[Vote] (6-70) Add New City-States When Major Civs Are Absent Ingame

[Hinin]

Current: There are currently 58 City-States distributed between the five types :
- Religious: 8
- Cultural: 14
- Maritime: 14
- Mercantile: 14
- Militaristic: 8

Proposal: Add 42 new City-States based on the history of Major Civs (either old names of their Capital city, capital cities of powers in the same region or the same cultural family; also "first settlements" in some cases). These City-States would use the MajorBlocksMinor table recently introduced to not be present when their associated major civ is part of a game. Here is the list:
- America: Salem (Religious)
- Arabia: Raqmu (Religious)
- Assyria: Assur (Militaristic)
- Austria: Enns (Religious)
- Aztecs: Aztlan (Militaristic)
- Babylon: Nippur (Religious)
- Brazil: Rio de Janeiro (Maritime)
- Byzantium: Pamphylia Perge (Maritime)
- Carthage: Utica (Mercantile)
- Celts: Aburnethige Abernethy (Religious)
- China: Fenghao Shanghai (Religious)
- Denmark: Heidabir (Mercantile)
- Egypt: Shedet (Religious)
- England: Engel Winchester (Militaristic)
- Ethiopia: Aksum (Religious)
- France: Lutetia (Mercantile)
- Germany: Brennaburg Brandenburg (Militaristic)
- Greece: Argos (Militaristic)
- Huns: Longcheng (Militaristic)
- Incas: Huari (Religious)
- India: Harappa (Mercantile)
- Indonesia: Trowulan (Maritime)
- Iroquois: Onondaga (Religious)
- Japan: Yamatai (Cultured)
- Korea: Wanggeom (Cultured)
- Maya: Holmul (Cultured)
- Mongolia: Bairin Zuunmod (Militaristic)
- Morocco: Msoura (Religious)
- Netherlands: Dorestat Dorestad (Maritime)
- Ottomans: Sogut (Militaristic)
- Persia: Ecbatana (Cultured)
- Poland: Veligrad (Mercantile)
- Polynesia: Pago Pago (Maritime)
- Portugal: Spain #2: Oviedo (Cultured)
- Rome: Palatium (Militaristic)
- Russia: Novgorod (Mercantile)
- Shoshone: N/A => Like the Huns or the Mongols, the Shoshones were primarily a nomadic culture. However, there are no clear associated powers that could be used instead while not going very far from this civ (contrary to the Huns with the Xiongnu or the Mongols with the Khitans), so I decided to left this one out.
- Siam: Ban Chiang (Militaristic)
- Songhai: Jenne Djenne (Religious)
- Spain: Okilis (Militaristic)
- Sweden: Sigtuna (Cultured)
- Venice: Eraclea (Maritime)
- Zulus: Kwa-Bulawayo (Militaristic)

With these added, the number of City-States for each type would become 20, and the total number 100.

Rationale: With recent additions to the code of the mod, it is today possible to balance City-State numbers to allow better repartition. The current number of City-States in each category however doesn't reflect this possibility. One way to fill the gaps and increase the overall variety of CStates in the game is using the MajorBlocksMinor table to fill the list with "minor" versions of major civs.

I am of course open to any suggestion for some changes (for example Jenne for Songhai or Onondage for the Iroquois could be replaced).

Host Notes On Modifications During Implementation:
1. Aburnethige was renamed to Abernethy and Dorestat was renamed to Dorestad on the advice of my Foreign Advisor. Jenne was renamed to Djenne because it's referred to as Djenne in other places ingame already (Great Mosque of Djenne, Civilopedia).

2. There is no settlement named Engel. I substituted Winchester as a Militaristic city for England.

3. Pamphylia refers to a region, not a singular city. I substituted Perge, the capital of the Pamphylia region.

4. Similarly, Bairin refers to a region, not a singular city. I substituted Zuunmod, a city which saw a lot of military conflict in the 17th century (Battle of Jao Modo) that was a turning point in Mongolian history.

5. Fenghao was too minor and difficult to find historical information on. Shanghai was chosen instead, as a city with notable Buddhist influence in Chinese history.

6. "Brennaburg" seems to be a fusion of Brenna and Brandenburg, which both refer to the same city. I changed it to Brandenburg as that one is ingame, and it's kind of memetic considering German history to have Brandenburg be a sovereign nation.

7. Veligrad is not historically associated with Poland. I kept it in, but didn't add it to the MajorBlocksMinor table for Poland, and I gave it a custom color.

8. Oviedo is on Spain's city list, so I added it to the MajorBlocksMinor table for Spain, not Portugal. As the capital of the Kingdom of Asturias, Oviedo is more culturally associated with Portugal than Spain, so it's an understandable error to make. I also gave this one a custom color.

