In what order do you promote your heroes?

[cabbagemeister]

I've been waffling for a while over the best way to promote my (non-Arcane) heroes. Ideally they will eventually get all of the important promotions, but the way to spend the first 9 or so free promotions is the real question. Here are the issues I've been struggling with:

Should I start with Combat I-V, or should I throw Shock in there?

If my hero has only one move, should I give him Mobility before he gets to Combat V?

After they get Combat I-V, should I give them Heroic Strength, or City Raider?

At what point should I go down the Drill line to get Blitz?

When should I give them Heroic Defense? What about Cover?

Which of the less-useful promotions (like Woodsman, Hill Defense, Scourge, Demon Slaying, Magic Resistance, Bounty Hunter) is worth investing in first?

Unitcombat-specific questions:
Melee/Disciple--when should I give the hero March?
Recon/Mounted--when should I give the hero Mobility II?


Obviously a lot of the answers to these questions should be based on the situation (Scourge is good against the Malakim, Cover against the elves, etc), but I'm wondering if people have general rules-of-thumb that they'd like to share.

 

[civ_king]

Combat 1-3 Drill 1-4 (blitz) Combat 4-5,
Combat 1-3 gets it strong, Drill 1-4 makes it hard to kill, Mobility-Blitz, ad then Combat 4&5 to make it invincible, top with whatever you feel like

 

[Zechnophobe]

Depends, of course. Melee hero's (Bambur) I usually get speed effects first (Combat 3 + march, Mobility 1) so that they can use them to get even more xp.
A hero like Alazkan goes straight down the drill line, because he's a monster. Most horse based heros I do the same with, but it depends on if they NEED the combat to start actually kicking butt.

Mages generally get combat + spell sphere of choice. Depends on mana available though. Getting Enchantment 3 in addition to other spheres is often better than combat 3.

 

[TheGreatSteve]

Combat III first, almost always. Minimizes the risk of... accidents...
For 1 move hero's probably Mobility so I can harass stacks or just get across my empire faster.
After that, depends on the situation. Cover and City Raider if he's cracking cities, straight combat with march if I'm fighting in a field, down the drill line if he's overpowering enemies.

 

[Luckmann]

That's hard. I'd say that I go Combat & Drill first, but I also tend to take Woodsman I & II early, for my Alazkan the Assassin. Then Blitz and Mobility, followed by Flanking if at all possible to cramp in.

 

[Monkeyfinger]

Chalid gets mobility, full combat line, march, full drill line, blitz, full law line, full command line.

Yvain and sphener get mobility, their full spell line (life for Sphener, Nature for Yvain), combat 1-3, march, combat 4-5, commando, command line.

Archmage heroes get either full fire line or full entropy line (never both), mobility, full combat line, twincast, full spell extension line, full enchantment line

Mounted and recon heroes get full drill line, blitz, full combat line, full mobility line, then specialist promos like formation, cover, shock, etc. usually in that order.

Melee heroes get mobility, combat 1-3, march, combat 4-5, commando, specialist promos starting with city raider.

Archery heroes get mobility, full drill line, blitz, defensive strike-boosting promos, combat line, march, commando.

 

[nealhunt]

Depends

For melee, usually Combat V, Heroic Str/Def. I find that going for the mobility/blitz too early is a waste because a lot of the time the hero takes enough damage that it can't attack a second time without real risk.

I've also taken to promoting my melee heroes to Guardsman. With the reduced chance of defending from Hero offsetting the higher chance from Guardsman, they don't become suicidal like other Guardsman units. They do, however, effectively guard against Assassins. In that case, Combat 4, Guardsman, Combat V, Heroic Def, Drill.

For Disciple heroes (and Druids), Command I-III, then Combat promos. Nothing like having an 80% chance to gain a unit on every attack. Spell spheres occasionally before that (e.g. for Druid terraforming), but usually not.

 

[westamastaflash]

Once you hit combat 3 your unit will survive better against anything that isn't immune to first strikes by getting drill 1-4 instead of more combat. then i like to get combat 4 and 5. if needed, mobility earlier so blitz will be useful.

 

[Guybrush!]

I generally get combat 4, then drills, then blitz if the hero has more than one movement, mobility then blitz if not, then strength five and heroic attack / defense if I don't need to siege cities at the time, Raider if I do.

 

[Zechnophobe]

Once you hit combat 3 your unit will survive better against anything that isn't immune to first strikes by getting drill 1-4 instead of more combat. then i like to get combat 4 and 5. if needed, mobility earlier so blitz will be useful.

That's not true at all. Combat 3 or not, the point at which you be getting drill for survivability is at a percentage stronger than the opponent, not a certain number of combat upgrades. Warrior with combat 3 and drill one loses to an axeman more often then a warrior with combat 4.

 

[cIV_khanh93]

he said unit, but the discussion was about heroes. assuming tech parity, his statement (using hero instead of unit) is correct.

 

[Demus]

depends on the hero. If the hero's base strenght is at the same level/slightly higher as the normal units around, i'll go combat first. If the hero is of clearly higher strenght (dragons, magnadine if rushed, some religious hero's), ill go drill first. Horse heroes generally get drill, since they benefit more from blitz, and can't get march. Melee heroes commonly go march first, unless i've got priests with heal (or a hero like sphener) in the stack.
Since most move 1 heroes aren't that higher in base strenght than the normal tier units at that stage of the game, i don't often start with giving them mobility: they're not strong enough to rush in un-escorted yet, and the escort will most likely be move 1 as well (move 2 if there's an adept involved).

