Immortal University XIX - Bismark

[Crusher1]

To 1500 AD

Spoiler :

No pictures this time. Expanded to 9 cities by 1 AD and after writing my tech path went Alpha, Currency, Asthetics, Literature, CoL - finished 100 BC (bulb Philo), up the Liberalism beeline. I ran 4 scientist to fuel my research to alpha at which point I built research to power me to currency, then wealth to power me through Literature. Wonders built have been TGL and TP.

Economy - CE with an early GPF set up with the fish site N/E on the coast (3rd city actually). At 1 AD I had 138 bpt with +gpt. I bulbed philo, paper, education X1, PP and Chemistry. First to Liberalism in 790ish and had about 427 bpt at 1000 AD.

Free tech was Nationalism for drafting and the Taj. Tech path then went up steel to Democracy then to the AL path. Upon completion of the Taj I ran merchants and got a GM to use for upgrades then immediately after that GA I used a GS for another GA and repeated the process.

1st war started in 1240 BC with a massive Maceman/Cannon Army against Jao. I had over 4000 gold before upgrading units. After upgrades I had 22 Maceman and 8 cannons. Completely took out Jao and am moving on to someone else next .

At 1500 AD I have already completed AL and have 1400 bpt. I don't think I'll continue because it's simply a matter of time and I'm too lazy to vassalize the other content or click enter for a space win.

 

[Shurdus]

Ok, time for me to have a go at it.

An open request to any one out there: A long time now have I tried to improve, but I am afraid I hit some glass cealing. I will not progress beyond what I can do right now because apparently I keep making the same mistakes without me knowing it. If any one would be so kind as to give me some feedback on how I am doing and help me cope with the AI, that would be awesome. The AI is a bit overwhelming for me since I have limited experience on immortal.

In return I will update my game frequently, post insights into what I am doing - I maght help a lurker or two and maybe some lower level players visiting this thread - and we might learn from each other in the spirit of this thread.

Ok, on to my game.

Spoiler :

The start is known to all. I moved the settler 1W to claim corn, gold and cow in BFC. Teched Agri -> AH. Started building a worker.

Turn 10 or so, I meet Mansa Musa and have met Joao II a bit before. I can see the Portugese borders, telling me this game will be tight...

turn 13, my worker is completed. I irrigate the corn and build a warrior to help with fogbusting. MM converts to buddhism.

turn 19, corn is farmed, start working on pasture. teching is set to BW since I see no horses in the area I scouted. I wonder if I should grab the gold second but figure I will need workers and an extremely fast REX, paid for by gold + FP cottages. The gold will have to wait for now.

turn 21 -> capital finishes warrior, prod is set to worker. I want to settle my next city and prefer to build a worker then settler. Is this a good idea in general or do I want a settler first and then a worker in this case?

turn 25 -> pasture finishes, I mine the gold next.

turn 27 -> worker #2 finishes, swith to warrior to grow to size 3, as soon as I hit size 3 I switch to settler.

turn 32 -> I meet Stalin.

turn 33 -> BW is in. I spot bronze in a solid location andchoose the wheel next to hook it up.

turn 37 -> my settler nears completion. My two workers build some mines and one was chopping the settler. In the meantime I also switched to slavery. My chop and whip accidentaly fall in the same turn, leaving me with a huge overflow ( I can build my 3rd worker in 1 turn now! )

turn 38 -> My settler is in. I provided some screenshots to show the land. Where should I settle?



An overview of the land in the known world.

An overview with recources on.

My thought is on the plain 1N of the copper. I will have to fight Joao's culture for the sheep but that may not be that bad in this stage of the game as I plan to hit writing soonish. I suspect Joao going for mono because he does that sometimes, leaving me with a cultural advantage. He might however get a oly city close to the sheep. In that case 1N of copper is not a good idea at all.

As for techs, I think after TW mysticism should be next. After that pottery and then writing seem like solid choices to me. What are your thoughts?

Right now I have quite some production because of the bad overflow timing. Should I get a fast 2nd settler and claim some juicy land? I find it hard to decide where to settle as of now. I need to block Joao out somehow, yet the north seems not all that good.

The only thing worth settling in the north seems rather far away and covered in jungle. Yet if I do not move swiftly, Joao might beat me to it and I get blocked in and the game is lost right there. What is a solid planning to follow when I want to settle north and block Joao? Am I right that there is an immediate danger of getting boxed in and that I need the north?

the south and east look solid too, yet I feel I have a nicer window of opportunity in claiming that land. the east I will get regardless, I only need to fogbust that lands in order to prevent barb cities from spawning.

