Incentives to conquer city-states

[black213]

The only instances where I seek to conquer city-states are when they're allies of an enemy especially when their location is convenient, and/or when doing so is more feasible than influencing them, and/or when dealing with diplo runaways.
Outside of that I always view them as either potential ally targets, tributaries/kill farms or ignored, depending on various factors. That's just my take on it though.

Thalassicus' old mod Communitas had introduced flat sums of yields (type depending on CS type) for conquering city-states. Should this or some other form of incentive be brought to VP, or are you fine with the way things are now?

 

[Stalker0]

Should this or some other form of incentive be brought to VP, or are you fine with the way things are now?

Things are fine as is. Many civs get incentives for conquest (especially the authority tree), and CS are much easier to take out than full war with a civ.

 

[Grassland Farm]

They're usually in good city spots and have a luxury each, often unlocking a monopoly. They're easier prey than major civs, and yet they yield rewards for kills and conquest for Authority civs.

They're good enough preys IMO.

 

[Hinin]

If attacking City-States had heavier diplomatic repercussions (impossibility to make peace for a number of turns, possibility for the protector of a CS to declare war more easily etc), then having specific bonuses linked to the type of CS conquered (and not only for Merchantile CS with their unique Luxury Resources) would be interesting. As it stands now, however, I'm not for it.

I was the one who voted yes mostly to show there are interesting things to do here: I think CStates should be more militarily protectable for major civ, but should also have a bigger role (a bit more troops, more uniqueness for each class).
=> I'm not thinking about unique bonus per CS (there is already a modmod for that), but unique bonuses per CS class.
Ex. : Religious CS, once converted to a major religion, would actively promote this religion (=> increase pressure or spawn missionaries). Also, one free Holy Site would be present in each religious CS territory.

As I said, this would only make sense if attacking CS would carry more risks, so that's only brainstorming at this point.

 

[Zuizgond]

I think there should be more incentive NOT to conquer them.

 

[Hinin]

I think there should be more incentive NOT to conquer them.

Well, as I said, as they are now, I would indeed be for making it more punishing to declare war on CS.

 

[Bad_At_Diplomacy]

I play with the Unique City States mod (the suzerainty concept), so I rarely outright conquer them, often that 'ally bonus' is worth having (plus the flat yields and ability to field an army of course)

 

[Bromar1]

Austrian marriages can be really hard to overcome without war

 

[Bryan317]

They are too easy to take already. You can make infinite war with no war weariness so you can even take your time, farming XP.

 

[Grassland Farm]

The only instances where I seek to conquer city-states are when they're allies of an enemy especially when their location is convenient, and/or when doing so is more feasible than influencing them, and/or when dealing with diplo runaways.
Outside of that I always view them as either potential ally targets, tributaries/kill farms or ignored, depending on various factors. That's just my take on it though.

Thalassicus' old mod Communitas had introduced flat sums of yields (type depending on CS type) for conquering city-states. Should this or some other form of incentive be brought to VP, or are you fine with the way things are now?

Oh also to add on to my post, I'd like to suggest the following:

I used to also never really wage war on city states aggressively (even when Authority!) until I played Denmark for the first time. I spawned very close to a city state, and when I built my first Runestone I was curious to see if pillaging the CS' improvements would count for the Runestone, and roughly how much yields I could expect.

And, well, that changed my mind quite a bit. You get good yields, you can steal workers, you basically get no diplomatic repercussions in the early game (especially if you haven't met other civs at all!)... What's there to not love? Put your viking pants on.

 

[looorg]

As Zuizgond mentioned you really need more incentives to keep them around for most of the games, to liberate them and keep them safe. I can't even recall a game that didn't eventually end with the decimation of the city-states either by myself or the AI. As it is now they are more like some kind of little loot-pinatas ready to be busted open.

 

[Bryan317]

Oh also to add on to my post, I'd like to suggest the following:

I used to also never really wage war on city states aggressively (even when Authority!) until I played Denmark for the first time. I spawned very close to a city state, and when I built my first Runestone I was curious to see if pillaging the CS' improvements would count for the Runestone, and roughly how much yields I could expect.

And, well, that changed my mind quite a bit. You get good yields, you can steal workers, you basically get no diplomatic repercussions in the early game (especially if you haven't met other civs at all!)... What's there to not love? Put your viking pants on.

Yikes I didn't know this, as if Logistics promotion wasn't enough in Ancient times. I mean once you know these things you can't unknow them lol You have to go out of your way not to exploit them. I would say any bonus such as this should not be allowed through a city-state. However that may be easier said than done. For instance with Rome and my coliseums...

 

[azum4roll]

Gaining XP past cap on CS is already classified as a bug.

 

[tommytoxen]

the only time i war with city states is to install a puppet government to put them under my sphere of influence once WC has been unlocked

 

[General_Drax]

They are already easy and since AIs learnt how to make embassies first.

Either they are my allies or they are dead.

 

[azum4roll]

the only time i war with city states is to install a puppet government to put them under my sphere of influence once WC has been unlocked

That's a modmod, so that means you would never war CS normally...

 

[tommytoxen]

That's a modmod, so that means you would never war CS normally...

haha honestly i have so many modmods i completely forget what comes vanilla or not. but yeah, pretty much. i'm usually the one liberating them

 

[andersw]

Dont think so.
If you are a warmonger, even more so with hero worship, the rewards are quite nice.
But I mostly take them out when AI have control and they are next to me or an AI Im attacking.

 

[Bryan317]

Gaining XP past cap on CS is already classified as a bug.

First I've heard of this. I understand the units stop granting it. But it's the city itself that will continue to grant XP.

 

[looorg]

City-state units are basically barbarians as I recall it and stop granting XP after lv2 or something such. Attacking the city is another matter and if you have some ability to gain xp from other sources that might also work.

That said the incentive to take them out is far greater then the incentive to keep them around. After all once you have started all the city-states become afraid and your resting point is lowered or something such. There is no turning back on that as I recall it so once you go you are committed. Most of them have a unique luxury that can only be gained from the city state. It is placed under the city so if you play a version of the game that allows you to get rid of the city-states from the map they'll be there to improve if you will. So what is the incentive to keep them around really except trying to be nice? The yields they provide is usually not safe or significant enough and you can't really depend on it since you can't guarantee they'll remain your ally or friend.

My main problem with them is that rarely plonk down the city in a space I would have chosen considering their terrain. That is usually why I "spare" them, their cities are in locations that are just indefensible, mostly from the sea, if you can't somehow surround them with other better cities.