Inflation - the unnecessary fudge factor

[Sparrowhawk]

Does it seem odd (and annoying) to anyone else here that Civ IV has a fudge factor added in to the economics? It's described in the Civilopedia as a cost that has no source, and cannot be avoided or mitigated. Instead, it simply increases as the game goes on.

I've never been a hard-core micromanager in any of the Civ games, but I certainly like to know that the various factors governing the game have behaviour that is linked to in-game performance. For example, in Civ III, while I didn't like corruption, I knew it's causes and could adjust strategy to mitigate the effects.

To me, it seems like it's an arbitrary factor included to slightly increase the difficulty of the game. This is a completely inelegant solution, as such fudge factors usually are - they imply a failure of the mechanics of the game. I can't see why it is necessary at all. Wouldn't it be simpler to move up a difficulty level if the current one is too easy?

Thoughts?

PS when someone figures out how to get rid of it, could you please post a solution? thanks!

 

[KrikkitTwo]

I very much agree. Although when the code is released, we will be able to no much more precisely what are the contributing factors to Inflation (as well as all sorts of other things)

 

[snarko]

I assume it's possible by setting iInflationPercent in GameSpeedInfo.xml to 0. Note that you'll need to do this for all three settings. Also note that if you set it too high like I did once you cannot get a positive income

 

[Dom Pedro II]

The Inflation is probably there because otherwise you'll never need to worry about money... and if you don't need to worry about money, then there's not much of a challenge.

 

[gakkun]

well in real life increased military spending increases inflation. *is revising for economics exam*

 

[JavalTigar]

I wonder if its like Knights of Honor. As your treasury increases the the rate increases. I haven't tested this but it makes sense.

 

[Shadowlord]

Personally, I'd love to see a mod which made inflation vary based on conditions in your empire, your civics, etc. There's plenty of info about inflation at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inflation for anyone interested, we just need a way to modify the inflation rate during the game.

Doesn't look like there's any way to do that yet, though. Maybe the SDK will make it possible (though I have no idea what's going to be in the SDK, so maybe it won't either).

 

[Inflammatory]

I agree with the original post whole-heartedly. I mean, gimme something tangible for for crying out loud! Other games, such as Europa Universalis II, incorporates inflation, and even if they do so in a somewhat flawed way the inflation is at least caused/managed by factors within the frame of options available to the player. The way Civ4 handles inflation only makes you wonder why on earth it's even there in the first place. Like someone said: If you have an easy time making money without inflation, you just move up a difficulty level.

 

[Dagoth Ur]

EU2 had a good inflation system- it lets you mint as much money as you wanted, but the more you did the most things began to cost.

 

[Inflammatory]

That is indeed the fundamental base cause for inflation, but EU2 represents the phenomenon in a very simplified way to allow for non-economy students to understand this very important aspect of gameplay too.

 

[ainwood]

Sounds like a game-balance issue to me. Have a look at how much inflation varuies throughout the game - late game, with a strong economy you can be researching at 100% and still be rolling in the money. Take away inflation, and the gold would be embarrasing.

 

[Harbringer]

I dont like inflation either, it bugs me when theres a deduction factor I have absolutely no control over.

 

[kandalf]

I assume it's possible by setting iInflationPercent in GameSpeedInfo.xml to 0. Note that you'll need to do this for all three settings. Also note that if you set it too high like I did once you cannot get a positive income

What if you changed the schema to allow -1 and used -1? Would you get an error?

 

[Sparrowhawk]

I wonder if its like Knights of Honor. As your treasury increases the the rate increases. I haven't tested this but it makes sense.

It's not - and that's really my complaint. In Civ IV, inflation is without a real cause - totally beyond the control of the player. I quite like the Knights of Honour modelling, as simplified as it is, and I have no philosophical problem with the game design including inflation. As ainwood notes, it's probably necessary to have something to help the balance. To me, that means increasing the difficulty level that you're playing on, but inflation is another way of fixing that. If it could be run in Civ IV as it is in KoH, I would have no complaints.

 

[Mewtarthio]

I think inflation is mainly included for gold rushing purposes. Since you make more money as time goes on, inflation is added to ensure that you don't end up with the ability to rush-build every wonder in the game in one turn.

 

[Abacus]

I don't like the Civ model for inflation at all.

In reality, inflation is different from hyperinflation (which occurs when governments with no other way to motivate their population simply mint money, quickly making their currency worthless). Something like hyperinflation also occurred when the Spanish imported more gold (their currency) from the New World without creating more real value to spend that gold on.

Modern, slow inflation is a deliberate policy encouraged by governments because it makes workers feel better (getting raises is nice), encourages consumption, and prevents people from hoarding money in anticipation of lower prices tomorrow.

But tax revenues rise along with wages and prices, so inflation doesn't "eat" a portion of government spending. There's no line item in the federal budget of the U.S, and I doubt for any country, for "inflation". (Except for the portion of the interest on the national debt that covers inflation, but loans don't exist in the Civ world.)

 

[Cave Troll]

In reguards to inflation: this is how you can addjust it
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=134109

<iInflationPercent></iInflationPercent> The rate at which upkeep increases.
<iInflationOffset></iInflationOffset> How long before upkeep increases.

modify these numbers to change the inflation. Note: the larger the number the slower the inflation progresses.

 

[Mason11987]

mew you can't rush build any wonder with money, no matter how much you have.

 

[sturmtrupp]

I agree with the original post whole-heartedly. I mean, gimme something tangible for for crying out loud! Other games, such as Europa Universalis II, incorporates inflation, and even if they do so in a somewhat flawed way the inflation is at least caused/managed by factors within the frame of options available to the player. The way Civ4 handles inflation only makes you wonder why on earth it's even there in the first place. Like someone said: If you have an easy time making money without inflation, you just move up a difficulty level.

Is there an empire building game that did inflation better?

 

[jeffelammar]

I'm going to have to agree completely.

I hate having an arbitrary amount taken away in a way that I cannot control in any way.

One of the major things we heard leading up to Civ4 was "get rid of things that are not fun".

Apparently they also felt they had to add new ones.

Like I said before, this wouldn't be an issue if I had some control over it.