I cannot think of any more questions right now. Comments in general are very much welcome, so if you feel like commenting on my game please be welcome to do so. Those who will have a look at my game and comment I thank you in advance.

 

[zizzeus]

Good start, similar to mine. I settled right on the copper for my second city. Partly by mistake, since I got that settler out before I had finished bronze working. Even if I hadn't though, desert copper is not a particularly good tile on its own, having no food and commerce only from the river. Settling on it gives +2 food, and gives you 2 hammers in the city tile which is nice early game. Plus, it's riverside for the health and future levee, and it's un-pillagable, and it has hill defense if a war breaks out. You can still get the sheep, as I did after building parthenon and sistine in that city. In fact, you can flip that stupid city Joao put there with his free settler.

Third, I would push up north. If you want to be aggressive, go northwest. If not, you can grab a great site northeast on the river (many green tiles, a few hills) and let Joao fill in the space between you and Mansa. Then, you're not likely to get a DOW since Joao won't declare at pleased, and the other two would rather attack their neighbours than you.

-z

 

[JBossch]

540AD-1750AD:

Spoiler :

This game went pretty smoothly and I probably won't finish out the domination win (mostly because I think I'll have to invade the other continent and I'm getting bored). The huge amount of peacefully settled cottage land really started to shine in the medieval age. I used the NE copper/ivory/sugar/2fish spot as an intermediate GS farm (the capital was highly polluted with GA points and I eventually built NE there). After bulbing my way to Lib in about 1200AD and taking Steel, I converted the old GS farm into a draft factory with Globe Theater.

In 1410AD I had whipped enough cannons and drafted enough muskets to attack Joao.

The war went pretty smoothly except Joao vassaled to MM (even though he was pleased/friendly) bringing him into the war. This happens to me all the time and I wish I knew better how to prevent it. Anyway, despite having the sound turned off and not realizing I was at war with MM until he grabbed back Lisbon mad he wasn't too hard to fend off. I took peace after wiping out Portugal and redeclared after the tens turns were up and I had upgraded to rifles:

The highlighted stack is about half of my force, the other is positioned a few tiles NE. I was going to wait for artillery but Stalin attacked MM again so I had to move quickly.

I DoWed Stalin even before completely killing MM because I saw an opportunity to destroy his main SOD.
Here is my main stack with which I intend to wreck Stalin. There is another smaller one in the east:

Stalin is backwards and has no hope of reaching assembly line before I destroy him. I will probably quit here because I fear the continent won't be enough for domination and I don't feel like building a fleet.

Good Luck to everyone still playing and congrats to the winners!

 

[Crusher1]

Is this a good idea in general or do I want a settler first and then a worker in this case?

I'd suggest one of the following:

1. Worker, warriors to 3 pop, settler, settler, worker or settler, worker, settler
2. Worker, warriors to happy cap, worker, settler/s - my preference with no close neighbors.
3. Worker, Chop Worker, Chop Settler

Reasoning behind my suggestions revolve around: when building a settler you want improved tiles to expedite the process. Starting a settler at 3 pop usually entails 2 improved tiles while working on a 3rd or chopping a forest. This gets you earlier sites but slows down the overall rate of expansion in most cases.

Growing to the happy cap first then adding a worker ensures 5 tiles will be improved + you now have 2 workers to chop out subsequent settlers very fast. So although your 1st and 2nd city are out slower your 3rd, 4th, and 5th city will be much faster. Works very well if you don't have close neighbors. This method also offers the greatest speed in tech and gives you more time to scout for ideal city sites.

Choice 3 is very powerful with expansive leaders that start with mining and the timing usually works 2 chops into the 2nd worker with overflow from the 2nd into the settler. Then both workers chop 1x and the settler is complete with 4X forest being used.

These guidelines drastically change with IMP leaders, and even more with IMP leaders with different traits

I'm not in favor of your method because you don't take advantage of the earliest possible chopping by worker, worker, settler. I feel you should either do that or grow bigger with more improved tiles (my normal choice). You have something in between that seems to lack the advantages the others give.

 

[Shurdus]

thanks Crusher1 and zizzeus... (although zizzeus, you may want to use spoilers)

Crusher1, I think I get what you are saying. I fel however that worker worker settler is very unsafe in the beginning since babrs tend to be really in your face on immortal. However, I have taken a mental note of what you are saying - in fact I copied it to a text file on my desktop to look at it later. Right now I messed up my start then, let us see what it brings me.

