Immortal University 54 - Frederick

Thanks for Replying! :)

I normally warmonger exclusively so it was fun for a change to do something different.
The setup part is fun: the safest for me (on Emperor) is to have many Artists and build Pyramids + Parthenon + Sistine Chapel (if possible one wonder each city) + Religious Buildings + Theaters + National Epic + National Park + Hermitage + Cathedrals; and use as Civics: Representation + Caste System + Free Speech + Mercantilism + (possibly) Pacifism or Free Religion.
Which is about what I was doing in this game... uhm... I might finish it one of these days to see if it works out also in Immortal (I played few other turns yesterday, up to 520AD, save attached: at this point on Emperor I would feel like having a pretty good chance, on Immortal I don't know).
The end-game part it is a bit more boring: if I win this way then I need a couple of months of something more "active" before be really willing to finish another game like this. :lol:

You seem to play more on converting :commerce: into :culture: than me.

Anyways, your is a great game and a nice addition that has the merit to be something different from the majority of the other games: IMO it is cool to have different type of victories from the same map! :goodjob:

yatta.
 
Here it is: Cultural Victory (1858AD)
Spoiler :

Some Tech Robbing, but Justinian by few turns (twice) is first to both Music and Philosophy...



Some more Tech Robbing, first to Education, but arrogantly kept on building Missionaries and Religious buildings instead of Universities...



Result: Lost Liberalism by 1 turn, with a Great Engeneer ready to build the Taj Mahal; Justinian obviously got Nationalism with it, in a Golden Age...



Started a Golden Age as well with a Great Scientist, hurry-hurry to Nationalism, and finally: Taj Mahal, for the longest Golden Age I ever had!



MVT of the game! (Most Valuable Trading)



And... first to Rifling! I shut down the research here: up to 100% culture. The Science Counselor suicides.



Culture machine setup complete.







Kassite flipped. I just disbanded it.



Pangea Map without an Army? With both the tough guys to cover your shoulders...



A little something to anybody, and all the Money to me!



Keeping one eye on culture balance...



Preserving and growing Forests (yes, twice in the future National Park City!)







Biology! Revolution to Universal Suffrage to buy the National Park (the only 2 Forests chops in the whole game were needed to start building... The National Park! Ehm... they were outside the Fat Cross, of course). The Science output now was really a joke (the new Science Counselor suicides as well).



The 12th Great Artist, Virgil, born. Well, too late, it is useless now (from this turn for Hamburg 3 were enough).





Anyways: 4 here, 4 there, and 4 down there... time to Rock!









Oh well, the next one was in 5 turns... but why 99%?



My Legendary Cities.







Who said "nice guys finish last"?






That's it! This Cultural Victory path is definitively easy also playing on Immortal: 4-6 cities, low Population, many Artists, the right synergy of Wonders and Civics, smart enough Diplomacy (the Religion made it even easier), few good Tech Trades...

First attempt, no reload*, no cheating. Second game ever on Immortal level.
*(one session is very short because I had a crush to desktop while playing, but luckily the Auto Save file was in the same turn).

At the end I was even a little disappointed for how easily it worked out: I mean, nobody was even close to the Apollo Program; the AIs speed researching Technologies didn't impress me at all, I was fearing worst than that.

I wonder if this path to victory would work on Deity, and if at that level would be an harder challenge compared to others. But I have no idea what playing on Deity is like... so for now let's just be happy for this first Immortal victory.

Yes, sorry guys for playing the same kind of coward game I played in another thread, just to be able to win: at least this time I didn't get confused counting culture points (and I played way better), but I kind of feel like I should hurry settling 2 more cities and risk trying for a Space Race victory, the leader and the map were good for it.

But, after missing the target in the #53, missing it again would bother a bit. I mean, I'm not obsessed, I accept losing sometimes in SP Civ Games, but I would not be too comfortable with getting in here and losing twice in a row, so I also wished to prove myself I was able to win on Immortal: and discovered it is easily possible also with few cities after all!

