Humiliating Defeat

[Goldfool]

I was playing a game modded to be 1000 turns because I am playing 31 civs on a huge map, all else default, except Americans replaced by Sioux.

Regardless, just wanted to point out that sometimes the scoring is unfair.

As you can see I had the turnaround of my life and I had the former juggernaut (the Sioux) totally dominated.

I suffered a humiliating defeat when time ran out. They would have been gone in a couple turns with a conquest victory going to me, but sadly no.

 

[vmxa]

How is it unfair? You have the same number of turns as they did and came up short. I just finished a conquest game and fell less than 200 points below a civ that I had eliminated long ago.

Funny thi9ng is they once had a score of over 12,000 and after I eliminated them, they had 11900+. At game end they had less than 10,700+ and I had 10,500+. I never knew the score could go down.

 

[Optional]

You deserve no better, playing with a graphic mod like that! Are all those dead Elephants pollution?

But yeah, having played such a long time, it's maddening that the game has to end due to a stupid time limit issue. I empathize completely.
And that's one of the starkest histographs I've ever seen. There are plenty of histographs about where the human player dominates from the beginning, but not many quite like this.

 

[Bartleby]

How is it unfair? You have the same number of turns as they did and came up short. I just finished a conquest game and fell less than 200 points below a civ that I had eliminated long ago.

Funny thi9ng is they once had a score of over 12,000 and after I eliminated them, they had 11900+. At game end they had less than 10,700+ and I had 10,500+. I never knew the score could go down.

The score goes down because it's averaged over the number of turns played.

 

[Goldfool]

You deserve no better, playing with a graphic mod like that! Are all those dead Elephants pollution?

But yeah, having played such a long time, it's maddening that the game has to end due to a stupid time limit issue. I empathize completely.
And that's one of the starkest histographs I've ever seen. There are plenty of histographs about where the human player dominates from the beginning, but not many quite like this.

Yeah, that dead stuff is pollution, I used a lot of nukes.

The histograph, I had to post, as I said it was the greatest turnaround I ever had.

@vmxa

Yeah, I know, maybe unfair was the wrong word to express my disappointment, I understand that the score is an average score over the total number of turns.

 

[vmxa]

Goldfool now your talking, at least you had the satisfaction of the come back. I can feel your pain as I have had a few losses that I was sure were going to be wins. One was due to a bug on the space launch and the other was my first Sid continents game, where I finally was strong enough to take on the top dog.

Only I forgot about culture and killed the nation that was keeping them in culture check. As soon as they were gone I lost. The other game, also Sid I could not launch without a game crash, so I switched to the last wonder and that triggered a wonder loss.

Nothing I could do about the wonder as they would have built it in a few turns anyway, but I could have keep the next the last enemy in the game and waited till I had them both down to OCC or got a domination. I just lost track of the situation.

In both games I still felt good about how I was doing, just not so good about the brain fart.

 

[Taras Bulba]

I think if you kept some of those cities, your score might've gone up quicker..... but I'm not one to speak, because I'm not 100% sure how to get a high score

but usually when one nation grows fast, and another nation shrinks fast, there is a larger switch in score... not just when one nation shrinks

 

[vmxa]

I think if you kept some of those cities, your score might've gone up quicker..... but I'm not one to speak, because I'm not 100% sure how to get a high score

but usually when one nation grows fast, and another nation shrinks fast, there is a larger switch in score... not just when one nation shrinks

You can't keep towns on Sid, they would require about 120-150 units to pacify and could still flip. I try to hold the last couple, but even that often will not work.

In that game I had the last civ (Aztecs) to 3 cities and I held one at size 1 and it flipped. Hittites has about 136K of culture to my maybe 25k. By the time I got the Aztecs to those last towns, they had 131k. Not sure what I had, probably 30k.

 

[Taras Bulba]

You can't keep towns on Sid, they would require about 120-150 units to pacify and could still flip. I try to hold the last couple, but even that often will not work.

In that game I had the last civ (Aztecs) to 3 cities and I held one at size 1 and it flipped. Hittites has about 136K of culture to my maybe 25k. By the time I got the Aztecs to those last towns, they had 131k. Not sure what I had, probably 30k.

oh.... well.......
umm......
dang... I got nothin' to come back with, you shut me up

 

[TheOverseer714]

The culture at Sid is just sick, the AIs can build everything super fast, and they do just that...build everything. And a few hundred units too.

 

[vmxa]

I took a count of the Aztecs before I landed and they had a mere 625 units. I have seen larger stacks than that, but these were mostly Mech's and Tow. Most I have run into is 2,000 Chinese. I wondered if they were stopped by support or by a game limit?

 

[TheOverseer714]

I think there is a hard-coded unit limit, similar to the limit on number of cities. I think most AI tribes build units until they can't afford any more, even at lower levels. In a recent Regent game, I saw an enemy unit which had landed by an undefended city get disbanded before I even had to respond. At Sid, they can afford many more units before that happens, and a large and wealthy civ probably builds until they hit the limit or can't afford more, whichever comes first.

 

[rysingsun]

they build even past that. once they are beyond the limit they lose one unit or structure per turn, but may be able to build 20 to replace it. at least that is the theory. it's unreal how often the one that is disbanded is the one that is about to take a city isn't it?

@vmxa what is a culture loss? how do you get that by building a wonder?

 

[vmxa]

TheOverseer714 the game limit for units 8182. That is for the whole game.

rysingsun a culture loss in a huge map is 160k and twice the next one. They got close as did the Hittites.

A wonder loss occurs when the last wonder is build and you do not have the most wonders. A sure thing at Sid. I had never before see all the wonders build, except at one Chief and one Regent game. I think those games only had Space allowed and Conquest, something like that. They were a long time ago and I got both games from someone posting them on Poly saving they were losing.

They provided the 4000bc and I build all the wonders, because the games were so easy.

 

[Optional]

@vmxa what is a culture loss?

If you lose because a rival has acquired 100K. To win, not only you need 100K, but the nearest rival needs to have less than half of that. If the Hittites were over 100K, you don't want to kill the Aztecs it they have more than half of that...

how do you get that by building a wonder?

Not sure here, but it sounds like Vmxa built a wonder, which made another civ cascade down to another wonder, which triggered a wonder victory for them.

Edit: x-post, and not all of my answer seems to have been right, but what the heck.

 

[vmxa]

Optional what happened was I could not launch due to the bug in the game. So I switched the last part to the only wonder left. Whoops the ended the game as all wonders were completed and the nation with the most wonders wins, not me.

The culture is map specific. In a std map it is 100k and twice the next player, so it could go to any larger value, if two are close in culture.

In a huge map it is 160k. If you make a map larger than huge, the editor has a bug and the map become 100k. So you need to have the map maker fix the culture to whatever size matches the map size. we ran into this in GR23 on a 250x250.

That map should have been 250K. 100x100 is 100k, 160x160 is 160k, so 250, well you get it.

 

[rysingsun]

oops! what i meant to say was "what is a wonder loss"

thanks for the reply though

 

[Bartleby]

Mr. Picky says: in a wonder victory, the civ with the highest histograph score wins when the last wonder is built.

 

[vmxa]

Thanks for the clarification, it was the same nation either way.