Idea for a mod to religion: fundamentalism

[King of Town]

when you went into fundamentalisim you got an extra unit to fight with that was really cheap, and I don't think it had any maintenance cost on it. They were kind of weak, but you could send in like 40 of them and just bash the other cities. They had little torches. Civ 2 thing. I gotta play that now.

 

[Peng Qi]

What were Fanatics?

4/4/1 infantry units that cost 20 shields (as opposed to, for example, Mech Inf which were 6/6/2[3?] and cost a lot more). You could only build them if you were using the Fundamentalism form of government, though.

EDIT: Oh yeah, and you could support 10 free per city as long as you were Fundamentalist.

 

[L4zXX0r]

True, but Free Religion happens way too late in the game to matter in the classical/medieval eras, real-world religious states are not guaranteed to fall into a state of anti-naturalist fundamentalism, secularization of a fundamentalist state often results in a renaissance period, like ours when we exited the dark ages, and in many cases that renaissance is not so much a surging forward as a catching up.

Mostly I dislike how free religion is currently implemented because it doesn't do enough to distinguish secular states from religious ones, and it makes it so religion is always a good thing.

You should make a mod. Also, there is a lot of stuff they COULD do with religions in this game, but they don't for a few reasons. They're afraid of offending people who could buy the game for one, and secondly, it's easier to make it generic. Honestly though, I think any good mod, will tweak religions and civics enough to make things more interesting.

 

[torsoboy]

I see someone else has viewed Neil DeGrasse Tyson's presentation at Beyond Belief.

As for Fundamentalism, it seems to me that the game already does it well enough. If you stay in Theocracy long enough the economic strain will keep you from advancing to the Renaissance for a while longer. As for the collapse of the Arabian scientific hegemony, I suspect the Mongols sacking Baghdad had a lot to do with it. Like getting your science city razed kinda.

 

[Makbeth]

I've said it once, and I'll say it again, bring back fanatics!!!!

Not a bad idea, now that we have the great general system. Fanatics like Bin Laden don't do any fighting themselves, but they train others to do the fighting for them. Kind of like the GGs....

There's gotta be a way to mod it so that a fundamentalist society produces great generals, with the following improvement: For something like 10 gold, they can produce training camps in multiple cities with the state religion before leading a band of troops, so you have primitive but very well trained armies, very good at defending cities. Maybe training camps can be set up so they always result in the "partisan effect" that happens after capturing a city in Civ II.

So Fanatics can be a new GP, sort of like the general, but with the ability to make training camps.

Maybe they can be super-missionaries too (can spread religion to more than one city). Who knows.

Maybe also give them suicide units. Like spies, but they lower the population of a city and reduce it's cultural defense, or something. With chemistry, they become suicide bombers.

This is called feature creep isn't it? But why not? If we're going to mod religion to make it more than just a money-maker, lets do it right.

 

[Makbeth]

Maybe this should be automatic when you have a theocracy, so that it's more of a choice. If we take away tech superiority but give the fundamentalist civ better trained armies and more of a capacity for expansion, it might be a non-tech based strategy for victory. Maybe it can be a new religious civic.

Does anyone ever really use Pacifism? Seems to me that you're either paying so much for your army that you get left behind in tech, or your army is so thin you're begging to be conquered.

 

[Makbeth]

OK, here's my ideas on some features that could go into this. Probably not all, but some.



New religion civic: Fundamentalism

High upkeep

-30% science in all cities with state religion.

+3 happiness in all cities with state religion.

Can train suicide units.

Great generals replaced by Fanatics.

No culture in cities without state religion.

+2 shrine gold for state religion shrine.

Can build State-religion buildings 50% faster, religious wonders 20% faster.

Can train state-religion missionaries without monastery.

-4 diplomacy towards any civ with a different state religion, -2 diplomacy towards any civ without a state religion.

Cannot change religious civics for 20 turns (even with CR wonder)

-80% war weariness, 1+ happiness in all cities while at war


Fanatics:

Can lead troops (like GG)

Can establish 3 training camps in different cities

No cost for units in stack lead by Fanatic


Suicide units:

Invisible to all units

Can destroy buildings (100% success, SU is always consumed) (requires gunpowder)

Can destroy strongest unit defending city (100% success, SU always consumed)

Can disrupt goverment service (city revolts for 2 turns and maintenence for that city increases by 100%, recovers in 10 turns, 50% success, SU always consumed) (requires replaceable parts)

Can detonate nuclear bombs (50% success, SU always consumed) (requires MP wonder to have been built, plus knowledge of fission in at least 5 civs, and 500 gold)

SUs are not affected by espionage points or counterespionage. Chances of success are lowered 25% by security bureaus.


Training camps:

+4 exp for all units produced in cities.

-5% global upgrade cost for obsolete units.

Cities with training camps always produce geurillas when captured (like civII partisans)