Well, at least we have two different approaches to a Cultural Victory in the same thread, which might be interesting (the other Culture Victory, of course, is a lot more a broad victory than mine). I'll try something harder the next time.

Thanks to all for sharing your games and your game knowledge: it is nice to have the opportunity to discuss about the game with competent and friendly people. :)
If I'll have some free time, I'll be back for the next!

Game Save Attached.

Greetings,
yatta.
 
Nicely played! :clap:

Some people think culture victories are boring, but in fact they are often the exact opposite when you are the weakest guy on the map and all you have for defence is diplomacy and prayer :religion:. I quite enjoy culture victories, I must attempt one again soon.

Things to do today: post my Fred game and post another Immortal University game.
 
Nicely played! :clap:
Thanks! Appreciated! :)

I quite enjoy culture victories, I must attempt one again soon.
Uhm... let's do some math... in the turns I build 1/2 Wonder Nihil builds 2 Wonders... I can achieve a Cultural Victory in 1858AD... for Nihil it's gonna be somewhere around 1200AD... yeah... probably earlier...

Btw, both the Culture Victories happened after 300 turns, in 1858AD. :cool:

Greetings,
yatta.
 
Haha! I'm not sure it's possible to win culture that early, but I could be wrong. Looking at my own hall of fame, I have three cultural wins, earliest being 1720AD.
 
I, the host, did indeed play the map, but being a lazy host I never bothered to post a report.

Until now!

Immortal/Normal.

Spoiler :
Settle 1S for more hills. This later reveals that I miss the iron, which turns up in an awwkard spot outside all my cities' BFC. Crap.

The capital is barely food adequate, has mediocre potential as a cottage capital but okay hammers. There is a promising bureau capital site to the north with some food, lots of riverside and floodplains, and gold. We have marble nearby but stone is pretty far away (and a barb city appears there long before I can think of settling it). So, do I play the map rather than the leader and begin longterm plans to move my capital? The hell I do.

No, instead I hatch a hare-brained wonderspam strategy centred on building the Pyramids without stone or the Industrious trait. This is wasteful and risky. Don't do this (although it seems that some other players did the same thing :lol:).

However, I am very confident that I have enough space for the cities I need, so delaying settlers to attempt the 'Mids is a calculated risk, and if my plans fall apart then there is always the plan B, the move the capital to the floodplains plan (although I gave the gold to another city).

Asoka annoys everybody on the map merely by existing, and gets attacked by Gilgamesh in 500BC - even though they are the same religion.

In 475 Berlin gets its first piece of infrastructure.



Pyramids without stone or industrious is always a terrible play, just remember that. :p

Brennus joins in the Asoka-bashing and sets the tone for the rest of the game, pretty much.

The fact that Asoka is everyone's worst enemy (even those of his religion) keeps me safe. I go Hindu along with Justy (and Shaka, as it later turns out), get him to friendly and spam wonders. Everybody else is Buddhist except for Brennus (Judaism). Tech trading is pretty brisk with Justinian, Gilgamesh and Catherine on the map, but the AIs don't seem to trade amongst themselves much. Gilgamesh is cautious forever but since he keeps DoWing Asoka I am safe for now.

I was sort of in the modd for a peaceful game this time around after playing a lot of warlike ones recently, but having Gilgamesh spawn next to me changed my mind. I hate that guy.

1AD snapshot. I added the barb city soon after.



I built a pile of wonders. The capital got 'Mids, Sankore, Great Library, Angkor Wat and Shwedagon Paya. Other cities built the Parthenon, Taj, Sistine Chapel (specifically to give that jerk Gilgamesh a taste of his own medicine and steal his tiles), and even the Mauseleum and Notre Dame! Yep, I was busy.

My hope is to Lib my way to cannon and massacre Gilgamesh, since I'm not overly fond of Gilgamesh. I have found that with settled specialists under rep I can usually win Lib without having to bulb aything, and this game is no different. Unfortunately Catherine messes up my plans by teching Education before I can get Chemistry, so I have to take Military tradition instead. Boo.



