? Hope no one gets one before you! etc.

 

[AsH2]

.. the nirvana for micromanagement maniacs that civilization has become.

I would love that, but no; Civ6 is not there. It's built up in layers of concepts but lack depths in gameplay. To me it seems like most enjoy that beeline-phase-gated gameplay and I guess I've stopped hoping for a last expansion that would fix the big issues that prevent an epic game experience, as I've still not summarized my thoughts for a post in https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/share-your-3rd-expansion-design-suggestion.646698/.

 

[bbbt]

It matters less whether you win in the end, but at least you had fun along the way. You experienced a story! That can be very ahistorical, but you've experienced it.

I hope that my point has become clearer to you now and I still hold that there's quite a reservoir for such players compared to the nirvana for micromanagement maniacs that civilization has become.

Well Paradox has certainly proven you can make games that have no victory conditions and serve as historical story telling sandboxes and micromanagement nirvana

I'm not sure I'd count on Amplitude to be the one to liberate you from micromanagement, Endless Legend at least was pretty micro heavy as well.

Have you ever played any of the games from Clarus Victoria? They are much smaller scale (and not really 4x) but are sort of fun historical simulation plus light empire building. The don't really have a long shelf life, but aren't very expensive.

 

[steveg700]

To be frank, all Civ victories have always been optional, and you've always been able to play after the end (unless you were wiped out).

So in singleplayer, you only need to obsess about victory if you want to.

Insomuch as one might use their deck of playing cards as drink coasters, or in the same sense that someone patch a leak in their roof with their chess board.

This incisive revelation does not address the desire for the game to provide a more narrative experience.

 

[Lord Shadow]

Insomuch as one might use their deck of playing cards as drink coasters, or in the same sense that someone patch a leak in their roof with their chess board.

This incisive revelation does not address the desire for the game to provide a more narrative experience.

I would say that in its increasing complexity, even if the additions tend to have a competitive intent, Civ has become a more narrative experience. At the very least in the sense that more elements in play means more depth to the emergent story which unfolds in each playthrough.

Now, what exactly would a "more narrative experience" entail in a sandbox 4X game such as Civilization? Are Amplitude games more narrative purely because each faction has a (fixed) story quest to follow? Are the Paradox games more narrative? How could Crusader Kings II compare to Civilization? Fixed story content and/or random events don't necessarily constitute a narrative experience to me. Or at least, not an experience I consider mandatory for the evolution of this particular game series.

 

[Zaarin]

Are Amplitude games more narrative purely because each faction has a (fixed) story quest to follow?

I'd say the side quests contribute more to making ES2 feel narrative than the faction quests.

 

[God of Kings]

I am hoping that Humankind would appeal to both performers and technicians. Performers tend to roleplay, while technicians tend to find optimal winning strategies. Blind Let's Plays are at the performer end, while 100% completion speedruns are at the technician end.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

On the HK discord the devs said there wouldn't be any new info soon. So get used to waiting I guess.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

On the HK discord the devs said there wouldn't be any new info soon. So get used to waiting I guess.

It's entirely possible that this is our fault.
This single thread is up to 37 pages: that's a lot of commentary, likes, dislikes, and discussion of ways for Humankind to go. If they are serious at all about making a popular (and profitable) game, they have to digest this stuff, discard most, and decide what to do about the interesting parts.

Of course, while they are doing that, we can keep right on discussing . . .

 

[_ViKinG_]

It's entirely possible that this is our fault.
This single thread is up to 37 pages: that's a lot of commentary, likes, dislikes, and discussion of ways for Humankind to go. If they are serious at all about making a popular (and profitable) game, they have to digest this stuff, discard most, and decide what to do about the interesting parts.

Of course, while they are doing that, we can keep right on discussing . . .

Question is, do they even follow this thread. I hope they do.

 

[Trav'ling Canuck]

Question is, do they even follow this thread. I hope they do.

They follow the threads on their own site, and the discussion there hasn't differed too much from the opinions expressed here. A few of us posting the same things in both places kind of helps …

 

[God of Kings]

They follow the threads on their own site, and the discussion there hasn't differed too much from the opinions expressed here. A few of us posting the same things in both places kind of helps …

I believe that Eagle Pursuit is frequenting the official HK forums.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

I believe that Eagle Pursuit is frequenting the official HK forums.

Why not? It only takes a few moments to check up on anything the devs might comment on.

 

[leif erikson]

Why not? It only takes a few moments to check up on anything the devs might comment on.

Thank you for bringing us the latest news!

 

[Catoninetales_Amplitude]

Hey everybody,

I hope you don't mind me, one of the community managers at Amplitude Studios, butting into your discussion.
We just wanted to let you know that we are indeed following your discussion here, and we're very happy to see your interest in our game. We probably would have spoken up much sooner, but as you rightly point out, there was a lot to catch up here (with many points we did not want to simply skim over), and we were already quite occupied with all the feedback on our own platform.

If you have any questions or want some clarification on any topics you've discussed, feel free to ask (though I of course reserve the right to avoid questions that I cannot give an answer to.)
And if the Admins are not against it, I'll try to post links to any future announcements we make in this thread as well.

We hope we can answer many of your questions soon, but some of the topics are not at a stage where we can give a definite answer yet, while with others we are working to find the right way to present the new information in a way suitable to all the platforms where we want to share them.

 

[Kouvb593kdnuewnd]

The only similarties is that they are turn based with somewhat similar theme and thats basically it. So no Humankind is not a civ successor and probably much closer to stuff such as endless legends.

Just because a game have a theme about human civilization and is turn based don't instantly turn it into a civilization clone.

 

[DudewiththeFood]

Not posted in 2 years but I will to say that's a really nice touch to see a dev here.

 

[Trav'ling Canuck]

@Catoninetales_Amplitude

Welcome and thank you for joining us!

I can't speak for the moderators regarding your announcements suggestion, but as a group we're typically in favour of more information, sooner.

Sometimes, obsessively so.

 

[qadams]

Hey everybody,

I hope you don't mind me, one of the community managers at Amplitude Studios, butting into your discussion.
We just wanted to let you know that we are indeed following your discussion here, and we're very happy to see your interest in our game. We probably would have spoken up much sooner, but as you rightly point out, there was a lot to catch up here (with many points we did not want to simply skim over), and we were already quite occupied with all the feedback on our own platform.

If you have any questions or want some clarification on any topics you've discussed, feel free to ask (though I of course reserve the right to avoid questions that I cannot give an answer to.)
And if the Admins are not against it, I'll try to post links to any future announcements we make in this thread as well.

We hope we can answer many of your questions soon, but some of the topics are not at a stage where we can give a definite answer yet, while with others we are working to find the right way to present the new information in a way suitable to all the platforms where we want to share them.

Welcome, Cat'o'Nine! As you can tell, with 36+ pages already in this thread, the group here is eager to learn more about HK, and to get a better idea of the similarities and differences compared to Civ. It's really great you've chosen to share some thoughts with us.

 

[God of Kings]

@Catoninetales_Amplitude

It is great that you have been reading our discussions. There's plenty of great discussions here in CivFanatics. We are just as excited about Humankind as all of you at Amplitude Studios are.