 

[Recursive]

A note for sponsors, there are difficulties with playing the correct trait sound for extra City-States. It may need to be added as a pseudo-DLC in the VPUI folder, or some other workaround. For this reason I'm marking the proposal as complex.

 

[adan_eslavo]

Please, no... I do what I can to make new City-States compatible with modmods, having art, and ideas for abilities. And this is only made for the sake of addition...

 

[Recursive]

Please, no... I do what I can to make new City-States compatible with modmods, having art, and ideas for abilities. And this is only made for the sake of addition...

I'll add an Enabled column or something, relax.

 

[Recursive]

Sponsored.

 

[N.Core]

Oh wow, this proposal actually requires an additional file that has to load in a pseudo-DLC manner because the new CS audio can't be changed/added through the database.
I'm not sure if we want to go that way, I don't even know how to do it without replacing the vanilla file. We have the VPUI DLC folder though, I wonder if we can use that folder for this thing.

 

[Recursive]

Oh wow, this proposal actually requires an additional file that has to load in a pseudo-DLC manner because the new CS audio can't be changed/added through the database.
I'm not sure if we want to go that way, I don't even know how to do it without replacing the vanilla file. We have the VPUI DLC folder though, I wonder if we can use that folder for this thing.

That is my plan, but I'm not 100% sure whether I'll be able to pull it off. Will try though.

 

[adan_eslavo]

Oh wow, this proposal actually requires an additional file that has to load in a pseudo-DLC manner because the new CS audio can't be changed/added through the database.
I'm not sure if we want to go that way, I don't even know how to do it without replacing the vanilla file. We have the VPUI DLC folder though, I wonder if we can use that folder for this thing.

Which requires a composer, because each original City-State has its own audio file.

 

[Recursive]

Which requires a composer, because each original City-State has its own audio file.

No, I can just reuse audio files from other City-States.

 

[N.Core]

Which requires a composer, because each original City-State has its own audio file.

But the audio is only unique to each CS type, right? Not for each CS?

 

[adan_eslavo]

But the audio is only unique to each CS type, right? Not for each CS?

Each CS. But traits have common "intro". F.e. for the Mercantile ones there is kind of "coin" sound. But each one has separate track.
This can be interesting experience when you "start hearing the sounds" you usually ignore.

 

[N.Core]

Ah, I never noticed that. But I mean the sound, it feels like each CS type has the same audio playing even with a different name entry.

 

[adan_eslavo]

Ah, I never noticed that. But I mean the sound, it feels like each CS type has the same audio playing even with a different name entry.

Because of the intro.

 

[azum4roll]

Oh wow, this proposal actually requires an additional file that has to load in a pseudo-DLC manner because the new CS audio can't be changed/added through the database.
I'm not sure if we want to go that way, I don't even know how to do it without replacing the vanilla file. We have the VPUI DLC folder though, I wonder if we can use that folder for this thing.

Based on farm_types.xml, it isn't necessary to be in DLC. I welcome more files in the Core Changes folder. The one file is pretty lonely in there.

 

[N.Core]

Based on farm_types.xml, it isn't necessary to be in DLC. I welcome more files in the Core Changes folder. The one file is pretty lonely in there.

It is necessary actually, as @adan_eslavo has tried this before.

 

[adan_eslavo]

It is necessary actually, as @adan_eslavo has tried this before.

File is still in UCS ready to make a replacement. Anyone can try it having base one untouched. I tried and it didn't work.

 

[dostillevi]

A note that this proposal gives secret information to the player about which civs aren't in the game, if they meet one of these city-states.

 

[azum4roll]

And the Hunnic city names already give information about which civs ARE in the game.

 

[Tekamthi]

I have long considered 43-civ to be vp's main event, so really I don't anticipate seeing much of this change. Sounds interesting though

On the topic of Iroquois, it's not a problem to stick with onondaga by any means, but if the intent is to represent the "other" Iroquois cultures, there are a number of other choices that come to mind, however for the sake of brevity I'll just pick one, on the basis that I have not seen it represented anywhere else, in any other mod etc: the Susquehannock were an Iroquoian culture that was a distinct polity from the 5/6 nations Iroquois represented in the game. They were eventually absorbed by the game's Iroquois, but largely due to interactions with European militias, they were once quite a prominent group and largely a victim of circumstance. Tracking down settlement names from pre-contact times is nigh impossible, but in early colonial era they became known for a settlement, "Conestoga". It never really achieved status as a great city of the world or anything like that, but neither did onondaga really, we're talking a "what if" alternate universe...

 

[pineappledan]

This is going to be a monumental task w.r.t. Writing out 42 new pedia entries. I think that’s the biggest part.

If you’ve ever bothered to look at the pedia entries for individual CS they are quite detailed and informative. IMO they are generally of higher quality than the major civ pedia entries.