Sir 37mm
Chieftain
First off, I want you to know that I absolutely love Revolution & it is the ONLY way I've played Civ4 for at least a couple of years now* but (and there just has to be a 'but' doesn't there) whilst Vanilla Civilization has made taking over nations & keeping a civilization together far too easy I think you might have gone a little too far the other way.
At the moment I have several issues with the mod...
(i) It seems to me that virtually all conquests lead to major, full blown insurgencies
(ii) It also seems to me that virtually every insurgency is some kind of uber-Vietnam from hell which can last centuries
(iii) Overwhelming military superiority appears to have no effect on the chance of rebellions happening nor the effects of such rebellions (i.e. Every unit in a city is always heavily damaged no matter what).
(iv) An incredible example of this occurred recently when after conquering two nearby Sumerian cities I was forced to flood the area with HORDES of troops, I eventually entirely surrounded both cities with rings of fortified defending troops. RESULT? Future revolts started to spawn INSIDE cities & automatically drive the defenders out of them!
(v) There appears to be no way to punish or scare revolting/potentially revolting cities... not even if you're a theocratic, nationalistic police state (with nukes & 'daddy issues')
(vi) As soon (i.e. the very INSTANT) you acquire new technology the rebels have that same tech... often before you yourself have even built or upgraded any such units. In other words researching new techs can lead to short term military inferiority!
(vii) The size of cities appears to have no real effect on their chance of rebellion or the results of such rebellions... a size 1 city will readily revolt even when occupied by a 'large garrison' & will, of course, always manage to heavily damage all defending troops if they do so.
I believe that, in its present state, if you were to recreate WW1 with your mod it would go a little bit like this...
Germany invades Belgium & Northern France but gets racked by endless rebellions, finally in 1918 the Belgian & French Freedom fighters successfully drive out the Hun.
And WW2?
Germany successfully conquers Poland but cannot hold onto any of the Polish cities... France & Britain finally get around to invading a war weary German Nation in 1944.
Perhaps there needs to be a breakdown of the various kinds of 'rebellion' that the mod purports to support. This is just a quick selection of ideas/notes but it appears that revolutions, coups, civil wars, insurgencies & 'le resistance' are all mixed up when they're in fact very different things.
Civil wars are usually about some religious/distance issue (Confederate states vs United States)
Coups are usually about cash/power. Poor nations or Monarchies/Police states are particularly suspect to these... (the entire Medieval period )
Revolutions are usually about some civic change (French revolution: Monarchy to Police state & back again)
Insurgencies are usually caused by a 'former' culture (Iberians & Rome?)
'le resistance' are usually of little real military consequence perhaps a free spy for enemy nations, public discord in a nation with free speech or some such (Ghandi & the British)
Of course you could get a mix of all of these things ('English' Civil War for instance) but each rebellion would results in different effects so perhaps....
Insurgencies: 'rebellions' by militarily overwhelmed nations lead to the creation of numerous spies & saboteurs (counter insurgency would then be a war between spies peppered with random acts of annoying sabotage... much more realistic?) or/and the creation of fortified bases in inhospitable terrain.
In short my biggest gripe with the mod is that it seems that every nation in a game of CivRev IS made of Fremen and not that it could be made of Fremen.
I realise many of the things that I perceive as problems may in fact be game engine issues so I certainly don't expect a magic fix but I was wondering if these opinions rang a bell with anyone?
* Top 3 cool things I've done in your mod
(i) Been forced to recreate the static Western front of 1917 (Machine guns & all)... although it was technically the Eastern front on that particular map & occurred in the 1980's but even so it was impressive!
(ii) Fought, with the Vikings, for 1600 years (Classical through to Renaissance) what must have been the most brutal war EVER versus two other civs... a half dozen cities changed hands almost continuously throughout this entire period. You cannot begin to imagine how horrible the scores were on the “past events have ruined our relations” chart.