 

[Tempesta13]

Immortal/Normal part III to 1710 AD

Spoiler :

So i start my golden age - switch civics to free market and theocracy while i keep building cannons and then rifles when i have 20 or so. It's a 12 turn golden age and i wait until towards the end to switch to nationhood. I also got globe built the same time and started drafting as much as i could. Joao had rifles, MM still didn't have replaceable parts or steel. It takes awhile to get the troops, i should have used slavery. I was trying to keep my population up until after the golden age but looking back i should have just whipped and drafted asap. I also overbuild my army which was another mistake. Upgraded to infantry 1 turn before attack. MM got assembly line 1 turn after i did (still without rifling though) and i attack.

His army is in Djenne - maybe 15 grenadiers and some knights and other stuff. This stack will take Gao and destroy his army when he moves onto the hill to counter. Other stack is a 2-1 ratio of infantry/rifles and cannons.

Yep, i overbuilt...

Attacked in 1620, AP comes up in 1625 - have to defy so this means i run 30/40% culture, 0% research for pretty much the whole 75 year war. Finish MM in 1695. Really counting on the hindu shrine to help me recover but it's not there. No wonders or anything...

Empire a few turns later at 1710 AD. Obviously i can eliminate stalin using my left over army from MM. I fell way behind in tech though - i'm hoping all that land will pay off later and i can catch up. Not sure though.

With MM's cities out of revolt, and Stalin's land i'll be quite a bit ahead of Joao in land. Willem might be a culture threat later. Still not sure if i can win this - never been great at late game since i have a habit of not trying to optimize much anymore. Joao dropped down to pleased and won't trade techs for now.

Not really sure the best way to play it now - recover for 10 turns or so then eliminate Stalin - switch to state property? I can probably conquer Willem (especially if he shuts off research for culture) and Hammy and Bull going for domination or UN through vassals. Or i can build up to attack Joao, getting the continent soon enough to have time to raze Willem's cities. Only other option is seeing if i can catch up in tech and just build the spaceship which might be possible. I think i captured Versailles from MM so maybe staying in free market would be better for teching? I'll have to see what my tech looks like when everything's settled from the wars.

Played more to a little after 1800 - only one way left to win.

Spoiler :

Declared on Stalin - took all his cities but 2 and he capitulated to Joao. No way i can catch Joao in tech - him and willem both are out teching me easily - even if i put all cities on wealth/research i can't keep up. Willem built the UN - I have joao's votes so i think if i attack Hammy/Bull and capitulate them i can win UN before Joao or Willem can win the game. I'm about even with Hammy with tech - i think i'll just set all cities to transports, SAMs, artillery, tanks and bombers. I should be able to produce an army to sail over and capitulate them for the win.

 

[Phil725]

Immortal - Epic - 10AD

Playing my first game on immortal. I think I'm actually in a good position, either this is an easier map, or my game just improves when I slow down and think about what I'm doing. Then again I could also get run over later in the game.

Spoiler :

Settled Berlin 1W. I had very good luck with my opening scout, he lived to explore the entire continent, and I think he's still alive even after I stopped caring about him and just hit auto explore. I settled my first city next to the close copper, and quickly got another one out to claim gems and horses. I settled that city right in MM's face. His city already got it's first border pop to claim the resources, but I took a chance with inner ring mechanics, and it ended up working out very well. He chopped and mined the gems and pastured the horses for me before my culture claimed the resources, netting me an extra happy face before IW.

The main set back I had in this game was the AI's not teching alphabet after I went for aesthetics early. I thought that wasn't supposed to happen on immortal. MM ended up getting it ~200BC.

Anyway, I just continued cranking out settlers to claim as much land as possible. Joao ended up settling some annoying spots between my southern and northern cities, but that was more of a result of me not blocking him earlier. The barbs helped me out, settling 2 very good spots, and then defending them with warriors. I'm guessing that's a problem with the WB save, but that helped me out a lot.

I got the GLib built ~100BC, I probably could have waited and got it built in my GP farm, but I took the quicker route of just building it in the capital.

Here's the land at 10AD:

Munich is doing very well in it's culture battle, MM still has Kumbi Saleh with only one border pop. I'm half heartedly trying for the SoZ there since it's surrounded by enemy culture, but the gems and horse are safe. I just got IW a few turns ago, so it will take a while to chop out that jungle, but that's a lot of green later.

I might be able to fit in one more city to the north, and then there's a fill in city on the silver, but that's about it.

