Is god of expanse the best (AI) pantheon?

[andersw]

Or is it just coded to be first pick for 9/10 AIs?
If its that good should it be nerfed or should the coding of AI pantheon choices be different?

Venting because I wanted to play Russia with it, and AI taking god of expanse first 5/5 ... and counting.
I cant beat it even with stonehenge (I havent fished for extreme starts tho), best result was missing it with one turn.

Sure I can play russia without it and play india or aztects and be almost sure to get it, but Im not sure its that good as india or aztects ... or is it?
Maybe it actually IS THE BEST PANTHEON?
Normally I'd rate a pantheon providing culture a bit higher.
If its not THE BEST, why is it coded for AI's to "always" take it first?

Is there anyone who regularly makes good use of it and feel its VERY strong as non russia?

 

[ElliotS]

The AI doesn't always pick it first... unless you're Russia. ;P

 

[andersw]

The AI doesn't always pick it first... unless you're Russia. ;P

I did get it on like 7th try, but my attempts were on King so its not like its a super high difficulty either.
I know spain, aztecs and ethiopia sniped me the rest unknown.

Game ran out of proportions.
God of expanse was nice but King was too low for me when things fell into place.
Maybe I shouldnt have abused 3x mercantile citystates to tribute for hammers -> Council of Elders so the game went a bit bonkers (a lot of wonders were built).
Guess I'll test it again as India maybe or as russia on emperor.

 

[LifeOfBrian]

Playing on Deity, I'd usually have to rush Stonehenge to grab it, but even then it's hard to found with it, so I prefer picking other pantheons.

 

[Heinz_Guderian]

Would it be hard to found with even with russia on deity do you think?

Playing on Deity, I'd usually have to rush Stonehenge to grab it, but even then it's hard to found with it, so I prefer picking other pantheons.

 

[LifeOfBrian]

Heinz, I think it would work if you go Tradition and invest heavily in Shrines and Monuments. The problem is that I think Russia is much better as Authority or Progress than Tradition (you want to grab more land as Russia to get more out of your UA and you want to be more aggressive to make use of the combat bonuses from strategic monopolies from horses and iron (and later other strategic resources) which you'll get because of the UA), so I wouldn't want to pick (peaceful) Tradition just for the sake of God of Expanse. If we were tweaking God of Expanse, I'd lower the faith bonus a bit and instead give monuments 1 faith (and give 2 GAP or 2 gold to monuments in the God of all creation instead), so that it would be more viable to build monuments first when going with God of Expanse.

Disclaimer: My view of religion on Deity is a bit skewed because I'll always select at least 5 strong civs for religion (usually Carthage, Arabia, Poland, Russia and the Maya or Siam), with also two strong warring civs (usually two Songhai, Sweden, Mongolia or the Zulu) of which one will select God of war (meaning they'll get lot of faith), so I'm having to work really hard at founding, so for example I'll always rush shrines. I imagine God of expanse works even without Russia or Tradition if you get AIs that aren't so good at founding, for example if you get a game with the likes of Portugal, Iroqouis, Korea, Indonesia, England etc.

 

[Heinz_Guderian]

Yeah okay. My gut feeling is that it would work with authority/progress russia as well if I played with random AIs, as long as the distribution isn't heavily skewed towards religious civs.

 

[ElliotS]

More seriously the biggest problem is running out of tiles to claim. When that happens the fun times stop. It can happen extremely fast too if you get stonehenge and do a authority/tradition mix.

 

[looorg]

The mileage may vary from civ to civ but it's pretty good as an initial pantheon but it stops being useful after a while, which could be quite soon depending on map size etc. But it's an excellent starter pantheon. That said once the settling phase of the game is over and things are more solidified then it becomes utterly useless. It's also very set-and-forget, as in you pick it and then you don't really have to do anything except build some culture and watch the yields drop in.

I don't really value it highly. As Russia, and a few others, it's great for that mega boost to start with but beyond that it does nothing for you -- except then as mentioned over and over again a great starter.

So that the AI pick it is probably just that -- great starter, it's very non-geography specific and you don't have to really do anything (no improvements, luxuries, buildings etc) to get it to work for you.

 

[youngsteve]

I am only playing on Prince, so can't really compare, but always get Stonehenge & the first pantheon, but then I never use lucky ruins which destabilise the game.

 

[Heinz_Guderian]

Used it now with Mongolia to combo with their unique granary and the authority policy, and it isn't hard to found with it even on deity as mongolia at least. I found it pretty underwhelming though, and I struggled with happiness from very early on. Not sure it would have been different with another pantheon, but the extra yields they give might have helped a bit.

 

[LifeOfBrian]

Heinz, what are the pantheons you're usually selecting that you find helpful with early happiness?

 

[Heinz_Guderian]

Honestly I dont know if that's what's the difference, I was just noticing struggling with happiness earlier than I usually do. Might have been that other civs were just producing a lot more yields than I was, or that I overextended or something I feel like I dont have the same kind of grasp around which pantheons are super strong as other people on here anyway tbh. Also I am baffled how people remember the names of each of them, but I guess my memory is getting bad at 30 already

 

[LifeOfBrian]

Hehe @ memory getting bad Hmm, it's been a while since I picked God of expanse, so I'm afraid I can't help you diagnose the problem :/