A cannon and draft war was more appealing than a mounted one because 1) I failed to unlock the HE from barb hunting making the draft better than conventional war buildup, and 2) Gilgamesh has the Chichen Itza on top of his natural PRO resilience, so cannon would have been nice.

After Lib, I got a little sidetracked, instead of going after Gil. First I went after Economics and surprisingly I won the Great Merchant. Then, upon discovering that there is still plenty of unclaimed land out there, I postpone my war plans since I can expand further peacefully first. My city count rises from 7 to 13 in a short time as I settle a bunch of new cities - two backfill ones on the main continent and a number of overseas colonies. No point in letting anybody else get them, although the costs are pretty crushing until State Property arrives. I manage to win the race to Physics after Justinian traded me Sci Meth.

Meanwhile, everybody has just been fightin relentlessly. Apart from Gil, Brennus and Catherine tag-teaming Asoka in a seemingly endless merry-go-round, Shaka has, of course, been busy as well, DoWing anybody he can reach which means he's been alternating between Brennus and Catherine all game long. Sometimes while he's fighting one of them, the other will join in and dogpile him, but he seems to handle it quite well and even holds onto a few Celtic cities. Gil gets the better of Asoka and eventually caps him after thousands of years of war.

I just expand peacefully some more and mind my own business:



And I end up with more cities than anybody else, and I also unlocked the HE while bringing enlightenment to the local savages and using the for target practice. Better late then never.



There is one little bump in the road though:



Imagine my surprise when a barb HA came charging out of the fog and into my undefended city! :lol: Not to worry, I just recaptured it immediately.

Diversions out of the way, it was time for the main event - it's time to Kill Gil!. I built a load of cannon, drafted riflemen, and got down to business.



Note with pleasure Sumeria's completely crushed borders. The Sistine can be fun.

More importantly, I also invited my good buddy Justinian to join the action.



I was sort of hoping he would provide some sort of distraction for Gil's stack, but he didn't. He did, however, manage to get himself dogpiled by Brennus who was briefly enjoying some respite from the ministrations of Shaka, who in turn was occupied with Catherine again. Shaka then made peace and dogpiled Brennus - yet again.



So there I was kicking the shinola out of Gil in a pretty routine manner, when my wandering Confucian sage noticed something curious and brought it to my attention:



If I didn't know better, I would say that that's a stack of Catherine's troops coming to attack me...

I didn't pay too much attention, as I was busy doing this:



And then:



Yup, apparently I had rebuffed one of Catherine's many impolite demands, and she had decided to punish me for it. Except I had infantry and she sent Grenadiers. So I killed them. And then, amusingly:



Well, that was pretty easy! :lol:

I wiped out Gil, then Asoka. I was now on the brink of winning domination, so I moved to attack Brennus, who as you may remember was fighting Justinian and Shaka, but before I could do anything he capitulated to Justinian.

I was in no mood to betray my friend Justinian (who is a sterling fellow, after all), so I started researching down the Mass Media line for the UN.

Incidentally, this has to be the unhappiest city I have ever seen:


48 unhappy. Impressive.

Not much more to report. I built the UN, and that did the job.




 
- ThePyramids + SistineChapel + Parthenon to get +3:science: +2:culture: +50%:gp: from specialists:
500 :hammers: and 2 Great Engineers

- GreatLibrary to get +2 free specialists + TajMahal for a GoldenAge and even more Artist :gp::
175 :hammers: (with Marble) and a 3rd Great Engineer

- Adding to the mix: Sansoke! AngkorWat! Shwedagon! Mauseleum! NotreDame! just for sport...
Priceless.

Man... you're tha Master! :worship:

yatta.
 