Techs:

I'm a little behind (Joao is 1 turn away from alpha, but doesn't have lit) but that's expected with a continent love fest. Stalin is behind since he was at war with MM for a while. Hopefully philo will get me caught up, if not, education is always a pretty sure bet. If that doesn't work, steel will.

The plan is to stay peaceful until cuirassiers. Joao doesn't declare at pleased, I have MM at ~+10, so he's no problem, and Stalin is focused on MM, so this looks to be a game where I'll be defending with 1 warrior per city for a while. A quick cuirassier war should get rid of Joao, after that it will probably be cannons and cuirassiers for the rest of the continent. Maybe I'll get lucky and MM will build the AP, then I could win easily once the Hindus are gone.

 

[PaulisKhan]

This was a nice fun game, thanks TMIT =D

Spoiler :

First game in a long long time where I've used nationalism for drafting.
I used nationalism/slavery/theocracy. My Globe/HE/Military Academy city was averaging almost 2 units per turn!
Normal speed warfare took me some time to get used to again though
The AI teched from grenadiers/trebuchets to infantry/artillary over the course of the war >.< and I wasn't exactly moving slowly.

Towards the end I switched from science to EP, was generating over 3k EP per turn. Can't believe how efficient it is.

Took over my entire continent with cannons and grenadiers(vassaled Joao and Mansa with just a couple of crappy cities so I could backfill my tech tree with spies), wiped out Stalin completely.

My game was complicated a bit by Mansa vassalising to Joao for no particular reason very early on.
Game is running a bit slow now and I have such a massive land lead over the remaining civs I probably won't finish it off.
Definitely fun though =)

 

[Shurdus]

next session, 2480 - 50 BC

Spoiler :

Took Crusher1's advice and used my huge overflow for a next settler. I had grown to size 3 by getting warriors and they fogbusted the south.

Teching was completing the wheel and I picked mysticism next to fight Joao's culture.

I settled ny second city 1N of copper and hooked up the copper. My fast 3rd city went 1SW of sheep in the far south. This way I as sure Joao would net get past my culture there.

After myst I went pottery -> writing. I needed to pay the bills and get a culture building. I grewmy capital back to the happy cap and build axes and spears in the meantime to fogbust my southern tasty land. However I was too late to prevend one barb city from spawning.

I had to make haste to settle the north, so for my 4th city I settled it next to the northern cows, 1SE of it. The next one went to the copper, 2 fish, phants spot. In the meantime I had 3 axes and a spear taking the barb city.

Now I teched alpha and then beelined lit. I traded alpha for math with Mansa, and for fishing + priesthood with Joao. At this time the whole continent went Buddhism and so did I.

When beelining lit I made a mistake I think. I traded Aest around for meditation + masonry + sailing with MM and for IW with Joao. Now I should maybe get the parthenon but I messed up by not paying attention and missed my que to start on it. I have started the GL now and am looking good to get that.

Not lit is in and I picked construction for my next tech. Why?

MM has currency and MC. Getting those to trade will not be a good idea. I could go music but it is very very expensive at this point. The GA will be very useful though...

I have a GS waiting in my capital, I am still pondering on what to do with him. I want an academy but my slider is low all the time. I could settle him, but I feel bulbing might get me back online faster.

So here is an overview of my land. I can get 2 nice cities still and then maybe a fish + silver city and a city claiming the marble. Not bad.

Here is an overview with recources.

Tech situation.

Diplomacy.

Berlin.

Hamburg.

Cologne.

I would like to upload Munich too but imageshack stopped working.

So in contrast to everyone - it seems - I actually have a buddhism love fest. Stalin is the only one who will declare at pleased so I need to keep an eye on him, but I do not have to sleep with one eye open just yet. SO I will settle more cities still, maybe I will scout the north some more and now I can start rebuilding my economy. I will want to trade currency ASAP. What techs should I aim for next?

MC seems a good candidate with me being industrious. Then music for the GA although that may be a waste. I still can bulb with my GS. Ideas?

 

[Phil725]

Immortal - Epic - To 950AD (Lib)

Spoiler :

The first thing I did was finish settling out the continent, I got one more city settled up north, along with the silver to the south (I noticed the fish too late.) I also managed to get a lucky poach on a barb city. Joao was building up a stack next to the city, and I sent an exploring axe and a close city garrison axe to see how the battle went. Sure enough, Joao left a single archer in the barb city. I took it sacrificing one axe for a good city (corn and sheep.)

Other than that I just teched towards lib. I bulbed philo like I planned, founding Taoism. I was able to trade that for civil service and calendar along with some gold and smaller techs. My economy to this point has pretty much been a hybrid of cottages and scientists run for GP points. Because of all the GScis, I figured I could make a small detour on lib. I manually teched off nationalism and compass. Then double bulbed education and bulbed lib, taking MT.