(iii) Fought & won four concurrent uber-Vietnam's on four different fronts... shortly after these victories (and they were the nearest run thing you ever saw especially the Cortez inspired war on the Eastern continent) I won a domination victory through a worldwide web of Vassal States
At the moment I have several issues with the mod...
(i) It seems to me that virtually all conquests lead to major, full blown insurgencies
(ii) It also seems to me that virtually every insurgency is some kind of uber-Vietnam from hell which can last centuries
(iii) Overwhelming military superiority appears to have no effect on the chance of rebellions happening nor the effects of such rebellions (i.e. Every unit in a city is always heavily damaged no matter what).
(iv) An incredible example of this occurred recently when after conquering two nearby Sumerian cities I was forced to flood the area with HORDES of troops, I eventually entirely surrounded both cities with rings of fortified defending troops. RESULT? Future revolts started to spawn INSIDE cities & automatically drive the defenders out of them!
(v) There appears to be no way to punish or scare revolting/potentially revolting cities... not even if you're a theocratic, nationalistic police state (with nukes & 'daddy issues')
(vi) As soon (i.e. the very INSTANT) you acquire new technology the rebels have that same tech... often before you yourself have even built or upgraded any such units. In other words researching new techs can lead to short term military inferiority!
(vii) The size of cities appears to have no real effect on their chance of rebellion or the results of such rebellions... a size 1 city will readily revolt even when occupied by a 'large garrison' & will, of course, always manage to heavily damage all defending troops if they do so.
I believe that, in its present state, if you were to recreate WW1 with your mod it would go a little bit like this...
Germany invades Belgium & Northern France but gets racked by endless rebellions, finally in 1918 the Belgian & French Freedom fighters successfully drive out the Hun.
And WW2?
Germany successfully conquers Poland but cannot hold onto any of the Polish cities... France & Britain finally get around to invading a war weary German Nation in 1944.
Perhaps there needs to be a breakdown of the various kinds of 'rebellion' that the mod purports to support. This is just a quick selection of ideas/notes but it appears that revolutions, coups, civil wars, insurgencies & 'le resistance' are all mixed up when they're in fact very different things.
Civil wars are usually about some religious/distance issue (Confederate states vs United States)
Coups are usually about cash/power. Poor nations or Monarchies/Police states are particularly suspect to these... (the entire Medieval period )
Revolutions are usually about some civic change (French revolution: Monarchy to Police state & back again)
Insurgencies are usually caused by a 'former' culture (Iberians & Rome?)
'le resistance' are usually of little real military consequence perhaps a free spy for enemy nations, public discord in a nation with free speech or some such (Ghandi & the British)
Of course you could get a mix of all of these things ('English' Civil War for instance) but each rebellion would results in different effects so perhaps....
Insurgencies: 'rebellions' by militarily overwhelmed nations lead to the creation of numerous spies & saboteurs (counter insurgency would then be a war between spies peppered with random acts of annoying sabotage... much more realistic?) or/and the creation of fortified bases in inhospitable terrain.
In short my biggest gripe with the mod is that it seems that every nation in a game of CivRev IS made of Fremen and not that it could be made of Fremen.
I realise many of the things that I perceive as problems may in fact be game engine issues so I certainly don't expect a magic fix but I was wondering if these opinions rang a bell with anyone?
* Top 3 cool things I've done in your mod
(i) Been forced to recreate the static Western front of 1917 (Machine guns & all)... although it was technically the Eastern front on that particular map & occurred in the 1980's but even so it was impressive!
(ii) Fought, with the Vikings, for 1600 years (Classical through to Renaissance) what must have been the most brutal war EVER versus two other civs... a half dozen cities changed hands almost continuously throughout this entire period. You cannot begin to imagine how horrible the scores were on the “past events have ruined our relations” chart.
(iii) Fought & won four concurrent uber-Vietnam's on four different fronts... shortly after these victories (and they were the nearest run thing you ever saw especially the Cortez inspired war on the Eastern continent) I won a domination victory through a worldwide web of Vassal States