@ NihilZero :
Spoiler :
Except I had infantry and she sent Grenadiers. So I killed them. And then, amusingly
:lol: Priceless!! Nicely done. One of these days I'll get better so I can beat the AI down like you do. GG! :goodjob:
 
- ThePyramids + SistineChapel + Parthenon to get +3:science: +2:culture: +50%:gp: from specialists:
500 :hammers: and 2 Great Engineers

- GreatLibrary to get +2 free specialists + TajMahal for a GoldenAge and even more Artist :gp::
175 :hammers: (with Marble) and a 3rd Great Engineer

- Adding to the mix: Sansoke! AngkorWat! Shwedagon! Mauseleum! NotreDame! just for sport...
Priceless.

Man... you're tha Master! :worship:

yatta.

Spoiler :
I didn't use any Great Engineers to rush wonders, I settled my GEs. I also had marble and got stone in time for all the stone wonders after the Pyramids.

Here are my settled specialists in Berlin near the end of the game:



2 Prophets, 8 Scientists, 2 Engineers and a Merchant.

That doesn't even qualify as a real wonderspam game, although I got a lot of them. Look up some of Obsolete's games, he's the true master of this stuff. He would start with Stonehenge and try to get almost every wonder built in his capital apart from the ones that give Great Artist points (excepting the National Epic), and he'd end up with insane amounts of settled Great People. Pretty awesome stuff, but you need to know what you're doing.


@ Jester Fool
Spoiler :
That Catherine thing was just an example of the stupid things that the AI does sometimes. Sending a little sneak attack stack like that at me was completely pointless, all she achieved was to cap herself. :lol:

Don't worry, you'll get better at Immortal. When I started playing Immortal I got my ass handed to me constantly.
 
I didn't use any Great Engineers to rush wonders, I settled my GEs. I also had marble and got stone in time for all the stone wonders after the Pyramids.
:lol: The first two sentences in my post ^_above_^ were about my game.
I was making some auto-irony comparing our games (trying to make a parody of a well known credit card company commercial :D), also relating to our previous sentences in this thread ;):

Nihil:
No, instead I hatch a hare-brained wonderspam strategy centred on building the Pyramids without stone or the Industrious trait. This is wasteful and risky. Don't do this (although it seems that some other players did the same thing ).
yatta:
Uhm... let's do some math... in the turns I build 1/2 Wonder Nihil builds 2 Wonders... I can achieve a Cultural Victory in 1858AD... for Nihil it's gonna be somewhere around 1200AD... yeah... probably earlier...
---

Btw, the Wonders I was building were needed for my Cultural Victory plan and safe for me to build with the resources I had: I would never attempt more than that, also to don't screw up my high % of Great Artist output. In the capital I had Pyramids and Great Library, so I got in the mix 3 GEs used as said above, and 4 GSs that I used (if I remember correctly):
- 1 to build the Academy;
- 1 to bulb toward Education (but I missed Liberalism anyways) when I already decided to try a :culture: Victory and to go 100% :culture: after Rifling;
- one to start a Golden Age catching up with Nationalism for the TajMahal (I had no other +2Artist:gp: Wonder to build with my GE);
- I settle the last for... +2:culture:points from Sistine Chapel!!! :lol:

The 12 Great Artists (<< this could be the title of a movie :lol:) were used as Culture Bombs in the last turn. I could settle (some of) them in my 3 cities keeping on balancing :culture: output: they would make 14:culture:/turn each (Sistine Chapel); +50%/+150%:culture: (depending on the city, from Hermitage and Cathedrals); and also make some :gold: and some :science: (Representation); but I like too much win my :culture: game with 3 Legendary cities in the same turn and a bunch of little Elvis Presley acting as BackStreet Boys. :p

Look up some of Obsolete's games, he's the true master of this stuff.
where?

When I started playing Immortal I got my ass handed to me constantly.
Good to know. After my Genghis #53 game I think I'll need a while before trying to be aggressive with the AI on Immortal again: so many units, so fast at regenerate itself, so quick to settle back where you just razed...

Greetings.
yatta.
 
Hey all,
im currently playing immortal/fractal games only so i decided to give some university games a go.