The plan now is to tech off gunpowder while building barracks/stables/spies everywhere, then go for a while with the espionage slider on while building cuirassiers. The Taj is done in 7 turns, and I'll add a second golden age after that. Joao is very big (13 cities,) but he only has ~3 defenders per city despite being at war for a while. He isn't near a counter to cuirassiers either. 2 techs away from pikes, and even those suck at stopping cuirassiers. 20 cuirassiers/20 spies should do it.

The game is won once Joao is gone. I'll double my cities by taking his. MM has only 5 cities (full of wonders and holy cities as usual,) and Stalin is the normal backwards warmonger. The other continent is irrelevant.

Techs:

I have Monopolies on nationalism, education and MT, the three biggest techs ATM. MM finishes drama next turn, I'll trade him education for machinery/feudalism/drama, and I should be all caught up on relevant techs. Stalin has done a very good job slowing the tech pace. He's been at war with both Joao and MM for almost the entire game, leading to a big stale mate that only helps me.

 

[Tempesta13]

Tried to finish really fast yesterday - didn't work out too well so will probably replay from 1810 later and should be able to get a win fairly easily:

Spoiler :

Was going for a UN win by capitulating Hammy - while building up troops and almost ready to attack i find i'm only 20 votes or so short of victory as is. Sitting Bull has no friends and only 3 cities. If i take his cities earlier maybe i win this vote.

So i eliminate Sitting Bull with 100x more troops than i need (panzers, SAMs, artillery, bombers, infantry vs rifles in 3 coastal cities... Vote comes up and Joao is no longer voting for me. Realize i can switch him into Hereditary Rule for about 2 turns of espionage points even though he has about 20x more points on me than i do on him.

I founded Mining Inc but i think Sushi is still open. I think at this point i might still be short of votes so i'd have to attack Hammy to win. Willem isn't really going culture, Joao would land his ship before that so it's not an issue. Joao was about 1/2 done with the ship around 1850 so i probably could still pull off the UN win before that but i'd rather replay - i was playing very fast, just building a lot of troops expecting to win UN vote.

So replaying i'll try and get a merchant for Sushi if it's open, also get mining as well if i can. I'll attack sitting bull around 1830, switch Joao into HR for civic bonus, and i might be able to win 1840ish. I never use espionage really but i know everyone says it's strong.

Couple questions about it - how many diplo penalties will i likely get from Joao if i keep trying to steel techs, switch civics etc? With shared civic bonus i think i can spare 2 or 3 points. It only cost me 700 EP to switch his civics - he has 12,000 on me or something like that. This seems very wrong - couldn't the AI switch my civics almost every turn if it wanted? Seems like if the AI was programmed to use its EPs efficiently it could completely wreck the player.

Anyway this should end up in an easy win despite the tech situation (with a reload though). I feel macro decisions late game change the game so much i'd rather reload and play out the "better" strategy than barely win, or lose - in a much longer game. Another macro play i'd like back is attacking MM instead of Joao - i think i would have been better off with Joao's land. Culture killed me this game - if i capitulated/eliminated Joao, then capitulated MM later i'd be safe from all that culture and actually have tiles to work - then maybe i could have competed with Willem in tech.

I should have used pacifism early on this game - don't know why i didn't. Not getting scientist 2-3 early enough cost me lib and slowed me down a lot. I need to go back and re-learn how to farm GPs or something.

Hopefully i'll finish this tonight (with a win) - and correct a lot of my play mistakes for the next one. It'll probably be a harder map (hopefully without mansa/willem though) but if i fix some stuff i should start having better games at this level. I need work on my tech rate (more cottages? oxford in 1000 instead of 1200? civics?) since it seems i'm 25% or more down on most players in this area.

 

[Shurdus]

50bc till 1705 victory

Spoiler :

After construction was in, I traded it for metal casting with monotheism and literature to Joao.

Spoiler :

Then I part researched currency and traded for construction.

Spoiler :

With Sweydagon Paya build in my capitol I switched to organised religion because I now had metal casting and lots and lots of buildings to build.

After currency I went for CoL. With CoL in I bulbed Philo and founded taoism. I had no intention of ever making that a dominant religion so I spread that one only to some cities that could profit from another monastary.

Stalin demanded I would stop trading with MM. I told him off since MM is a worthy asset... I mean ally and Stalin is a goofball, a douche and more such things.

