I'll Give You One Jerry Falwell and...

[VoodooAce]

We should trade Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson to the Taliban for Osama Bin Laden! <img src="graemlins/yeah.gif" border="0" alt="[Yeah]" />

And maybe a Terrorist, or two, to be named later....

 

[BlueMonday]

That's actually a good idea. I hate Falwell! Did anyone catch him on FoxNews this weekend? What a punk-ass! using F-day as a tool to motivate people behind his prayer in public schools agenda.

 

[Ashoka]

Yeah, well he also blamed the attack on everyone who disagrees with him - feminists, abortion rights supporters, gays & lesbians, and the ACLU.

Sounds like we don't have to go to Afganistan to find our own extremists...

(To be fair, he has not killed anyone AFAIK.)

<br />Ashoka

 

[starlifter]

Like all Americans, Falwell is entitled to his opinions. However, his comments did seem ill-timed and insensitive, and President Bush even chastised him publicaly. The local Seattle news reported today that Falwell made a public apology, BTW.

<br />...<br /> feminists, abortion rights supporters, gays & lesbians, and the ACLU.

Sounds like we don't have to go to Afganistan to find our own extremists...<br /><hr></blockquote>

I'm willing to give those extremist groups you listed a break. <img src="icon12.gif" border="0"> In the face of thousands of dead and wounded, and a nation going to war kind of puts such arguments in perspective. No matter what one's view about those groups (for, against, or even no opinon), at least they are not crashing airliners into buildings.

<br />

 

[Alcibiaties of Athenae]

Originally posted by VoodooAce:<br />We should trade Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson to the Taliban for Osama Bin Laden! <img src="graemlins/yeah.gif" border="0" alt="[Yeah]" />

And maybe a Terrorist, or two, to be named later....<hr></blockquote>Being a fool does not mean that you can equate these men with a murderer.

I don't care for them either, but that is just silly. (as you intended, I'm sure)

 

[amadeus]

Quit giving him the Joe McCarthy treatment - Falwell's a great guy, and when he makes even one mistake, you people jump on him.

 

[allan]

The Aryan Nations folks are more like bin Laden (and they have likewise killed people). Falwell has a LOT of opinions I disagree with, but he ain't a terrorist, nor would he want anyone associated with him to be....

 

[drake]

He is dangerous, make no doubts about that. We need to unite as a country, not point fingers and make accusations. This will only make us weaker, divide us.

Falwell, shut your fat mouth.

 

[duke o' york]

I'll Give You One Jerry Falwell and...

I'll raise you one Louis Farrakhan.

You can't start attacking those who criticise the state just because the country is at war. The right to freedom of speech is at the backbone of the US constitution, whatever the cost may be as people are offended, and to try to stop people making their opinions known is to deny America as it has defined itself. The Land of the Free is an admirable target to set oneself, and however far you consider they have travelled towards this target, the US deserves commendation for the promotion of this ideal. I think that Charlton Heston is an idiot and if I had my way then all kinds of weapon would be made illegal, but I recognise the right of Americans to bear arms if they so choose. We should also therefore accept that people have the right to say whatever they want, however much you may disagree with it. After all, how else would we know who were stupid if they didn't open their mouths and make our minds up for us?

 

[Ashoka]

You can't start attacking those who criticise the state just because the country is at war. <hr></blockquote>

As I recall, Falwell was not criticizing the state. He was trying to make political gain by placing the blame for this attack on people who he disagrees with.

In this respect, he was acting in the same way that radical Islamists do - but was apparently too dense to realize it. I think that's what many of us are criticizing.

Ashoka

 

[duke o' york]

Being a limey I had never heard of Mr Falwell until today, but my point is still valid. He has the right to say whatever he likes under your constitution, no matter how outrageous or offensive it is, and you have the right to think him a complete @sshole for doing so. This seems fair to me.

 

[drake]

No disagreements duke. He can say what he wants, but his words reach millions of people. Linking this atrocity to his agenda against gays, abortion and other moral issues pits people against each other. He's breeding intolerance.

Is it illegal? Naw, not at all.<br />Is it un-american? I'd say it is.

 

[duke o' york]

I know it's not always the case but I hope that this just means that there are now millions of people who think that he's a complete @sshole.

 

[G-Man]

I don't know who this guy is, but he does sound like an @ss hole. Using this disaster to promote your own goals?<br />He sound a lot like Saddam or Muslim extrimist leaders- Americans deserved what you got, because you didn't listen to god. I don't care if this is the Christian god or the Muslim Alla, for me, as someone who don't belong to both religions, it looks the same.

[ September 18, 2001: Message edited by: G-Man ]</p>

 

[VoodooAce]

Nice. Knew we'd get some people defending this guy. He ain't as bad as bin Laden, but he's a bad guy, none the less. Definitely comparable to extremists in Islam. Not all of them have killed people. They get others to do their dirty work by criticizing them publicly, particularly blaming them for times of great hardship.

Also, to any of you who think I shouldn't criticize him: If you've criticized anyone in any of these forums for THEIR opinion, then you are hypocrites.