First Attempt: Retired in the early BCs after i lost a city to barbs. Pretty strange... i knew that i was delaying horses to my 3rd city outer ring but i thought it was safe on barbs. However out of a sudden an archer/archer/warrior combo on one(!) tile from an area that was very close to Giggles/Justinian border appeared. I never would have expected so much barb activity from there (cant remember if this was GW induced). I lost two fortified warriors to two archers and quit that game...

Second attempt:
Spoiler :

This time i settled the horse/gold/fish as second city to get barb protection early with the result that i did not see any barbs at all. Starting expansion all of a sudden Giggles settled this awesome spot directly into my face (was settled 1800BC):

pic1pe.jpg


What the hell. This was his 3rd city and bazillion of kms away from his capital. Hell i even had a road to this city earlier than he had. This city would have contributed a lot to my research but what can you do... If i would have to name one personal civ4 nemisis for me its definitely Giggles. I always struggle against him and his damn protective gunpowder units. Now i hate him even more in this game. Being philosophical i decided to go for specialist economy with the support of marble boosted wonders. I settled 7 cities peacefully and was starting to crank out specialists. Scientists were used for academy/settle/settle/philo/edu/GA/settle rest or something like that. On the wonderside i got Panthenon, Great Lib, Mausoleum and later Taj.
In the meantime many wars were fought. Giggles and Justinian marched against Asoka who could hold for a very long time. Also Shaka/Cathy/Hannibal were warring against each other. This resulted in a horrible global techrate allowing me to teach head. Land and techsituation at 1AD (man im slow...):

pic2zs.jpg


pic3znh.jpg


And tech at lib, which was never in danger:

pic4c.jpg


I wanted to get military tradition for lib. Hannibal was closing in first and i wasnt able to backfill music so i picked gunpowder and researched military tradition myself. The reason for military tradition was that i wanted to kill Giggles asap. He would cap Asoka soon and his 11 good cities and 10 or so wonders started to kick in. I was able to capture two cities before his AP vote stopped my war. When i think about it again maybe it was best to wait for rifling and cav. Cuirassier vs protective longbows/muskets on hills is close to painful (i had to kill his well promoted stack from the Asoka war, too). Here a screen one turn before rifling and cuirassier to cav upgrade (money came from a great merchant trade mission):

pic5ll.jpg


With superpromoted cavalry i started war against Giggles again. This time it went alot better and soon i got his superwonderwhoring capital and capped him. Asoka broke free during the war and being the whimp he is i capped him in a 1 turn cavalry war :). I checked Justinians army and he had plenty of cannons and grenadiers. Without siege support this would not work. I rebuilt infrastructure and teched towards bombers. With about 25 bombers, 12 fighters which soaked damage first and a bunch of cav i capped Justinian. I went on with germans unique unit + bomber support against cathy and her meanwhile vassals Shaka and Hannibal. Finally achieved diplomatic victory in 1872 for 91000 points:

pic6gb.jpg


Pretty funny game. Three things i kept in mind:

1. I did not build a single cottage throughout the game, only kept the captured ones

2. Optimizing is always worth it. With some micro i think i would have hit lib 3
turns earlier > pick military tradition with lib > earlier war > earlier cap >
snowballomania... you know what i mean :)

3. 12 turn GS induced golden age with university whips and oxford rush resulted in a nice rainassance techrate. The 12 turn Taj GA allowed me to hammer out alot of cuirassiers... and i just wanted to build the Mausoleum for failure gold :)



greetings Knightly
 
Second attempt:
Definitively better than the first! :lol:
Good game! :goodjob:
2. Optimizing is always worth it. With some micro i think i would have hit lib 3
turns earlier > pick military tradition with lib > earlier war > earlier cap >
snowballomania... you know what i mean :)
That's why I like when people posts a couple of City Screen Screen Shots or a save attached. You understand better where their success came from. The full empire view is often not so explicative.

Greetings,
yatta.
 
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