After this I got sloppy with both logging and taking screenshots. I teched CS and then beelined Lib. I got ther first and picked nationalism for the Taj. I got that one too, then I traded around some techs so that I got to banking + astronomy asap.

I teched economy when MM was doing this as well because I tried to overtake him for the GM but I failed by a hair. MM was in a war with Stalin though so I had a chance his research would slip.

At optics I build a few ships and circumnavigated the globe. I met Sb, Willem and Hammu. They were all pretty much neutral towards each other and way backwards.

At this point, since my entire continent was friendly with me except for Stalin who had a low population I decided to go for a UN win. 1st in pop waas Hammu but I was more popular around the globe. I teched scientific method and biology, then pretty much beelined mass media. I go the un and build tons of wonders in the meantime... Industrious.

In the end Willem abstained once, making me miss the vote. I had spies underway but a second vote - after making a very favorable trade for him - he voted for me, resulting in...

Spoiler :

My first ever immortal win! Beer on me!

In my entire game I did not see war once except when taking a barb city. The rest of the game went peachy when I quickly befriended MM aka tech whore. Every now and then I traded with Joao as well, and we got friendly soon enough. Then we really took off. I build so many cottages this game... It is not that common for me to do so, but they proved to be very usefull indeed. Since I was diplomatically save I hardly needed units and the game was a breeze after a tightly contested race for lib.

 

[zizzeus]

1000AD - 1240AD (DoW on Joao)

Spoiler :

The turnset started with a Golden Age from the Taj and a switch into theocracy, slavery, merc. I was running Rep, Bureau, Caste, Decent, Pacifism. Then a visit from Willem overseas:



He's no farther along the tech tree than MM and Joao, so I could delay liberalism until Assembly Line if I want. This is always nice to hear!



I made this trade with Willem - everyone had engineering already anyway. His trading limit is pretty high, and I haven't met anyone else on the other continent yet (I'm purposely ignoring them to avoid trade penalties) The best thing about the deal is his map! I may circumnavigate without building a boat. I could trade Mansa something for gunpowder to speed things up, but it's only 4 turns to research myself (on Epic) and a quick look at his time to research chemistry shows me that I'm teching almost twice as fast as him. So with his Immortal trade bonuses, it doesn't make sense.



I decided to take rifling with liberalism in 1120AD instead of waiting. This golden age (and the next one I'll get from the Economics merchant) is a good time to switch into troop building civics and I need some of Joao's land since he's starting to cottage it up. I whipped the rest of the universities and theatres I need, and chopped the Globe and Oxford while building maces in the other cities. In retrospect, I should have used the 2xfish city for the Globe, but it was short on production and I wanted it built quickly. I burned a merchant in MM's capital, but only got 1950 gold for him. Whatever, I'm not sending him around the world for 400 gold more. That's enough gold to upgrade the CRII maces to rifles. With those, I won't need much siege. I also started on spies, 3 for each of the two first cities I'll attack. I decided to go with two stacks, cutting Joao's empire in half and then pushing to the extremes. I'll take his capital with the southern stack, second city.



Here's my southern stack - a bit low on siege although 4 more are on their way. Doesn't matter, CRII rifles against longbows don't need siege if you knock out the defenses with spies. For further cities I'll give the siege accuracy since it won't be fighting directly. Joao hasn't been in a war either so his troops have few promotions. You can spot my northern stack up on the jungle near Munich. It's about the same size.



I drafted everywhere through the second golden age. I had so much happiness I didn't even need to use the culture slider, although I screwed up in one city: I drafted, expecting 1 unhappy but slaving a temple in the same turn, and it fell below my fifth city population, so it lost the representation +3 happy bonus. Now it was starving with no workers to work food, so I needed to use the culture slider to grow it back to fifth place. Not sure why it doesn't get the bonus, it was tied with 4 other cities but clearly needed the happiness more. I wish the governor was smarter than that, but it's something to be careful when running representation. Near the end of the GA, I would draft at pop 6, then whip whatever I was building, since you can't draft below 6. Slaving first will not work. Final free civic change was back to Bureaucracy, caste, free market (mostly with mansa) and Org Religion. I need temples, banks, and levees so it makes sense. A few cities without the religion yet as well.

Power increase from drafting, slow building trebs:



Tech situation (no problems for awhile)



The save:

View attachment Immortal Student Zizzeus AD-1240.CivBeyondSwordSave

 

[ungy]

normal to 875 :

Spoiler :

I can't really get into this one. I didn't edit the WB so the barbs started nerfed and they're (or would have been a factor in this game--although I did get the copper hooked up in time). I grab the copper/sheep, Joao goes WHEOOHRN and I think maybe this will be interesting but he goes for Mansa.
So we've got a huge start with the AI squabbling...I don't play particularly well but this one will be overkill so I'll not finish it.