 

[Kenjister]

Usually I go up to Heroic Str. II right away, since if you have a high base strength you don't have to heal to get the good odds. If the Hero can get March, that usually comes in as soon as I can get it though. Then it's down the Drill line, unless he has 1 move, then I get Moblity. Once you get Blitz you're unstoppable. The counters come last as they only delay Heroic Str and the Drill line.

 

[Humakty]

On weak/early heroes, like Rantine, I like to give them the counter promotions to ensure they get good odds even against champions and the like. What good is blitz if you've got 70% chance of winning, as you'll probably won't be able to attack a second time IF you survive ?

 

[TheGreatSteve]

Well, at the point, I give them the special "Disband" promotion. It's effect? Allow the building of the Shrine of the Champion.

 

[Humakty]

Well, if I skip drill+ blitz (ie : with Rantine), I am usually sure he can crush any high tier (but non national ones, like chariots and champions) unit. So why would I disband him ? If he dies because of bad luck, well, too bad...

 

[KingOfLands]

Lately I've been giving early-game heroes like Bambur the Guardsman promotion once they're becoming obsolete due to tech. It lets me turn them into escorts for my squishier units.

As far as a general order, early-game melee heroes get combat 3, then march, then whichever promotions of shock, drill, cover, and mobility look most useful at the time. Except Saverous; he gets fear before any of those. Valin (or Rosier, if I get back to playing AV any time soon) would get combat 2 or 3 then start Drill. More powerful heroes (Eurabatres for example) can go direct to drill.

Gibbon, Hemah and Govannon I tend to use as bonus archmages. I know that's the wrong way to use Govannon but I find the tutoring thing sort of useless owing to a habit of my army consisting of a commando force and a lot of defenses, so that's how I do it.

 

[JonathanStrange]

I've significant experience with only a few heroes though by now I think I've played 18 civilizations and used all their heroes at some point.

Still, I've used the Elven Archery Hero Gilden Silveric the most; he is an early hero and stronger than most of his potential enemies. Gilden's often forced to fight off multiple attacks per turn and then to make his own attack the following.

In his case, I like the Drill line in order to get as many first strikes as possible because it enables him to make kills with little or no damage to himself. That's important when an enemy stack is trying to take him out through shear numbers.

When choosing a promotion I try to consider the Hero's strength, his enemy's strengths, and his role. So I like to use Combat promotions for Melee units, Mobility for Recon, Withdrawal for Mounted, etc.

Kythiel, a mounted Horse Archer Hero, usually arrives mid-game when there are lots of stronger regular units but virtually none as fast so I give him the Flanking promotions so he can make quick pillaging raids into deep into enemy territory and withdraw from multiple combats. So the mission (Raiding) and hero strength (moderate) fits well with increased ability to run away.

Yvain, a Treant-type Hero, arrives mid-to-late game, and he's a real powerhouse melee-wise and magic-wise, but he's slow: I start with Mobility, then increase his magics with spell promotions (dude's real vital for improving terrain for Elven nations). If I risk him in combat 'cause he is a tough sob, then I'd go for Combat promotions and the Command promotions (though that's fun more than crucial, who doesn't like to get a free unit?)

If I'm ever in doubt, I go with the Hero's probable mission, who he'd likely face accomplishing it, and go from there. Not much help? We get what we pay for...

 

[popejubal]

In his case, I like the Drill line in order to get as many first strikes as possible because it enables him to make kills with little or no damage to himself. That's important when an enemy stack is trying to take him out through shear numbers.

and after enough drill, you can get Blitz without needing Orthus's Axe. That means another unit can hold the Axe to get a little more Blitz lovin'.

Yvain, a Treant-type Hero, arrives mid-to-late game, and he's a real powerhouse melee-wise and magic-wise, but he's slow: I start with Mobility, then increase his magics with spell promotions (dude's real vital for improving terrain for Elven nations). If I risk him in combat 'cause he is a tough sob, then I'd go for Combat promotions and the Command promotions (though that's fun more than crucial, who doesn't like to get a free unit?)

I don't like putting Yvain into combat just because he takes so very long to heal. He can't March and Regenerate doesn't work on him, so just letting him sit still is the only way for me to heal him up. That's why I tend to just take spellcaster promotions for him.

 

[Feyd Rautha]

Yvain for me is the perfect homeland defender. At least when I play the elves...

I don't send him out because of his valuable spellcasting and inherent bonuses in the ancient forests that surround my lands (when I play FOL that is). With Woodsman II he is +160 to attack and defense in ancient forests and since I generally have two or more sources of nature mana that's a 21 before combat I, enchantments, and other issues are taken into account. Generally though keeping him close to home is a good idea because of his access to Life III and Nature III. No real use for those out in the field and him having them keeps me from having to bother with it on one of my few Archmages.

Now, here's a question, if I have 4 nature and life nodes does he start with those attached or is that only arcane units?

If he can start with them off the bat then it's Woodsman I & II followed up with Mobility, Combat I - III, and Drill I - IV like above. Remove the drills if I can't auto upgrade him with the spells.

If the enemy is dumb enough to send in stack after stack to be crushed by him then go all the way to Combat V, Heroic Attack/Defense, and Command IV. On a ancient forest hill with treetop defense and all the drills and combats purchased, he's a 54 to defend (two nature mana from palace and shrine) with six first strikes and the option of a 7.2 point buff to defense for every additional nature node you create for the purpose of making him even more powerful. (Sadly with two nature mana he's "only" a 39 with six first strikes when attacking into an ancient forest [not counting the opponent's defensive bonuses for ancient forest and fortification]) Either way I'm happy to throw Gilden at the offending stack over and over again because Yvain can just bring him back the next turn