Lastly, to paraphrase one of our greates patriots, I don't agree with what the jerk says, but I would, in a heart beat, die for his right to say it!

 

[BlueMonday]

Originally posted by rmsharpe:<br /><strong>Quit giving him the Joe McCarthy treatment - Falwell's a great guy, and when he makes even one mistake, you people jump on him.</strong><hr></blockquote>

One Mistake? That's all you think he's made? ONE MISTAKE? Falwell is the most backward nutcase fanatic in America. He is to protestantism what Ayatollah whatever is to Muslims. He's has persistently and mindlessly attacked everything liberal (most of all alternative lifestyles). Jerry Falwell is as close to KKK/neo-nazi as a public figure can get these days.

Falwell is not a great guy. He's a nutcase and a fanatic. He is a very bad man who embodies everything I hate about organized religion. Almost all of his political and religious veiws are completely off the wall and flat out WRONG!

I'm not saying he's an idiot, but he is.

 

[starlifter]

<br />...<br />Falwell is the most backward nutcase fanatic in America. He is to protestantism what Ayatollah whatever is to Muslims. He's has persistently and mindlessly attacked everything liberal (most of all alternative lifestyles). Jerry Falwell is as close to KKK/neo-nazi as a public figure can get these days.<br />...<br /> <hr></blockquote>

Quite an interesting comentary, BM! You may want to phone the FBI hotline, because they are searching for a lot of lesser "nutcase fanatics" right now. <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[LOL]" />

Are you saying the Reverand Falwell is somehow associated with the Ku Klux Klan or neo-Nazis? If so, quick!! Call the FBI and let them know!!! This could be very grave indeed!! "He's a nutcase and a fanatic." They'll listen to you and your calm, cool, collected thoughts while you present your evidence to save the nation from this neo-Nazi "nutcase fanatic"... and maybe invite you in for coffee and doughnuts <img src="icon12.gif" border="0"> .

Anyway, it's quite entertaining to read so many tolerant posts about the general topic of some folk's intolerance of Falwell, LOL <img src="smile.gif" border="0"> .

<br />Almost all of his political and religious veiws are completely off the wall and flat out<br /> WRONG! <br /> <hr></blockquote>

Well actually, you simply disagree with Falwell's views, LOL. Right?

Though I didn't hear Falwell's comments (and don't really know much about him), I presume from what was said in the thread that, for example, he pointed out in some way that a Christian lifestyle is not compatible with homosexuality... as the Bible (and Koran) plainly state. This naturally makes some people uneasy, since the underlying message is true... so the result is to attack the messenger.

In broader terms, this pattern is manifested in a flurry of vocal name-calling and non-sequitor comments. In this case, I'm not saying your comments are untrue... on the contrary, given the gravity of your assertions, you will doubtless work with the Federal authorites to investigate the situation, especially if you've uncovered a radical neo-Nazi backward nutcase fanatic <img src="icon12.gif" border="0"> .

Since Falwell is a Minister (East coast, I think), I'm sure he knows some people won't like the message. But even when a public figure believes his views to be right (as I presume Falwell did), there is a time and place for some things... and this seems like the wrong time for Falwell to be blaming the gays, lesbians, baby-killers, or whatever, since they were not directly responsible for the acts of Sept 11, 2001.

I will go even farther and say with 100% confidence that queers and abortionists did not inspire bin Laden to hate America in the first place... so it is absurd to associate any deviants in America with somehow "causing" or "inspiring" the terrorism we have seen.

And BTW, terrorist acts are certainly not the "will" of the Lord. If the Lord wanted to intervene directly, He certainly would... Soddom and Gomorrah seem to ring a bell somewhere.....

 

[VoodooAce]

Actually, Falwell's point was not that certain lifestyles are not compatible with Christian ideals. His point was that these lifestyles were not compatible with AMERICAN values.

These are two very, very, very different things.

I am an American. A loyal American. Served my country. But I do not believe in God. And the good reverend would have those who hang on his every word believe that I am at least indirectly to blame for this massacre.

 

[allan]

"Nice. Knew we'd get some people defending this guy. He ain't as bad as bin Laden, but he's a bad guy, none the less. Definitely comparable to extremists in Islam."

I wasn't defending the guy per se--I don't agree with what he said. But I just found it offensive that you compare him with the people that bombed the WTC--that belittles their plight, just like gratuitously using the term "Nazi" for any right-wing person (this is a BIG habit of many liberals), or "femi-Nazi" for militant feminists (a habit of Rush Limbaugh), belittles the plight of real Holocaust victims....

Like Mr. Falwell, you all should THINK before you speak....

 

[allan]

That having been said, I DO agree with Voodoo's last post (the one before mine, written the same time so I didn't see it before). We are a diverse nation, not a strictly "Christian" one. As the Dalai Lama says, "it does not matter what religion you believe in, or even if you believe in any religion or not--what matters is whether or not you are a good person." (I paraphrased this quote because I don't have his book with me.) And Falwell slammed many good people, when we need all the good people we can get to pull together in our struggle....