 

[Phil725]

Immortal - Epic - 1595 AP victory.

Spoiler :

Everything went pretty much like I planned before. I got the Taj built and used the golden ages to build up my army. I went all out on the EP slider while building spies in the north and cuirassiers in the south.

Not a huge army, but I have plenty of reinforcements, Berlin was cranking out a cuirassier every two turns.

I took the two sandwich cities that he settled on the first turn of the war and then moved on to his capital. Joao managed to get a solid stack together to slow me down. Unfortunately for him, he left it on flat land next to my stack. After picking that apart, I moved on to start taking some cities. Lisbon was very nice:

6 settled GGs. That's 17 exp cuirassiers out of the box. Definitely the best city to put the HE in. Joao also built the AP, which shortens this game by ~250 years.

From there it's pretty much clean up. I split my stack, one half took the cities along MM's borders while another went down to take out his tundra cities that he slipped past my early block. After a long and grueling war, I finally converged my troops to take out the south western peninsula and finish Joao off. In the second to last city I took I found a little surprise:

That would explain why I'm at 30% culture with theaters everywhere and still getting choked by WW. Anyway, I use the last of my EP to revolt his last city and wipe him out.

And his land:

Almost 200 years for a cuirassier rush isn't great, but all that land pretty much clinches the game. Joao's land didn't help too much though. Lisbon was nice for some veteran units, but the rest of the land didn't have time to become productive.

I had planned to take a while and consolidate my winnings, but MM forced my hand. He already had one of the techs to stop cuirassiers/cavs (democracy) and he was researching the other (rifling.) His capital was still under siege from Stalin, and his other 3 cities weren't too heavily guarded either though, so my army was more than enough.

This was the opposite of a long and grueling war. I moved first turn, took Walata second turn. Moved on the 3rd and 4th turn, and took Timbuktu with minimal losses and capped him on the 5th.

Timbuktu was tempting, but after capping MM I gave him his cities back, not like I need them.

I think Stalin being at war with him made him even more willing to cap then he normally is.

My original plan was to just wipe out the continent and win with someone from the other continent's help (probably Will,) but MM made it easy for me by going FR. I figured all I had to do was wipe out Stalin, send a few missionaries out and that was it. Turns out I didn't even have to do that. I have almost enough votes to win even going against Stalin, and MM pushes me over the top. I got a few missionaries out, gifting one to Hammy since he was in theology, and just wait.

Sure enough, the option pops up later, and that's it.

Overall, a very easy game. That surprised me a little, Will and Hammy both get a lot of cities, and Joao and MM buddy up in most games to be hard to keep up with in tech. Joao is also one of the least fun AI's to start next to. Grabbing a lot of the land to the north and using Stalin to your benefit are the keys it seems. On another note, SB got royally screwed on starting position, I didn't even meet him until I sent my missionaries out, I figured he got wiped out early and I missed it.

And the score:

200 points off my being my highest score ever. Ironically my two highest scores are my first games on emperor and immortal. Maybe I'll try the Shaka game next, the difficulty warnings led me to this one first.

 

[Tempesta13]

Immortal/Normal to 1882 (UN victory)

Spoiler :

I replayed the last 70 years and still had trouble winning but ended up (barely) winning the UN vote here. Joao was 2 parts from launching and had all the techs i believe.

Joao and I took out Sitting Bull awhile ago. +1 military struggle didn't stick though. I thought this wouldn't be enough for UN win so i had switched over to AP victory attempt but couldn't get it to work. I switched to hereditary rule and free religion, used spies to switch Joao as well so he no longer was hindu and i'd run unopposed (well, vs stalin). Problem is i was only +8 with him without religion. I couldn't get fair trades up since i hadn't traded techs with him in a long time. I had -2 declared on our friends, -2 close borders and -1 spies causing trouble. Anyway i was 1 point short, so i give up on AP victory and switched him back to theocracy and he was up to friendly.

Thought i needed to attack Hammy to get the population to win - i was almost there and ready to attack when this vote popped up and i won - i would have plenty of time to win a UN vote after taking Hammy's land before Joao could land his ship anyway. Pretty sloppy win. Mansa and Stalin's land didn't help me much at all - attacking Joao instead probably would have given me the whole continent and a much easier game. I always play really sloppy late game anyway which didn't help. Since this was an easy map and i still barely won i need to play much better in the next IU most likely - i think i already know a few ways to improve on this game so i might be ok. We'll see...

