If theres no absolute truths....then...

[Pliny The Elder]

*Sigh* My, what are they teaching nowadays in lieu of language and reasoning?
A molecule of water is 2 atoms of oxygen, and 1 atom of hydrogen, at 1 atmosphere of pressure and a temperature between 0 and 100 centigrade, inclusive. That is an example of an absolute truth.
You must be rigorous with both your questions, and definitions.
Rigorously defined, mathematics are by definition truths. Which may have something to do with why science is so concerned with measuring things.

 

[poob]

*Sigh* My, what are they teaching nowadays in lieu of language and reasoning?
A molecule of water is 2 atoms of oxygen, and 1 atom of hydrogen, at 1 atmosphere of pressure and a temperature between 0 and 100 centigrade, inclusive. That is an example of an absolute truth.
You must be rigorous with both your questions, and definitions.
Rigorously defined, mathematics are by definition truths. Which may have something to do with why science is so concerned with measuring things.

Unfortunately your example is not an absolute truth. I will use the same argument as before: The definiton of a water molecule consists of non-absolute definitions. Because we do not really know how or what 1 atom of hydrogen really is. Maybe 1 hydrogen atom consists of more or different elements than we have actually scientifically proved. Proving something scientifically doesn't make it an 100% absolute truth. I grant you that mathematic is by definiton absolute but as I said before it actually has no meaning before applying it to something non-absolute.

We cannot claim anything perceived with our senses to be absolute truth[EDIT: Other than the fact that we did actually perceive something, which could just be ourselves imagining it, i.e. thinking it].

These are the only absolute truths we can define:
1. We can say that because we have a conscience(we think) therefore we must exist in some way or another.
2. Mathematic, like 1+1=2.

 

[Moss]

I think some of you think way too deeply into things.

By some of your reasonings we can't even precieve what truth means because it is just a word we made up...

 

[poob]

I think some of you think way too deeply into things.

Philosophers have a tendency of doing that... Especially when trying to define an absolute truth; it includes excluding everything that can trick our perception, like all your senses can.

 

[Voynich]

The Descartes quote is not necessarily an absolute truth. If humans only consist of matter then it is actually not true since a human being is not an objectively single entity; rather awareness is an illusion. If that were true reason's validity would seriously be called into question. How would a group of physical interactions produce reliable information about what exists? An animal could be considered to have equally valid information to a human.

 

[zurichuk]

*Sigh* My, what are they teaching nowadays in lieu of language and reasoning?
A molecule of water is 2 atoms of oxygen, and 1 atom of hydrogen, at 1 atmosphere of pressure and a temperature between 0 and 100 centigrade, inclusive. That is an example of an absolute truth.
You must be rigorous with both your questions, and definitions.
Rigorously defined, mathematics are by definition truths. Which may have something to do with why science is so concerned with measuring things.

My, what are they teaching?

Are you sure the composition of water is as you say?

 

[Mescalhead]

Excellent poob.

 

[Mescalhead]

The Descartes quote is not necessarily an absolute truth. If humans only consist of matter then it is actually not true since a human being is not an objectively single entity; rather awareness is an illusion.

You are arguing over the ego, awareness at the time in which it is perceived is absolute. No matter what you're nature is, you are aware of being aware.

 

[CurtSibling]

This is what philosofy tells....if so...then couldnt that premise be false and therefore absolute truth exists?

Reality is whatever you imagine it to be.

Just beware of imposing your laws on bystanders.

 

[Pliny The Elder]

Yes, I am sure the composition of water is as I asserted. If you are seriously maintaining that nothing can be empirically known, then you are merely engaging in word games of no value.

 

[Pliny The Elder]

Reality is not merely what you imagine it to be. If you seriously believe that, try to go and breathe some water.

 

[Mescalhead]

Reality is not merely what you imagine it to be. If you seriously believe that, try to go and breathe some water.

Again, you proved what you are trying to disprove. You can only describe the effects of water and name what it is composed of. You can not tell me what water is, only what you know of it. This isn't absolute knowledge.

 

[Pliny The Elder]

You are playing word games, ascribing some mystical qualities to the word "is", and the phrase "absolute knowledge". Define your terms, and meaning will be revealed.

 

[CenturionV]

Reality is whatever you imagine it to be.

Just beware of imposing your laws on bystanders.

What if I imagine reality to be a kingdom with me as rightful ruler, and that imposing my laws on bystanders IS the purpose of the universe, if I imagine it, it is so. According to your logic. And as reality is only what I imagine, what happens if your imagination of reality does not line up with mine, or maybe your implying that the only being we can be totally sure exists is ourselves (I think, therefore I am) i.e. your trying to convince me you don't exist

 

[Revolutionary]

Yes, I am sure the composition of water is as I asserted. If you are seriously maintaining that nothing can be empirically known, then you are merely engaging in word games of no value.

he didn't mean it that way all he was saying is that you mixed up the water atoms, water has 2 hydrogen atoms and 1 oxygen atoms

*Sigh* My, what are they teaching nowadays in lieu of language and reasoning?
A molecule of water is 2 atoms of oxygen, and 1 atom of hydrogen, at 1 atmosphere of pressure and a temperature between 0 and 100 centigrade, inclusive. That is an example of an absolute truth.
You must be rigorous with both your questions, and definitions.
Rigorously defined, mathematics are by definition truths. Which may have something to do with why science is so concerned with measuring things.

 

[Pliny The Elder]

Oops. The dangers of multitasking strikes again. The shame, the shame.

 

[ainwood]

These are the only absolute truths we can define:
1. We can say that because we have a conscience(we think) therefore we must exist in some way or another.
2. Mathematic, like 1+1=2.

If you are defining them, then they are not absolute truths!

And besides, 1 + 1 = 2 doesn't hold for binary.

 

[Mescalhead]

You are playing word games, ascribing some mystical qualities to the word "is", and the phrase "absolute knowledge". Define your terms, and meaning will be revealed.

No one here is stating whether such ideas are paractical, and I have mentioned that the concept of "absolute knowledge" is impractical. What I am stating is that water has no meaning outside of it's observable characteristics. We do not know that all there is to know about water is apparent to us, so our knowledge of it is not absolute.
300 years ago, knowledge of the atomic nature of all matter was not held as an axiom, therefore knowledge of water was not in an absolute form. This phenomenon can extend itself through time, in which we are constantly coming up with more practical and comprehnsive ways of understanding nature while limiting the amount of influence and bias from our minds.
Simply, the human mind should not be understood as having the ability to be objective, since it is nothing more than a condition. A condition is prone to change and therefore so is perception and cognition. I at least believe that at no point does anyone understand objective or absolute reality. The mind can only observe characteristics which take on meaning by contrasting them with other characteristics. Our minds have evolved under a specific set of conditions which have in turn conditioned the ways that our minds operate and comprehend knowledge. Had we evolved under different conditions, we might have drastically different ways of knowing.
I won't even go into metaphysical skepticism since there is no need.

This may help.

 

[Pliny The Elder]

You haven't defined "absolute". That's like saying we can't know catzlfrat about water. It simply has no objective meaning.

 

[Mescalhead]

You haven't defined "absolute". That's like saying we can't know catzlfrat about water. It simply has no objective meaning.

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