Is the finisher of Patronge useful

[myclan]

I play Alex/Immortal/Continents/Standard Speed, and want to know:

Is the finisher of Patronge useful? How often will a GP be gifted? Will it increase the cost of future GP? Will it worth delaying Rationalism a bit?

Thanks

 

[joshua43214]

Not useful
You get random GP's, and yes they delay the others - they are not "free."

Nothing is worth delaying rationalism for. You should not be that far into Patronage before renaissance in most games on Immortal, even being 3 deep into patronage is dicey by renaissance

 

[arand86]

Patronage opener+Philanthropy+Scholasticism+Cultural diplomacy is as far as I'll normally descend in patronage, even as Poland. Don't dig out the bottom of the tree, it's not worth it.

Rationalism first is almost always worth it.

 

[Brutha2]

This saddens me; I always want to try something different to rationalism, but there's nothing else that is viable. The Great People should at least be genuinely free.

 

[Vitruvius]

U can get merchant of venice from that. So finish it for the lolz.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk

 

[FeiLing]

Well if get scientists or engineers - cool. GWAMs? Also fine. GGs and GAd as well as GPr? Well all okay, since they don't raise the normal GPs cost. Only troublesome is if you get a GM, but the Odds are kinda in your favor. And there's always the possibility of MoVs and Khans too.
It's definitely not as awful as people make it seem, the problem is the 2 policies to get it done are both useless.
It also becomes more interesting if you are the Maya or Sweden.
But as others have pointed out, it's not worth delaying rationalism or important ideology tenets.

 

[cpm4001]

Unlike most others in this thread, I do advise finishing Patronage. Yes, you shouldn't delay Rationalism, but opening Rationalism and then finishing Patronage usually works well. The exception is if you play Sweden - finish Patronage ASAP so you can start regifting those GPs to your City-State allies.

 

[arand86]

Merchant confederacy even with the 100% buff after fall patch is awful. Consulates also is nerfed with the nerf of the PtP, so it's a situational policy now imo.

 

[Johnpecan]

Not useful
You get random GP's, and yes they delay the others - they are not "free."

Yea, I'm wondering if that's an oversight or intended. If it did not delay the others, it could be quite useful but in it's current state it's just bad.

 

[Brutha2]

I don't feel the other policies are completely useless. In my current game (emperor), I have +14 happiness from luxury gifts, and I have found that city state trade routes were actually viable in the renaissance. This is situational, but I was getting more gold from sea trade routes than most civilization trade routes until refridgeration.

Also, even if a free GWAM delays the next one, it's still useful; it's just problematic when you don't want merchants or engineers.

 

[jogi]

In my last game I was gifted a Great Merchant of Venice by a CS. I don't know what the chances of that happening on a regular basis are, though.

 

[Brutha2]

I think MoV chances are comparable to the chance of a normal merchant, in my experience at least.

 

[GoStu]

I've gotten MoV's and Khans before. The extra gold from CS trade routes is a bit weak, but better than a slap in the face, particularly if you're using the Freedom tier 3 tenet for extra influence or if you're Germany. You're trading with CS anyways, might as well get some more gold for it.

 

[ViterboKnight]

Answering to the OP:

The number of turns between each gifted GP is:

37 - A + B

where:
- A is the number of CS extra alliances (other than the first one) (this value is maxed to 10).
- B is a random number between 0 and 6.

Also, the number of turns is for STANDARD speed.

 

[Walter R]

I did it once for the hell of it after a Dom victory - total waste of time. It kept giving me Great Admirals and GGs - eh CS's, did you miss the part where I conquered the entire map?! I assumed it was a Dev's little joke against warmongerers...

 

[ViterboKnight]

According to the source code, they might give ANY type of great person, except great prophets. It is random.

 

[Makavcio]

I sometimes open patronage for its long-term bonus and for the wonder. Otherwise I skip it entirely, so I don't even bother with the issue whether completing it is beneficial. Both commerce and art policy tree (forgot the exact name) are way more beneficial, especially if you are going to finish commerce or focus on culture, and there is rationalism looming.

 

[lindsay40k]

Well, it's a roulette wheel, innit? You could get a Khan, you could stop someone's 200-influence ally giving them Chokonu, you could instabuild Sistine Chapel, you could use a Citadel to steal the Great Wall. Alternatively, you could go back to Civ 4's GP pool pollution problem and endlessly get your next GE's or bulbs pushed back by admirals and rock stars.

 

[GoStu]

I do have to agree with the other people in this thread: it would be a LOT better if it didn't push back your other Great People. That mechanic in general needs to be looked at (you shouldn't cringe when a Great Merchant spawns, even if they are a bit weak...), but it really should be free if its the finisher for a tree.

Other concern which is addressed in other parts of this forum is that Rationalism is just too damn good. The opportunity cost of delaying it really hurts everything else.

 

[Barghaest]

Alternatively, you could go back to Civ 4's GP pool pollution problem and endlessly get your next GE's or bulbs pushed back by admirals and rock stars.

The only ones who share a pool are Engineer/Scientist/Merchant. All other GPs are on their own individual pools that have no effect on any other GP (Artists won't increase time til next Musician, for example).