Here's the victory screen and my current army ready to attack Hammy that i built for nothing.

 

[zizzeus]

to 1385AD

Spoiler :

I haven't had much time to play lately, but tonight I squeezed some wars in. Declared on Joao with two stacks of rifles/trebs and quickly got my 1st GG and unlocked the Heroic Epic. Both went into Hamburg (copper/FP city west of Berlin).

I quickly took his cities between Mansa and myself, and his main stack came to Oporto 1 turn too late. He then suicided it on Oporto's new defenses. That was nice, since it gave me enough experience for a medic. I had used all my 5-promo troops for city raider. Rifles are slow to march, but I had lots of infrastructure to build so I wasn't in a hurry. Soon, I had this option:



No thanks, I want a few more cities, and I need to ease the cultural pressure on Lisbon. Made these trades along the way





Would like Statue of Liberty in the capital since I'm still in Rep. but it isn't really necessary, and I could probably build 8 cavalry in that time. After taking Joao's second capital:



I stopped here without accepting. My computer is getting slow and I need to reboot anyway, but I would like all of his cities for myself. He'll be a useless vassal now for teching and war, and although we'll be friends pretty quickly (I haven't razed anything, same religion, etc.) I think he may delay my domination victory. I can't wait much longer to go after Mansa though, since he's one tech from both rifling and steel. Knowing him he won't take either until he has electricity, but even still I'd like to move the armies north. I'll take peace with Joao, but no capitulation so I can stomp him later with cavalry when I need that extra 3%. He'll probably vassal to Mansa the next turn, but I won't need much to defend against him.

Power graph: too bad I can't see Joao anymore but I spent all my spy points revolting cities. He tumbled pretty fast.



Tech



Willem has a hill right beside his capital. I've started building drydocks in the port cities, and will crank out galleons during the MM/Stalin wars. No need for combustion, I'll turn the tech off after communism. I can finish this with cannons/rifles/cavalry. With the spy from communism, I just need one GP to get the second golden age.

Save:
View attachment Immortal Student Zizzeus AD-1385.CivBeyondSwordSave

 

[zizzeus]

to 1700AD (Domination win)

Spoiler :

I took peace with Joao for one of his cities, but did not vassal him since I want to take his cities later. I will finish him off once I've set sail for the other continent. To my surprise, he didn't vassal to anyone else.

Then I moved the stack up towards Mansa. I had made a second cavalry stack once I secured horses, and sent them up the east coast with spies. I made this deal just before declaring on him. I don't really need democracy, but he's my only chance to trade for it. A few turns later, and Timbuktu was mine.




I culture bombed it as soon as possible, since it had the Hindu shrine and I needed money. Also, to expand into Stalin's borders as well. The cavalry swept across his smaller cities, and he quickly capitulated to me with two cities left.



I opted for a vassal since he still has some tech I can pick up on the way to assembly line. Once there, I will turn teching off and run culture/gold for upgrades.



Regrouped and declared on Stalin on two fronts. He was fielding maces/longbows, so I didn't even need siege/spies. I finally met Hammurabi, and he joined the fight against Stalin. (note that Mansa is almost back to Friendly):



During all this war, I was building galleons/SoLs in my three eastern coastal cities. I sent the troops to the coast, healed, upgraded, and set sail for Babylon. I decided to leave Willem alone since he has assembly line now, and I certainly don't need his land for a domination win. He's pretty far away from cultural, which is where he's going based on his tech rate.



I finished Joao off, and was taking a city/turn from Babylon. His land was perfect for invasion. The infantry/artillery stack went up the middle through the hills, and two cavalry divisions swept along the coast. One had ships to knock down defenses, and the other used spies. Hammurabi didn't have rifles yet, so the battles went quite quickly. I was hoping to finish in the 1600's, but my greed for more population took over and he didn't capitulate until 1695, putting me over the limit.




The next turn:



Score - not a bad game, a bit easy based on opponents.



I think my success was due mostly to bribing Stalin into war with Mansa very early. That ensure two things: that Mansa stopped teching and built some units to stay alive, and that Stalin didn't overpower him with shear numbers. That stalemate allowed me to shoot away in tech, taking rifling with lib and drafting enough to take the continent with minimal losses. The fact that noone vassaled on the other continent was bonus.

Hope this helped some people learn the level, although my experience is that it's usually a bit harder than this game.

Z

 

[PaulisKhan]

Time for the next map TMIT!